General Transfer Rumour Discussion Thread

[Robspur12]

Your arguments are the most boring of all.

Ramos- got the best replacement we could get at the time. Its hindsight but at the time Pac was one of the hottest properties in Europe having been top scorer in the Euros.

I agree with your other points but this is classic over egging the pudding. Ramos is the one manager I believe levy let down. He sold his 2 main strikers and which ever way you look at it Pav was a desperate last minute signing.

 

[NWND]

It isn't. That wasn't the damn point I was trying to make. A man who's tight to the point where Aulas hates his guts and Ferguson remarks that 'he's the most difficult man I've ever had to do business with' (or something similar)...you don't think such a man would happily screw over his managers for pennies to the pound?

Why would Levy screw his managers over? He knows the best chance of him making money is with positive on-pitch performances. Its about maximising our rather limited budget to do this, which means we sometimes have to say no thanks to the top stars and look for a more clever option. Something people like you cannot seem to grasp. In your world it's an absolute outrage that Levy isn't a mad Oligarch willing to spend billions on signing Hulk, Moutinho, Tevez, and all the other players you're moaning about us not signing when the reality is we had a 2% chance of getting any of those players.

 

[NWND]

I agree with your other points but this is classic over egging the pudding. Ramos is the one manager I believe levy let down. He sold his 2 main strikers and which ever way you look at it Pav was a desperate last minute signing.

To be fair you're right, but I think Levy was let down by Berbatov and particularly Keane as much as Ramos was.

 

[alekaras]

Tbf, 'Arry did take his eye off the ball, which is what really cost us. We still finished 4th and would have been in CL, were it not for Chelski's freak CL trophy win (doesn't get more sexy than that!). If we were and Levy didn't pony up to get the players the manager asked for, I would understand slagging him off. But I guess we'll never know...

 

[braineclipse]

We also made an 80 million pound pre-tax overall profit over 2013-2014, if I recall correctly: the record for any PL club at the time it was announced. I only restricted myself to transfer spending because that's what we were discussing: if you insist on bringing in the facilities and outside elements of the club, then yes, the club rakes in record f*cking profits on a monumental goddamn basis, even as it's building some brilliant facilities, and it's difficult to even argue this. And weren't you arguing that finishing with a large net profit is a rare thing? For five years, we've done so well at it that we're bottom of the league in that regard: so yes, it is eminently possible for us to finish with a large net profit at the end of this window.

Of course the widely reported reasons for that anomalous profit (12/13 and 11/12 numbers after tax were a £1.5m profit and £4.3m loss respectively) was the Gareth Bale deal and differences in how sales and purchases are amortized/recorded/<financial lingo here>.

Again with the same site that you posted that table from as a source our largest net profit was a £27m net profit (the year after we had a £17m net spend). Our second largest net profit was £16m, no surprise that was the Bale sale season. Yes, large net profits in the range you were talking about (£40m) seems like a rare thing. Even adjusted for football inflation I think it can only plausibly be argued to have happened once under Levy.

 

[DubaiSpur]

Why would Levy screw his managers over? He knows the best chance of him making money is with positive on-pitch performances. Its about maximising our rather limited budget to do this, which means we sometimes have to say no thanks to the top stars and look for a more clever option. Something people like you cannot seem to grasp. In your world it's an absolute outrage that Levy isn't a mad Oligarch willing to spend billions on signing Hulk, Moutinho, Tevez, and all the other players you're moaning about us not signing when the reality is we had a 2% chance of getting any of those players.

What utter rubbish. 'Say no to the top stars and look for the clever option'? Stambouli for Schneiderlin was the clever option? Dembele for Moutinho was the clever option? Lamela for Willian/Hulk was the clever option? Saha and Nelsen for Tevez and Cahill were the clever options? Pav and Fraizer f*cking Campbell for Berba and Keane were the clever options?

Where on Earth you're getting this from, I have no f*cking idea. 'Clever option', forsooth. 'Cheaper' option, every time: which comes with its naturally attendant extra risks and troubles.

'Clever' option, indeed. What rubbish. And I won't even get info the whole 'we're so poor' nonsense: we have made 56 million pounds in transfer window profits over the last five seasons. If the chairman's own claims about transfer spending not being affected by infrastructural development are true, then that would have been enough to cover a Hulk, a Moutinho, a Schneiderlin, and anyone else you'd care to name. The same also applies to your claim that we only had a '2%' chance of signing players like that: hogwash. Better players have signed for lesser clubs. Don't undersell us.

