Daniel Levy's Transfer Policy Revealed

[jimmyb]

Re: Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach

Another transfer window is drawing to a disappointing close of relative failure

Three days left.

Three days in which most of entire month's business will be done. The January transfer window is like a basketball game. It only becomes interesting in the closing stages. So to talk about failure and disappointment now is premature.

another swarm of Levy apologists pedalling the same old tired excuses and hollow propaganda

See..........this kind of brick isn't helpful. We are Spurs fans - not apologists for anyone. We are expressing opinions - not peddling propaganda. Seriously, why use such provocative language? It's puerile. If you can't handle and respect the fact that people have opinions that differ from yours, then you probably shouldn't be posting on a message board.

unless Levy is willing to provide AVB the necessary tools for the job, perhaps he needs to drop his seasons objectives lower and simply accept we will NEVER be able to mount a continuous 4th place presence.

We don't know to what extent Levy is able to provide AVB with the players that he wants. We don't know whether it's a question of money or whether the clubs that own the likes of Willian, Damiao and Moutinho are just not prepared to do business. We don't know to what extent third party ownership has complicated negotiations. Nor do we know whether or not it is simply a matter of timing, with the required players not being for sale until the summer.

And on the basis that none of has the first clue as to what is actually going on, it's probably wise not to get our knickers in a twist about it.

seriously re-evaluate our scouting staff performance and objectives in terms of looking for talent overseas - teams such as Wigan and Swansea who operate on a fraction of our turnover have brought it some great players from South America / Southern Europe over the years (and also sold for a good profit) - yet we are being linked with SPL units and Stoke City rejects.

100% agreed with this.

not sure how Moutinho's alleged £20m+ bid only a few months ago suddenly translates into complete and utter lack of buying power into this window, while we are busy negotaiting over thousands! (not millions) over Holtby's transfer, seeing that Sandro is out for the season and he could well be our most important player. Thousands!

Having millions available for one transfer would have no bearing on the negotiating stance taken on another transfer.

I know there will be viscous attack on me for this post (which would further prove the lack of objectivity when it come to DL debates)

No viscous (sic) attack on you (no runny attack either!). But, once again, you seem incapable of posting without attacking others. Lack of objectivity? No. Just an opinion which you apparently can't handle.

 

[ArcspacE]

Who have I 'attacked', Jimmy?

Simply noted how it has become increasingly impossible these days to raise 'concerns' towards our chairman's transfer policy, who in the eyes of some appears to be doing EVERYTHING right and never in the wrong - I don't see the word 'apologist' as provocative or puerile, nor is it considered insulting in my view - simply describes a stance on a subject.

But in your view - is this attack any different to the constant victimisation of posters who window after window express their desperate desire to finally see our manager make a statement in the transfer market (I'm not taking about spending 40m btw) and finally consolidate our position while addressing unbalanced aspects of our squad, only to be shot down by posters to the tune of 'ungrateful', 'unrealistic', and 'detached from reality', 'FM fanboy', etc.. How are those posters any different in their perceived ability to 'handle' others' views? After all - this is a thread about discussing our transfer policy.

In the very next sentence you basically render all input on this message-board irrelevant since none of us appear to really know what's cutting. Hell, why are we here if not to throw about a few opinion and debate Spurs-related topics? I don't agree with his transfer policy in its entirely - if in your view that is seen as an attack on posters such as yourself , then perhaps I need to start re-wording my posts

 

[Spursalot]

Re: Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach

Another transfer window is drawing to a disappointing close of relative failure (in terms of consolidating our 4th spot) - another swarm of Levy apologists pedalling the same old tired excuses and hollow propaganda of how 'it's ok because Arsenal only have Walcott (who has been better than any of our strikers this season btw!)', 'It's dangerous to buy an expensive striker because he might get injured', 'We are completely fudging broke', 'There is no one out there for us except Falcao and Cavani', etc. and similar clichés which have been doing the rounds, in one form or another ever since Comolli left.

The bottom line for me remains (as outlined in another thread earlier)

- unless Levy is willing to provide AVB the necessary tools for the job, perhaps he needs to drop his seasons objectives lower and simply accept we will NEVER be able to mount a continuous 4th place presence.

- seriously re-evaluate our scouting staff performance and objectives in terms of looking for talent overseas - teams such as Wigan and Swansea who operate on a fraction of our turnover have brought it some great players from South America / Southern Europe over the years (and also sold for a good profit) - yet we are being linked with SPL units and Stoke City rejects.

- not sure how Moutinho's alleged £20m+ bid only a few months ago suddenly translates into complete and utter lack of buying power into this window, while we are busy negotaiting over thousands! (not millions) over Holtby's transfer, seeing that Sandro is out for the season and he could well be our most important player. Thousands!

