General Transfer Rumour Discussion Thread

[Gazzasrightboot]

Gazza it is so much more complicated than that. You're making it sound like someone trying to make the money for the weekly shop go further. We have no idea how much money the club has set aside for striker, but it needs to be a realistic amount to make WBA sell. Also with a young player like berahino you've got to consider how much we will make if he helps us win trophies or if he is so good that we sell him on for a massive profit. Taking the cheaper option everything may actually prove to be less cost effective in the long run. From time to time we need to buy the odd player from the A list if we don't want to continue being also rans[/QUOTE]

Very good point, we've sold players in this window at a loss, that adds up over time.

The players that we have sold at a loss have not been ones that we have penny pinched on and dragged to the last moment? We made a loss on Paulinho and Chiriches. Paulinho was an early signing, and Chiriches was a deadline day signing that cannot be realistically seen as a key signing.

 

[Jordinho]

Chelsea are attempting to appease manager Jose Mourinho’s frustration by finalising a deal to sign left-back Baba Rahman and launching a third bid for Everton central defender John Stones.

Rahman is expected to undergo a medical after Chelsea finally agreed an initial fee of £14m, that could rise depending on appearances, with German club Augsburg, while the latest Stones offer is £30m.

Jose Mourinho wanted Baba Rahman's arrival before the start of the season

Although Everton are unlikely to accept £30m for Stones, Chelsea hope the bid will at least open a dialogue aimed at concluding a deal.

Mourinho had wanted his squad finalised by the start of the new Premier League season, but negotiations over Rahman and Stones have proved to be complicated and drawn out.

www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/11795125/Chelsea-try-to-appease-Jose-Mourinho-frustration-with-14m-Baba-Rahman-deal.html

 

[NWND]

Gazza it is so much more complicated than that. You're making it sound like someone trying to make the money for the weekly shop go further. We have no idea how much money the club has set aside for striker, but it needs to be a realistic amount to make WBA sell. Also with a young player like berahino you've got to consider how much we will make if he helps us win trophies or if he is so good that we sell him on for a massive profit. Taking the cheaper option everything may actually prove to be less cost effective in the long run. From time to time we need to buy the odd player from the A list if we don't want to continue being also rans[/QUOTE]

Very good point, we've sold players in this window at a loss, that adds up over time.

We haven't sold anyone at a loss this window. If you think that, you've no idea how football accounts work.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

And what if he does? You will not know that until he expressly states that or he turns you down. Then you either try to talk him round and sell him on Spurs or you move on to option B (whatever option B is) simple.

Agreed. But who's to say we're not investigating what the other options are and have decided we're moving on? This is the crux of it. This will forever be a cyclical argument because it comes down to a disagreement on what little of the facts we know between those that have faith in the powers that be, and those that don't. For every piece of "evidence" that is brought proving one side, there is another view on that exact same "evidence" that can go against. We will never know unless Levy comes out and says it all. Even then, he probably wouldn't be believed.

 

[Jurgen the German]

The players that we have sold at a loss have not been ones that we have penny pinched on and dragged to the last moment? We made a loss on Paulinho and Chiriches. Paulinho was an early signing, and Chiriches was a deadline day signing that cannot be realistically seen as a key signing.

The point wasn't when they were signed i.e. late in the window, I was agreeing with the general point of buying cheaper options e.g. Stambouli rather than a player like Schneiderlin for example or Capoue instead of anyone half decent.

 

[Jurgen the German]

We haven't sold anyone at a loss this window. If you think that, you've no idea how football accounts work.

Paulinho, Chiriches and Capoue were actually.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

I think the problem here might be the limits that Levy has set. I think in his mind he is very dissapointed with our record signings in Lamela and soldado. A combined 50 odd million and not much to show for it. So he has come out and said he is happier with buying players in the 15m range.