 

[parklane1]

Tbf, 'Arry did take his eye off the ball, which is what really cost us. We still finished 4th and would have been in CL, were it not for Chelski's freak CL trophy win (doesn't get more sexy than that!). If we were and Levy didn't pony up to get the players the manager asked for, I would understand slagging him off. But I guess we'll never know...

This is the relevant line, all those who keep barking up the same tree are doing so of nothing more then rumours in the papers. The vast majority of fans have no real idea of what really happens but some have convinced themselves on little more then paper gossip that Levy is ripping everyone off. And what makes it worse they keep going on about net spend which is really not that relevant in the long term as long as we spend what we take and we usually do that.

 

[alekaras]

This is the relevant line, all those who keep barking up the same tree are doing so of nothing more then rumours in the papers. The vast majority of fans have no real idea of what really happens but have convinced themselves on little more then paper gossip that Levy is ripping everyone off. And what makes it worse they keep going on about net spend which is really not that relevant in the long term as long as we spend what we take and we usually do that.

Actually, if you have to fund a new stadium, it is relevant, but I get your gist.

 

[parklane1]

Actually, if you have to fund a new stadium, it is relevant, but I get your gist.

Of course, but its the "we never spend any money on transfers" rubbish that is foolish.

 

[braineclipse]

What utter rubbish. 'Say no to the top stars and look for the clever option'? Stambouli for Schneiderlin was the clever option? Dembele for Moutinho was the clever option? Lamela for Willian/Hulk was the clever option? Saha and Nelsen for Tevez and Cahill were the clever options? Pav and Fraizer f*cking Campbell for Berba and Keane were the clever options?

Where on Earth you're getting this from, I have no f*cking idea. 'Clever option', forsooth. 'Cheaper' option, every time: which comes with its naturally attendant extra risks and troubles.

'Clever' option, indeed. What rubbish. And I won't even get info the whole 'we're so poor' nonsense: we have made 56 million pounds in transfer window profits over the last five seasons. If the chairman's own claims about transfer spending not being affected by infrastructural development are true, then that would have been enough to cover a Hulk, a Moutinho, a Schneiderlin, and anyone else you'd care to name. The same also applies to your claim that we only had a '2%' chance of signing players like that: hogwash. Better players have signed for lesser clubs. Don't undersell us.

Way over the top mate...

NWND made a good point you ignored about what Levy's motivations are and how he tries to reach reach (financial) goals for the club. He also said we have to look for the clever options rather than the highest profile players our managers may want. He didn't say all the signings made under Levy have been the clever option with the benefit of hindsight.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

Off to bed, will definitely peruse with interest in the morning.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...isnt-important-Tottenham-just-care-money.html
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/footb...enham-harry-redknapp-wanted-manchester-809769
http://www.theguardian.com/football...las-boas-tottenham-daniel-levy-broke-promises

It's ridiculous that these managers lose players they don't want to lose and then get sub-standard replacements? It's ridiculous to consider that we might have been able to do better than two f*cking free transfers at a time when we were 3rd and challenging for higher things? It's ridiculous to try to sign Hulk in a summer where we sold Bale for 85 million pounds, the one player AVB built his team around?

Sigh. I'm off to bed, the circular arguments are returning again.

Thanks for posting these articles. Here's my take on them for what it is worth:

1. Ramos - He is complaining that he wanted to sign Eto and Villa and instead got Pavluchenko and Bent instead. The same Villa who that summer refused to go anywhere including Real Madrid meaning that Schuster accused him of lacking ambition! The same Eto who was at Barcelona at the time! If Pochettino had a go at Levy for not signing Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Iniesta or Suarez I think we'd all agree that was unfair!

2. Harry Redknapp - He is complaining that we signed Saha and Nelson instead of Tevez and Cahill. He says in the same article, Tevez wanted £200k a week which we obviously could not afford. And Cahill went to Chelsea. How could we compete with them?

3. AVB - Now this is the interesting one. He wanted Moutinho, Willian, Oscar and Damiao. Willian and Oscar we could do nothing about, they went for bigger wages and Champions League elsewhere. Moutinho was third party ownership issues and then went for stupid money and wages to one of the richest clubs in the world. Damiao - well it seems like no one can sign him! In that same article he complains about losing VdV, who just recently slated AVB because he didn't feel wanted by him. He also says Baldini was imminently going to leave. Hasn't happened.

