Do teachers know the meaning of stress?

[Sheikh Ma Nuggets]

1) I most likely will find a part time job whilst I'm at uni.
2) Part-time jobs generally don't pay ?ú8000 a year?
3) I have to study as well.

Yes I'm thinking bloody far ahead, but my brother and my sister have both been through uni, so I know well enough what to expect, and I'm just saying what I'd do now. If I could get a job now I would, but unfortunately I'm not legal yet.

My point is when I'm at uni my dad will treat me the same as he treated my siblings whilst they lived at uni. He gave them a monthly allowance, but they still worked for some extra cash in their pockets so they can do more stuff.

That's good then, that you'll find a job - the friends you'll make will respect you more for it; not see you as some mummys boy. Well no, they won't pay ?ú8k a year - that isnt the point I'm making though. It's about earning yourself self-respect from your peers, and also learning to be less reliant on your parents to pick the tab up - I'm sure, for instance, they'd much rather use their money to enjoy themselves; holidays, cars, other such indulgences.

Well yeah, you'll have to study too - join the club, that's what everyone else will be doing. However, they'll also be learning how best to use their time or do more with it. Teaches you to grow up; if u can't pay the bills, then you have to work doubly-hard for everything, just to keep going. There's a lesson in life that'll be very hard for wet-behind-the-ears kids fresh out of their parents kushy arms to learn.

I honestly think you have a very sheltered view of the world, and it's because you live safe in the knowledge that mummy and daddy will cushion you. Okay, that's good for you: but it's very niave of you to think everyone has such a luxury and that ergo going to university is affordable. Of course it's affordable...if you're not picking up all the costs involved, you don't have to worry about those do ya!?

 

[Richie]

Having graduated through the education system, GCSEs to A level to Undergraducate to Postgraduate I genuinely think I could pass any GCSE with no more than a couple of weeks work, even in subjects I haven't looked at since (i.e. Chemistry)

Honestly, I think back to how it took me so long to grasp simple concepts when I was that young, shake my head and wonder what was wrong with me

 

[tommythetank]

Having graduated through the education system, GCSEs to A level to Undergraducate to Postgraduate I genuinely think I could pass any GCSE with no more than a couple of weeks work, even in subjects I haven't looked at since (i.e. Chemistry)

Honestly, I think back to how it took me so long to grasp simple concepts when I was that young, shake my head and wonder what was wrong with me

Yep, they are really easy. Used my study leave last year to play xbox and eat mcdonalds. Having to actually study this year (got physics on thursday and maths on friday.)

 

[spurspinter1]

That's good then, that you'll find a job - the friends you'll make will respect you more for it; not see you as some mummys boy. Well no, they won't pay ?ú8k a year - that isnt the point I'm making though. It's about earning yourself self-respect from your peers, and also learning to be less reliant on your parents to pick the tab up - I'm sure, for instance, they'd much rather use their money to enjoy themselves; holidays, cars, other such indulgences.

Well yeah, you'll have to study too - join the club, that's what everyone else will be doing. However, they'll also be learning how best to use their time or do more with it. Teaches you to grow up; if u can't pay the bills, then you have to work doubly-hard for everything, just to keep going. There's a lesson in life that'll be very hard for wet-behind-the-ears kids fresh out of their parents kushy arms to learn.

I honestly think you have a very sheltered view of the world, and it's because you live safe in the knowledge that mummy and daddy will cushion you. Okay, that's good for you: but it's very niave of you to think everyone has such a luxury and that ergo going to university is affordable. Of course it's affordable...if you're not picking up all the costs involved, you don't have to worry about those do ya!?

The bolded part doesn't really make sense and I think you're unnecessarily having a go at someone who hasn't said anything with the intention of offending you here.

You're absolutely fine to have an opinion but are being deliberatley patronising and also making many assumptions.

I know plenty of people who have their parents picking up the bills for uni, that doesn't give me the same kind of hate that you have for these folks, people have different circumstances that they are born in to, luck of the draw and there's no point getting uppity about it like you seem to.

 

[Sheikh Ma Nuggets]

The bolded part doesn't really make sense and I think you're unnecessarily having a go at someone who hasn't said anything with the intention of offending you here.

You're absolutely fine to have an opinion but are being deliberatley patronising and also making many assumptions.

