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Giovani Lo Celso

alekaras said:
Not unless we get a creative player in. He's the closest to a Maddison replacement we have. And his injury record isn't as bad as it seems. He's missed an average of 6 games a season across all competitions in the past 3 years. That's actually better than Madders.

So not only would I not get rid of him, I would offer him a new contract. He's on £70K and I doubt you would find anyone in his mould that would demand less than £100K, so it's a no-brainer. The only question would be if he would want to stay on as second fiddle, but with Europe there should be enough starts for him to keep him happy.

He's perfect for Angeball and my gut feeling is that, if no one ponies up significant £££ for him in the summer and/or we can't find a Maddison replacement, we're likely to offer him a new 3-4 year contract.
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Kulu, devine can both play there. We will be adding to the squad in the summer.
 
I keep reading that there is a player in there, but in all time he's been here I can't think of 5 games where he's stood out or made a difference. I appreciate there are players who oil the machine and go unnoticed but he stands out in a lot of games for his weaknesses rather than his strengths. You could say he's been unlucky with injuries but I'm with Napoleon on this.
 
K.D.D.D.D.Soc said:
I keep reading that there is a player in there, but in all time he's been here I can't think of 5 games where he's stood out or made a difference. I appreciate there are players who oil the machine and go unnoticed but he stands out in a lot of games for his weaknesses rather than his strengths. You could say he's been unlucky with injuries but I'm with Napoleon on this.
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Not fair mate, he had a run early in Jose's time I think with us where he was critical to the side, he stood out in two games for Ange already (the one with the two side foot passes to Son), he's a fudging baller when he's on.

The issue is (especially now), he can't seem to get a run of ten games together, which limits his value regardless of how good he is or isn't (opinion). If he can't get fit this season for last run of games, it's a moot point.

With one year left on contract and relatively high wages, he's probably moving on
 
K.D.D.D.D.Soc said:
I keep reading that there is a player in there, but in all time he's been here I can't think of 5 games where he's stood out or made a difference. I appreciate there are players who oil the machine and go unnoticed but he stands out in a lot of games for his weaknesses rather than his strengths. You could say he's been unlucky with injuries but I'm with Napoleon on this.
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Averaging 12 appearances a season for 5 seasons is not just unlucky.
 
Raziel said:
Not fair mate, he had a run early in Jose's time I think with us where he was critical to the side, he stood out in two games for Ange already (the one with the two side foot passes to Son), he's a fudging baller when he's on.

The issue is (especially now), he can't seem to get a run of ten games together, which limits his value regardless of how good he is or isn't (opinion). If he can't get fit this season for last run of games, it's a moot point.

With one year left on contract and relatively high wages, he's probably moving on
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You're just confirming what I wrote, you're a fan and can only think of 2 games and one pass, he's shown he can't get fit enough to get a run of 10 games. We all wanted to see him succeed and push the team on but it's not happened, poor transfer for him and club, time to move him on and take the hit.
 
Raziel said:
Not fair mate, he had a run early in Jose's time I think with us where he was critical to the side, he stood out in two games for Ange already (the one with the two side foot passes to Son), he's a fudging baller when he's on.

The issue is (especially now), he can't seem to get a run of ten games together, which limits his value regardless of how good he is or isn't (opinion). If he can't get fit this season for last run of games, it's a moot point.

With one year left on contract and relatively high wages, he's probably moving on
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Agree with all of that. Definitely a player there in the right system and this system seems quite good for him. But I also think he will most likely go in the summer.
 
Lilbaz said:
Since 19/20 he has missed 62 games through injury.

www.transfermarkt.com

Giovani Lo Celso - Injury history

This is the injury history of Giovani Lo Celso from Real Betis Sevilla. On this page injuries as well as suspensions.
www.transfermarkt.com www.transfermarkt.com
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25 of these were from a long 23-game spell when he joined us and another 2 from Covid. He also did his hammy this year, like pretty much everyone else in the squad, and missed another 5 games. So 30 of the 62 games he missed were from an injury that most players have suffered this year, Covid (which is hardly an injury), and one long spell out.

I'll ask you this: if a player is out for a year and misses 50 games and the next 3 years misses just 4-5 games a season, you could say he missed 30% of games across 4 seasons due to injury. But in the last 3 seasons (assuming a 50 game season) it would be around 9-10%. Which one is a more fair reflection of how injury prone a player is?
 