Who really knows what the truth is? You are choosing to believe these three which is fair enough. I don't as Ramos and Redknapp were asking for the outrageous and I wouldn't trust AVB as far as I could throw Hulk.

 

[parklane1]

Thanks for posting these articles. Here's my take on them for what it is worth:

1. Ramos - He is complaining that he wanted to sign Eto and Villa and instead got Pavluchenko and Bent instead. The same Villa who that summer refused to go anywhere including Real Madrid meaning that Schuster accused him of lacking ambition! The same Eto who was at Barcelona at the time! If Pochettino had a go at Levy for not signing Messi, Ronaldo, Neymar, Iniesta or Suarez I think we'd all agree that was unfair!

2. Harry Redknapp - He is complaining that we signed Saha and Nelson instead of Tevez and Cahill. He says in the same article, Tevez wanted £200k a week which we obviously could not afford. And Cahill went to Chel53a. How could we compete with them?

3. AVB - Now this is the interesting one. He wanted Moutinho, Willian, Oscar and Damiao. Willian and Oscar we could do nothing about, they went for bigger wages and Champions League elsewhere. Moutinho was third party ownership issues and then went for stupid money and wages to one of the richest clubs in the world. Damiao - well it seems like no one can sign him! In that same article he complains about losing VdV, who just recently slated AVB because he didn't feel wanted by him. He also says Baldini was imminently going to leave. Hasn't happened.

Who really knows what the truth is? You are choosing to believe these three which is fair enough. I don't as Ramos and Redknapp were asking for the outrageous and I wouldn't trust AVB as far as I could throw Hulk.

Be careful as you may be letting the truth get in the way of a fans agenda

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

What utter rubbish. 'Say no to the top stars and look for the clever option'? Stambouli for Schneiderlin was the clever option? Dembele for Moutinho was the clever option? Lamela for Willian/Hulk was the clever option? Saha and Nelsen for Tevez and Cahill were the clever options? Pav and Fraizer f*cking Campbell for Berba and Keane were the clever options?

Where on Earth you're getting this from, I have no f*cking idea. 'Clever option', forsooth. 'Cheaper' option, every time: which comes with its naturally attendant extra risks and troubles.

'Clever' option, indeed. What rubbish. And I won't even get info the whole 'we're so poor' nonsense: we have made 56 million pounds in transfer window profits over the last five seasons. If the chairman's own claims about transfer spending not being affected by infrastructural development are true, then that would have been enough to cover a Hulk, a Moutinho, a Schneiderlin, and anyone else you'd care to name. The same also applies to your claim that we only had a '2%' chance of signing players like that: hogwash. Better players have signed for lesser clubs. Don't undersell us.

I'll keep this one short as you are fighting on too many fronts!

The crux of this is that you believe that not paying enough is the reason we have missed out on these players. I, and some others, believe that there were other factors. If you miss out on your first choice target, you're left with the options of staying as is or buy someone else. Because we are after a cerain calibre of player, this limits our pool somewhat especially when you factor in wages and lack of CL. So, you buy a cheaper option or spend more than you want to to get said player. I don't see anything wrong with that. I would have a problem if let's say Pochettino said "I want Schneiderlin" and the club turn around and say "F*ck off, you'll have Stambouli and you will have to lump it" which I don't think is what happened without even trying. I have no problem with club trying to sign Schneiderlin and thinking "Actually, that's a lot more than we can spend because we have to spend money on X, Y or Z", them explaining this to Poch and suggesting Stambouli as a stop gap.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

Be careful as you may be letting the truth get in the way of a fans agenda

I don't think Dubai has an agenda really. He believes taking more of a risk by spending that little bit more would be a better way to run the club and is choosing to believe that the reason why we have missed out on past players is because we are driving too much of a hard bargain. That's fair enough and could be true. We just don't think so and unfortunately can't persuade him otherwise either!

 

[parklane1]

I don't think Dubai has an agenda really. He believes taking more of a risk by spending that little bit more would be a better way to run the club and is choosing to believe that the reason why we have missed out on past players is because we are driving too much of a hard bargain. That's fair enough and could be true. We just don't think so and unfortunately can't persuade him otherwise either!

Read through some of his posts over the months and you will see a constant subject mostly going in one direction.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

Read through some of his posts over the months and you will see a constant subject mostly going in one direction.