I know plenty of people who have their parents picking up the bills for uni, that doesn't give me the same kind of hate that you have for these folks, people have different circumstances that they are born in to, luck of the draw and there's no point getting uppity about it like you seem to.

You might want to read all the posts then.

He says going to university is entirely affordable; nothing to worry about. I think the kid is 14 or something, and - guess what - he's judging this affordability on the basis that his mummy and daddy will, actually, part-fund it. I'm not surprised he's done that at all; that's what children do - they have a skewed view of life and the cost of everything, as they're not used to assuming the full financial responsibility. To some degree, going to university should be a lesson in learning how to take those responsibilities on, yet some find it hard to break those purse strings.

Who said I hate anyone? I sooner find them pitiful and pathetic, than I do hate them. If I wanted to, I couldn't done the same myself; scrounged off my parents and never growing up. But I had more self-respect than that; I chose to fund every single thing that I ever have in my life, through my own blood, sweat and tears. It's the harder option for sure, but - at the end of it - it has given me a damn good sense that I've properly earned everything I have to my name.

But not everyone has that about them; they prefer the easy option: bank of mum and dad. Okay, fair enough - you do that, but just don't go making claims about affordability, ignoring the fact that your parents have decided to substantially bankroll part of the costs - because that's a pretty stupid claim, don't you think? The question of affordability should be on a base level whereby the assumption is that you'll assume full costs yourself - which, I would imagine, is the more common of circumstance, especially in tough economic times. Of course you'll have exceptions to that rule, but to base an opinion on an exception is very, very foolish. Am I the least bit surprised though? Not a all, and for the reasons outlined in my first paragraph.

 

[scaramanga]

Having graduated through the education system, GCSEs to A level to Undergraducate to Postgraduate I genuinely think I could pass any GCSE with no more than a couple of weeks work, even in subjects I haven't looked at since (i.e. Chemistry)

Honestly, I think back to how it took me so long to grasp simple concepts when I was that young, shake my head and wonder what was wrong with me

Not you, the school system.

Many current schools (especially since the demise of Grammar Schools, reduced streaming and inability to expel students) are little more than zoos with a bit of learning thrown in. My wife is renowned at her school for good behaviour management, and the grades her students get (or value added, at least) reflect that. Many teachers at her school and others are like the rest of us - utterly incapable of keeping 30 feral kids quiet, behaved and attentive for an hour at a time.

That's not to say these teachers are incapable of teaching or that they lack application, merely that the skillset required to stretch future undergraduates mentally whilst controlling the behaviour of kids with no parental input who frankly would be more suited to spend their time getting fitted for prisonwear all in one classroom is near impossible.

 

[spurspinter1]

You might want to read all the posts then.

He says going to university is entirely affordable; nothing to worry about. I think the kid is 14 or something, and - guess what - he's judging this affordability on the basis that his mummy and daddy will, actually, part-fund it. I'm not surprised he's done that at all; that's what children do - they have a skewed view of life and the cost of everything, as they're not used to assuming the full financial responsibility. To some degree, going to university should be a lesson in learning how to take those responsibilities on, yet some find it hard to break those purse strings.

Who said I hate anyone? I sooner find them pitiful and pathetic, than I do hate them. If I wanted to, I couldn't done the same myself; scrounged off my parents and never growing up. But I had more self-respect than that; I chose to fund every single thing that I ever have in my life, through my own blood, sweat and tears. It's the harder option for sure, but - at the end of it - it has given me a damn good sense that I've properly earned everything I have to my name.

But not everyone has that about them; they prefer the easy option: bank of mum and dad. Okay, fair enough - you do that, but just don't go making claims about affordability, ignoring the fact that your parents have decided to substantially bankroll part of the costs - because that's a pretty stupid claim, don't you think? The question of affordability should be on a base level whereby the assumption is that you'll assume full costs yourself - which, I would imagine, is the more common of circumstance, especially in tough economic times. Of course you'll have exceptions to that rule, but to base an opinion on an exception is very, very foolish. Am I the least bit surprised though? Not a all, and for the reasons outlined in my first paragraph.

That's lovely, and you've clearly had time to develop your opinion, I'm not disagreeing with you or agreeing with you, I just think that COYS has remained surprisingly polite since you have sent a fair few personal attacks his way in my opinion.

You chose to fund every single thing you have in your life? So you've never taken a loan/overdraft I assume? Not in debt at all? Your parents/guardians never paid for an ice cream at the beach when you were 8, or failing that put a roof above your head and food in your belly?