Danishfurniturelover said:
He would be blocking the pathway of Hall and Devine.
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Devine is 19 and we don't even know what his pathway is. He looks good now, but will he push on from where he is in the next 2-3 years? If he does, then we sell Gio and give Alfie his chance. But what if he turns out to be another Skipp?
 
Such a shame for him, he is a very good player but the injurys keep happening. He is one i would keep though because IF he can stay fit he will get plenty of games.
 
alekaras said:
25 of these were from a long 23-game spell when he joined us and another 2 from Covid. He also did his hammy this year, like pretty much everyone else in the squad, and missed another 5 games. So 30 of the 62 games he missed were from an injury that most players have suffered this year, Covid (which is hardly an injury), and one long spell out.

I'll ask you this: if a player is out for a year and misses 50 games and the next 3 years misses just 4-5 games a season, you could say he missed 30% of games across 4 seasons due to injury. But in the last 3 seasons (assuming a 50 game season) it would be around 9-10%. Which one is a more fair reflection of how injury prone a player is?
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If we applied his history to the rest of the squad we would have been watching the U21 team for the last two seasons. Wake up and smell the coffee he's been next to useless for us, I'll agree he's the best player we have on the injury list, even Steve Hodge and Andy Sinton did better for us.
 
alekaras said:
Devine is 19 and we don't even know what his pathway is. He looks good now, but will he push on from where he is in the next 2-3 years? If he does, then we sell Gio and give Alfie his chance. But what if he turns out to be another Skipp?
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At least we'll get a small fee and save on his wages.
 
K.D.D.D.D.Soc said:
If we applied his history to the rest of the squad we would have been watching the U21 team for the last two seasons. Wake up and smell the coffee he's been next to useless for us, I'll agree he's the best player we have on the injury list, even Steve Hodge and Andy Sinton did better for us.
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A player who has almost 1 goal involvement per 90' (also averages 1 goal involvement per start) is useless? Okaaayyyy

And no, if we applied his injury history to the squad, he'd be out less time than Romero has been. I know you feel like he is often injured, but that's not what the numbers say.
 
alekaras said:
Devine is 19 and we don't even know what his pathway is. He looks good now, but will he push on from where he is in the next 2-3 years? If he does, then we sell Gio and give Alfie his chance. But what if he turns out to be another Skipp?
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If he turns out to be another skipp he will have offered more value to the team then Lo Celso.
 
parklane1 said:
Such a shame for him, he is a very good player but the injurys keep happening. He is one i would keep though because IF he can stay fit he will get plenty of games.
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Last year of his contract, you can almost guarantee he would start more games, get his new contract and revert to type. Same goes for Sessegnon.
 
alekaras said:
A player who has almost 1 goal involvement per 90' (also averages 1 goal involvement per start) is useless? Okaaayyyy

And no, if we applied his injury history to the squad, he'd be out less time than Romero has been. I know you feel like he is often injured, but that's not what the numbers say.
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Would you be happy for the rest of the squad to have his record of injury? Been with us 3 years and made no impact. It's like he's an addict and all his love ones make excuses for him in the hope he'll kick the habit. If everyone's happy for him to stay picking up big money in the hope he'll have a couple of good games it appears they have limited ambitions for the club.
 
alekaras said:
25 of these were from a long 23-game spell when he joined us and another 2 from Covid. He also did his hammy this year, like pretty much everyone else in the squad, and missed another 5 games. So 30 of the 62 games he missed were from an injury that most players have suffered this year, Covid (which is hardly an injury), and one long spell out.

I'll ask you this: if a player is out for a year and misses 50 games and the next 3 years misses just 4-5 games a season, you could say he missed 30% of games across 4 seasons due to injury. But in the last 3 seasons (assuming a 50 game season) it would be around 9-10%. Which one is a more fair reflection of how injury prone a player is?
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I'll ask you this, is he reliable?
 
Lilbaz said:
I'll ask you this, is he reliable?
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From an injury standpoint, I already explained that his injury record is not as bad as people think it is.

As far as his performances are concerned, other than in the first year and a half with Jose, he hasn't really gotten a run of games to show what he can do. And the run of games he did get was playing Jose style football. Then came Conte who didn't want creative players in his team. Only now is he getting a chance to play in a style that brings out the best in him.

People are giving him a bad rap, but fail to consider the circumstances. If he gets a good run of games in this system he can easily average a goal involvement every 2 games, which is a top stat for a #8. This is not a Ndombele situation, who is lazy and will be lazy no matter the system or manager. This is a player that was not suited to our playing style of the past 4 years, but is perfectly suited to our playing style now.
 
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