The thing is with Berahino. Is that with us his value will only go up. We would not be paying way over the top wages. He is young, English and already proven in the Premier. He is exactly what we need in our attack. Him Kane, Pritchard and Eriksen could be a good combo. So I am hoping that Daniel can see this will only work out well.

I think 22m or so and he could be ours. Whether we bid is another matter.

I agree with that. I think the days of us being able to spend £25m plus on a player are behind us unless we sell one of our stars for a huge sum. We just cannot afford to have a player that we spend that much on to not be a success and there will always be a risk that that will happen i.e. Soldado and Lamela.

 

[NWND]

Chel53a are attempting to appease manager Jose Mourinho’s frustration by finalising a deal to sign left-back Baba Rahman and launching a third bid for Everton central defender John Stones.

Rahman is expected to undergo a medical after Chel53a finally agreed an initial fee of £14m, that could rise depending on appearances, with German club Augsburg, while the latest Stones offer is £30m.

Jose Mourinho wanted Baba Rahman's arrival before the start of the season

Although Everton are unlikely to accept £30m for Stones, Chel53a hope the bid will at least open a dialogue aimed at concluding a deal.

Mourinho had wanted his squad finalised by the start of the new Premier League season, but negotiations over Rahman and Stones have proved to be complicated and drawn out.

www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/Chel53a/11795125/Chel53a-try-to-appease-Jose-Mourinho-frustration-with-14m-Baba-Rahman-deal.html

Right on cue. If Chelsea find negotiations complicated and drawn out, I think we can cut Levy some slack, when he's trying to agree deals for players to improve the 5th best team/squad in the country with a limited budget.

 

[NWND]

Paulinho, Chiriches and Capoue were actually.

They won't be put through the accounts as a loss though. We got good fees for all three. We're probably technically speaking breaking-even or even in profit. The other thing to consider is the proportion of their fees to us that was made up of performance related bonuses that will never now be met, therefore written off.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

The point wasn't when they were signed i.e. late in the window, I was agreeing with the general point of buying cheaper options e.g. Stambouli rather than a player like Schneiderlin for example or Capoue instead of anyone half decent.

But I don't think Stambouli was sold at a loss? We made a profit on him.

We're not in the market for paying for top players. We are in the market to buying potential. That's where we have made the most of our resources. For every Stambouli where we have not made a return on, there are other players that we have. It's a punt. He was highly rated. It didn't work out. It happens.

You think the reason we didn't get Schneiderlin was because of price. I think it was other factors. By all accounts (and I cannot say this for sure) we had a fee agreed that was then reneged on. We also took their manager off them. We also sold a former player of theirs for a world record fee after buying them out of their sell on clause. We weren't exactly best buddies.

 

[GrimsbyYid]

Duabi's and Indian's negativity is getting ridiculous. Literally every single way they can possibly be negative they take it... Even in complete unknowns they'll express the worst possible outcome of it... Being negative about how we play, tactical decisions, actual signings, fair enough, but things we have absolutely no clue on? And the sheer incessantness of it? It's just dull!!

 

[Pandy]

Paulinho, Chiriches and Capoue were actually.

When NWND said 'if you think we lost money on those players, you have no idea how football accounting works', they were waiting for a response like that in order to wheel out knowledge about player amortisation.

See here for more info.

 

[Jurgen the German]

When NWND said 'if you think we lost money on those players, you have no idea how football accounting works', they were waiting for a response like that in order to wheel out knowledge about player amortisation.

See here for more info.

I know all about amortisation, it's a factor in my job.

 

[Pandy]

I know all about amortisation, it's a factor in my job.

Fair. Would they not technically be counted as profits then?

Not that I really want to be drawn into this technicality-based argument on whether or not some decent transfer business was more or less decent.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Fair. Would they not technically be counted as profits then?

Not that I really want to be drawn into this technicality-based argument on whether or not some decent transfer business was more or less decent.

You very rarely get Spurs fans on this forum talking about amortisation when mentioning other clubs transfer policies, probably because it somehow devalues the position of talking about how great we are in the market.