Some parents have earnt the ability to give their kids a hand in finding their path in this world, and why should they be judged by you for being able to do so? They've earnt it, and as long as they've raised their children to know how lucky they are then I have no problem whatsover, and I don't understand why you do, unless you often came in to contact with people who weren't grateful at all for what they had, in that case I can see why you have these feelings for such people.

 

[Dorothy]

1) I most likely will find a part time job whilst I'm at uni.
2) Part-time jobs generally don't pay ?ú8000 a year?
3) I have to study as well.

Yes I'm thinking bloody far ahead, but my brother and my sister have both been through uni, so I know well enough what to expect, and I'm just saying what I'd do now. If I could get a job now I would, but unfortunately I'm not legal yet.

My point is when I'm at uni my dad will treat me the same as he treated my siblings whilst they lived at uni. He gave them a monthly allowance, but they still worked for some extra cash in their pockets so they can do more stuff.

There is nothing wrong with that at all. If he can afford to do that and you ensure you don't waste hs money then it is all good. People do and can make part tiem work with University but everyone is different. Not everyone can churn out the work, do the research at the same rates. Of course there is part time work out there for say 20-30 hours a week but finding shifts, times that fit in with lectures etc would be tricky which largely limits you to days off from college and evenings.

i.e. get off here and do your homework !!

 

[COYS]

You might want to read all the posts then.

He says going to university is entirely affordable; nothing to worry about.

If, like me, you haven't got a further ?ú9000 a year to cough up to go to uni, then the government can help you. Then, if you make it and get a good job afterwards, they'll take a little extra tax off of your pay packet each month, so you have no excuses.

People don't really know about the nwe system. People think you're in 'debt' for the rest of your life, when that's not really true.

This is how it works:

If you earn over 21k a year then 9% of everything over 21,000 goes to your student loan. So for ?ú30,000, that's 9% x ?ú9000 = ?ú810. That's ?ú67.50 per month, like I said before.

Most people won't actually pay back the full loan in their lives, as after 30 years the loan finishes, no matter how much you've paid back, so for most people it will actually be quite silly to pay it back early. The money comes out of your pay packet with your income tax, and if someone asks if you're in debt, you can say no.

You can't argue university isn't affordable. If you can't afford it at the time, you'll be able to afford it afterwards. If you can't afford it afterwards (which would be silly as you've just studied for 3-4 years), then you don't have to pay it off.

I don't leech off my parents, I just simply have no other means of income. When I'm at uni, I'll still need money from my parents, with or without a part time job, unless I take out a maintenance loan, which is fair enough, but just not really necessary for me, and to be honest I don't think I'd be granted one, because for a maintenance loan you need to prove your family are financially struggling. If it is necessary for someone to take out a maintenance loan, then go ahead, that's completely what it's there for, and trust me it's affordable afterwards, as it comes as part of the student loan.

Now, to the critics of the school system, your assumptions are quite unfair really. Until about 2 years ago, the GCSEs were tinkle easy, and I've done papers from those times, and honestly I don't think it's fair that they've changed it. Because now the whole system's been completely changed, and the exam system's been made harder; they've abolished coursework and replaced it with controlled assessments; GCSE papers are no longer a few multiple choice questions, and now require proper understanding of what you're learning and what we learn today is more functional in the real world, especially in maths.

If you don't believe me I'll send you a maths exam paper from 2009 and I'll send you one from this year, and maybe you'll think "wait a minute, maybe my opinions are outdated"

One of the biggest advantages we've had is the internet. Honestly, I wouldn't be able to do work if it was taken away. You may find that laughable and sad, but there are many things today that would be impossible without the internet. It's the world we've been brought up in, and teachers are fully aware of that, and every single person in my school has at least a computer at home, if not their own laptop. Computers are a necessity, and the internet is really what's opened our minds up and made work much easier. I probably will look back in 2-3 years and laugh at how easy doing a GCSE is, but when it's 10 GCSEs, and you have to revise loads of different subjects, it's slightly harder than it looks. I find it offensive when people call years 10 and 11 easy, because I don't know anyone who does find it easy in my school, because it's not. It's easy until you have to actually do it, and after that it just gets harder and harder.

To the person who got 8 A*s. Well done to you, but I don't think more than 3 people out of 300 will be achieving that in my year. And I don't go to a bad school.