Yeah, I've been lurking a while so have seen where he is coming from. I'll be honest, I stopped posting about 6 or 7 years ago because I felt that the discussions were not discussions but rather arguments. People could not accept a different opinion from their own and got overly emotional about it. As if disagreeing with them attacked the very core of their own being.

Whilst I can see Dubai does sometimes get a bit emotional in response, I can see why. Sometimes he is baited, other times there's a misunderstanding and he does get about 4 or 5 posters quoting and replying to him. If people just accepted each other's opinion and looked to understand why they think that way, it may be a little less emotional. But that would take the fun out of being a keyboard warrior! None of this is aimed at you btw. We're all spurs fans, so just want the best for our club.

 

[parklane1]

Yeah, I've been lurking a while so have seen where he is coming from. I'll be honest, I stopped posting about 6 or 7 years ago because I felt that the discussions were not discussions but rather arguments. People could not accept a different opinion from their own and got overly emotional about it. As if disagreeing with them attacked the very core of their own being.

Whilst I can see Dubai does sometimes get a bit emotional in response, I can see why. Sometimes he is baited, other times there's a misunderstanding and he does get about 4 or 5 posters quoting and replying to him. If people just accepted each other's opinion and looked to understand why they think that way, it may be a little less emotional. But that would take the fun out of being a keyboard warrior! None of this is aimed at you btw. We're all spurs fans, so just want the best for our club.

You are right it is all about opinions and there is nothing wrong with having one, however banging on about the same thing over and over and using the same mantra when others are trying to say the point he is making has no real proof and is mostly based on gossip, rumours etc is tiresome to some. Now I do not really rate Mason while others do and both sides are neither right or wrong because they see different things in his game, that is just a different opinion and both are valid.

What Dubai does is blame Levy for all sorts of things without any REAL proof in most cases, that is not a opinion its a agenda. I have never met a fan who thinks Levy is perfect and does not make mistakes but the way Dubai goes on you would think Levy is to blame for the sun not shining. Of course this is all in my opinion.

 

[Nigeyman]

Yeah, I've been lurking a while so have seen where he is coming from. I'll be honest, I stopped posting about 6 or 7 years ago because I felt that the discussions were not discussions but rather arguments. People could not accept a different opinion from their own and got overly emotional about it. As if disagreeing with them attacked the very core of their own being.

Whilst I can see Dubai does sometimes get a bit emotional in response, I can see why. Sometimes he is baited, other times there's a misunderstanding and he does get about 4 or 5 posters quoting and replying to him. If people just accepted each other's opinion and looked to understand why they think that way, it may be a little less emotional. But that would take the fun out of being a keyboard warrior! None of this is aimed at you btw. We're all spurs fans, so just want the best for our club.

I hope you continue to post regularly from now on.

great post.

 

[Gazzasrightboot]

You are right it is all about opinions and there is nothing wrong with having one, however banging on about the same thing over and over and using the same mantra when others are trying to say the point he is making has no real proof and is mostly based on gossip, rumours etc is tiresome to some. Now I do not really rate Mason while others do and both sides are neither right or wrong because they see different things in his game, that is just a different opinion and both are valid.

What Dubai does is blame Levy for all sorts of things without any REAL proof in most cases, that is not a opinion its a agenda. I have never met a fan who thinks Levy is perfect and does not make mistakes but the way Dubai goes on you would think Levy is to blame for the sun not shining. Of course this is all in my opinion.

Ha! That's sometimes the charm about football. I have the same argument with my brother almost every time we talk about football. He insists that Ginola has been the best Spurs winger in the last 30 or so years. I disagree, and think that Waddle, Ardiles and Bale have eclipsed that. This has been going on for 3 years now but it still doesn't stop us from arguing about it though!!

Our other one where neither of us are prepared to back down, is best goalkeeper in the same time period. He thinks it should be Lloris or Thorsvedt, and I think you cannot even begin to look past Clemence.

But I digress.....

 

[indianspur]

I agree with your other points but this is classic over egging the pudding. Ramos is the one manager I believe levy let down. He sold his 2 main strikers and which ever way you look at it Pav was a desperate last minute signing.

iirc Ramos had personally lined up Diego Milito and Sergio Garcia from Real Zaragoza to join us, convinced them and everything, and Milito actually spent the whole summer waiting for us to do the deal until the final day of the window when he had had enough and joined someone else