 

[milo]

You very rarely get Spurs fans on this forum talking about amortisation when mentioning other clubs transfer policies, probably because it somehow devalues the position of talking about how great we are in the market.

It is probably because there are less conversations about other clubs' signings, how much they cost and whether they were a success or not.

 

[Jurgen the German]

It is probably because there are less conversations about other clubs' signings, how much they cost and whether they were a success or not.

There's plenty of discussions about United and Liverpool's transfer dealings just to name two clubs.

Even Southampton last year, people said they'd spent x amount but in reality, they just did as we normally do and reinvested the money we had earned so their net spend wasn't actually a great deal IIRC.

 

[Robspur12]

Gazza it is so much more complicated than that. You're making it sound like someone trying to make the money for the weekly shop go further. We have no idea how much money the club has set aside for striker, but it needs to be a realistic amount to make WBA sell. Also with a young player like berahino you've got to consider how much we will make if he helps us win trophies or if he is so good that we sell him on for a massive profit. Taking the cheaper option everything may actually prove to be less cost effective in the long run. From time to time we need to buy the odd player from the A list if we don't want to continue being also rans

You're right it is more complicated than that. It could be that we have £30m for signings and need to strengthen 2-3 positions. In securing any one of those players, you need to think about how that will affect the budget on the remaining two. That is why the transfer window is so complicated and takes time to really settle down, because it is a chain.

Insofar as it is like someone trying to make the money for the weekly shop go farther, that is exactly what we are doing. We will have a budget that is for not just one player but for a bunch of positions. Whether that means we get the star striker plus above average other players, or star defender or any other combination is down to securing our targets. This is precisely one of those reasons why transfers will take longer. Add to that a stadium to fund, and is it any wonder that Levy is really making every pound work harder?

WBA have not rejected a bid afaik. WBA have not come out and said we have made a derisory bid, yet this is what people are choosing to believe i.e. that it is penny pinching that is delaying the deal to sign Berahino. I'm saying it is not and could be any one of a number of other options because it is so much more complicated than that. No one will know who is right apart from those in the club themselves, but I'm just putting my opinion across and disagreeing with those that say that it is penny pinching.[/QUOTE]


Mate I respect your opinion but I think you are not seeing the context of the current football climate with the crazy TV money. The sort of players which Spurs have been buying over the last 10 years - berbatovs, modrics, carricks i.e those not in the top tier but the next level down, all the clubs around us are now also buying, the Rondons, Affelays, bojans, mitrovic or wijnaldums, m'villa and cabayes. We then have our competitors for top 4 like Liverpool and L'arse blowing us out of the water with their spending power. So where does that leave us? Finishing top 4 or 5 is nearly impossible given the spending power of the likes of Liverpool, and the top 4. Top 6 in the face of this kind of competition from the other clubs is also not a foregone conclusion. So we wait until a new stadium is built - well by then we could be ensconced in mid table. Not possible? Rewind to the Spurs of the 90s to see what we could go back to. So from time to time we need to stick our necks out and bring in that special player to keep us above the stokes, newcastles, southamptons ( fook me how close did Southampton get to us last season) and keep us in that top 6 position. Just my opinion of course.

 

[Pandy]

You very rarely get Spurs fans on this forum talking about amortisation when mentioning other clubs transfer policies, probably because it somehow devalues the position of talking about how great we are in the market.

At the risk of stating the obvious; people tend to talk about things in the way that suits their argument, when it suits their argument.

 

[milo]

There's plenty of discussions about United and Liverpool's transfer dealings just to name two clubs.

Even Southampton last year, people said they'd spent x amount but in reality, they just did as we normally do and reinvested the money we had earned so their net spend wasn't actually a great deal IIRC.

Yeah but you don't get as many people repeatedly making the same point about the same players and obviously we tend to feel less strongly about other clubs' signings.