 

[tommythetank]

If, like me, you haven't got a further ?ú9000 a year to cough up to go to uni, then the government can help you. Then, if you make it and get a good job afterwards, they'll take a little extra tax off of your pay packet each month, so you have no excuses.

People don't really know about the nwe system. People think you're in 'debt' for the rest of your life, when that's not really true.

This is how it works:

If you earn over 21k a year then 9% of everything over 21,000 goes to your student loan. So for ?ú30,000, that's 9% x ?ú9000 = ?ú810. That's ?ú67.50 per month, like I said before.

Most people won't actually pay back the full loan in their lives, as after 30 years the loan finishes, no matter how much you've paid back, so for most people it will actually be quite silly to pay it back early. The money comes out of your pay packet with your income tax, and if someone asks if you're in debt, you can say no.

You can't argue university isn't affordable. If you can't afford it at the time, you'll be able to afford it afterwards. If you can't afford it afterwards (which would be silly as you've just studied for 3-4 years), then you don't have to pay it off.

I don't leech off my parents, I just simply have no other means of income. When I'm at uni, I'll still need money from my parents, with or without a part time job, unless I take out a maintenance loan, which is fair enough, but just not really necessary for me, and to be honest I don't think I'd be granted one, because for a maintenance loan you need to prove your family are financially struggling. If it is necessary for someone to take out a maintenance loan, then go ahead, that's completely what it's there for, and trust me it's affordable afterwards, as it comes as part of the student loan.

Now, to the critics of the school system, your assumptions are quite unfair really. Until about 2 years ago, the GCSEs were tinkle easy, and I've done papers from those times, and honestly I don't think it's fair that they've changed it. Because now the whole system's been completely changed, and the exam system's been made harder; they've abolished coursework and replaced it with controlled assessments; GCSE papers are no longer a few multiple choice questions, and now require proper understanding of what you're learning and what we learn today is more functional in the real world, especially in maths.

If you don't believe me I'll send you a maths exam paper from 2009 and I'll send you one from this year, and maybe you'll think "wait a minute, maybe my opinions are outdated"

One of the biggest advantages we've had is the internet. Honestly, I wouldn't be able to do work if it was taken away. You may find that laughable and sad, but there are many things today that would be impossible without the internet. It's the world we've been brought up in, and teachers are fully aware of that, and every single person in my school has at least a computer at home, if not their own laptop. Computers are a necessity, and the internet is really what's opened our minds up and made work much easier. I probably will look back in 2-3 years and laugh at how easy doing a GCSE is, but when it's 10 GCSEs, and you have to revise loads of different subjects, it's slightly harder than it looks. I find it offensive when people call years 10 and 11 easy, because I don't know anyone who does find it easy in my school, because it's not. It's easy until you have to actually do it, and after that it just gets harder and harder.

To the person who got 8 A*s. Well done to you, but I don't think more than 3 people out of 300 will be achieving that in my year. And I don't go to a bad school.

The problem is though, it IS easy, trust me As level is a bit different.

 

[COYS]

The problem is though, it IS easy, trust me As level is a bit different.

I'll probably agree with you by the time I'm in year 12, but I still won't be getting 8 A*s

 

[tommythetank]

Fair enough mate, if your having trouble revising, look at the cgp books. They condense the spec significantly and throw in a few bad jokes along the way. Quite useful.

 

[Sheikh Ma Nuggets]

That's lovely, and you've clearly had time to develop your opinion, I'm not disagreeing with you or agreeing with you, I just think that COYS has remained surprisingly polite since you have sent a fair few personal attacks his way in my opinion.

You chose to fund every single thing you have in your life? So you've never taken a loan/overdraft I assume? Not in debt at all? Your parents/guardians never paid for an ice cream at the beach when you were 8, or failing that put a roof above your head and food in your belly?

Some parents have earnt the ability to give their kids a hand in finding their path in this world, and why should they be judged by you for being able to do so? They've earnt it, and as long as they've raised their children to know how lucky they are then I have no problem whatsover, and I don't understand why you do, unless you often came in to contact with people who weren't grateful at all for what they had, in that case I can see why you have these feelings for such people.

Personal attacks? What the hell are you on about? We're having a good, lively and interesting discussion; two differing opinions, thrashing it out. I can't see where either of us have abused one another

Don't really get your second paragraph. My point - as you don't seem able to understand it - is that, when it became my time to grow up, I took absolute responsibility for my own way in life, including everything financial. And, as you ask and seem interested: nope I don't use an overdraft, nope I don't have any loans and nope I'm not in debt either. I think I'm what's termed 'financially comfortable'.

It's not the parents I find pitiful or pathetic; it's the mollycoddled children who, for their constant whims, never learn how to break from the easy option, instead continuing an unhealthy reliance on mummy and daddy. As I've said, it's a bit disingenuous to lay a claim regarding affordability, knowing full well that you're not taking on-board the full costs involved.

Not sure why you're focusing on the parents, because I'm not. As it happens, my Dad was a very successful businessman and I could very easily have just relied on his wealth to bankroll me through life. I decided not to though, because I wanted to be able to look back on what I'd achieved and know that it was through my own efforts and means, and that no-one could ever accuse me of taking shortcuts, the easy option or riding on coattails. And, believe me, it's a very empowering feeling. Harder option, yes - absolutely, but so much more rewarding.

 

[COYS]

I prefer to not consider myself a "mollycoddled child". You think I don't work hard? OK, my parents pay for things for me, but there is honestly no other way about it in this day and age. I can't get a job so how else do you expect me to have things?

 

[Sheikh Ma Nuggets]

I prefer to not consider myself a "mollycoddled child". You think I don't work hard? OK, my parents pay for things for me, but there is honestly no other way about it in this day and age. I can't get a job so how else do you expect me to have things?

We're talking about going to university, right?

Right. So, why do you think I'm questioning what you're doing as a 14yo?

 

[COYS]

We're talking about going to university, right?

Right. So, why do you think I'm questioning what you're doing as a 14yo?

I never argued with getting a job at uni, doesn't mean I won't need money from my parents. Going to university is expensive, however I plan on going to a London uni so after my first year I'll probably be living at home anyway to ease the financial strain for my parents.

 

[P.D.]

3 decades actually. But for what it's worth, why not? It will probably be a bloody good investment for the future! I know your generation are so anti uni, just because most of Gen X never went, and are under the impression it's full of time-wasters and money-wasters, but oh well, that's just a stupid stereotype.

I said this before a few weeks ago but I'll say it again. If I start off on 30k a year after graduating then that's ?ú67.50 a month for my student loan. That's ?ú67.50 a month I can live without after just attending uni for free. If I didn't go to uni my starting salary may only be 25k a year, which means uni was a bloody good investment!

You seem to continually go on about you will be walking into a 30k job right after uni, what makes you so certain? Have you looked at the average graduate salary recently? They are all being frozen, going down or the companies are reducing their graduate intake.

What is your proposed course and which uni are you intending to do it at?

I'm hard gen X, graduated in 2006 and have a degree in information systems from leeds so I know exactly what I'm talking about thanks, I also have a job at a decent employer so know what the job market is like and the sorts of things people look for in potential employees as I've sifted through a fair few CV's etc.

?ú67.50 isnt much in the grand scheme of things but trust me once you factor in all your other costs over time that ?ú67.50 will start to get extremely annoying.

 

[COYS]

You seem to continually go on about you will be walking into a 30k job right after uni, what makes you so certain? Have you looked at the average graduate salary recently? They are all being frozen, going down or the companies are reducing their graduate intake.

What is your proposed course and which uni are you intending to do it at?

I'm hard gen X, graduated in 2006 and have a degree in information systems from leeds so I know exactly what I'm talking about thanks, I also have a job at a decent employer so know what the job market is like and the sorts of things people look for in potential employees as I've sifted through a fair few CV's etc.

?ú67.50 isnt much in the grand scheme of things but trust me once you factor in all your other costs over time that ?ú67.50 will start to get extremely annoying.

30k's just an example to put it in to perspective. It's how much I'd expect the average graduate to earn who has a good degree. Yes, an extra ?ú67.50 per month is nice, but without the degree who knows where you'd be.

 

[Sheikh Ma Nuggets]

30k's just an example to put it in to perspective. It's how much I'd expect the average graduate to earn who has a good degree. Yes, an extra ?ú67.50 per month is nice, but without the degree who knows where you'd be.

A plumber, electrician, plasterer?

 

[COYS]

The thing is, the new student loan system is actually cheaper per month than the last, you just pay it back for longer, so it's actually more affordable.