I know there will be viscous attack on me for this post (which would further prove the lack of objectivity when it come to DL debates) and for those who bother reading as far as this before reaching for the pitchforks and stones - I think Levy has done a brilliant job and wouldn't swap him for anyone but he might have to re-evaluate his transfer policy of 'younger players for profit' and perhaps consider mounting a substantial challenge now that he likes to talk the talk with AVB's 'long term' project and appointment. If Arry wasn't seen as the right man to be given the keys - well, it's now been 10 years so this should be the best chance to date, imv (AVB-wise)

Was going to leave it until i got to here. What started as a decent post, a perfectly valid opinion ruined by a single sentence.


Claiming that anyone who disagrees with you is not 'objective' on a subjective matter? That's an odd one.

 

[ArcspacE]

Precedent is very much against that, I'm afraid. There is further lack of objectivity on numerous toher Spurs topics on this very board (today!) - at the end of that day, that is the nature of football discussion and general sports following.

I think part of the problem sees many struggle to differentiate between him as a chairman (overall) and transfer dealings 'main man' - i.e. the two are not necessarily the same (although fundamentally related). Which is why I feel subsequent replies come short of this impartial stance soon after the 'he's having a go at him!' hurdle.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Re: Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach

Another transfer window is drawing to a disappointing close of relative failure (in terms of consolidating our 4th spot) - another swarm of Levy apologists pedalling the same old tired excuses and hollow propaganda of how 'it's ok because Arsenal only have Walcott (who has been better than any of our strikers this season btw!)', 'It's dangerous to buy an expensive striker because he might get injured', 'We are completely fudging broke', 'There is no one out there for us except Falcao and Cavani', etc. and similar clichés which have been doing the rounds, in one form or another ever since Comolli left.

The bottom line for me remains (as outlined in another thread earlier)

- unless Levy is willing to provide AVB the necessary tools for the job, perhaps he needs to drop his seasons objectives lower and simply accept we will NEVER be able to mount a continuous 4th place presence.

- seriously re-evaluate our scouting staff performance and objectives in terms of looking for talent overseas - teams such as Wigan and Swansea who operate on a fraction of our turnover have brought it some great players from South America / Southern Europe over the years (and also sold for a good profit) - yet we are being linked with SPL units and Stoke City rejects.

- not sure how Moutinho's alleged £20m+ bid only a few months ago suddenly translates into complete and utter lack of buying power into this window, while we are busy negotaiting over thousands! (not millions) over Holtby's transfer, seeing that Sandro is out for the season and he could well be our most important player. Thousands!

I know there will be viscous attack on me for this post (which would further prove the lack of objectivity when it come to DL debates) and for those who bother reading as far as this before reaching for the pitchforks and stones - I think Levy has done a brilliant job and wouldn't swap him for anyone but he might have to re-evaluate his transfer policy of 'younger players for profit' and perhaps consider mounting a substantial challenge now that he likes to talk the talk with AVB's 'long term' project and appointment. If Arry wasn't seen as the right man to be given the keys - well, it's now been 10 years so this should be the best chance to date, imv (AVB-wise)

Agree 100%

 

[Jurgen the German]

Not at all mate you ask some decent questions which I along with others would like answering. My main gripe is people constantly with this whole next window next window mentality. If we've got ambition we'll sign good players whenever.

Good point. Also there seems to be justification from some posters for sacking numerous managers in not exactly a long stretch of time. Teams that chop and change manager every few season don't often achieve success, unless you are a mega rich club.

 

[jimmyb]

Precedent is very much against that, I'm afraid. There is further lack of objectivity on numerous toher Spurs topics on this very board (today!) - at the end of that day, that is the nature of football discussion and general sports following.

I think part of the problem sees many struggle to differentiate between him as a chairman (overall) and transfer dealings 'main man' - i.e. the two are not necessarily the same (although fundamentally related). Which is why I feel subsequent replies come short of this impartial stance soon after the 'he's having a go at him!' hurdle.

The big problem, as I see it, is that too many fans simply have very little understanding of the kind of decisions that Levy has to make and the options that he has to weigh up.

They have little understanding of business. They have little understanding of money. They have little understanding of risk. They have little understanding of long term strategy. They have little understanding of negotiation.

But that doesn't stop them making uninformed claims about all of the above.

It's understandable. They are fans. They think like fans.

But a chairman of a football club cannot think like a fan.

 

[indianspur]

Who have I 'attacked', Jimmy?

Simply noted how it has become increasingly impossible these days to raise 'concerns' towards our chairman's transfer policy, who in the eyes of some appears to be doing EVERYTHING right and never in the wrong - I don't see the word 'apologist' as provocative or puerile, nor is it considered insulting in my view - simply describes a stance on a subject.

But in your view - is this attack any different to the constant victimisation of posters who window after window express their desperate desire to finally see our manager make a statement in the transfer market (I'm not taking about spending 40m btw) and finally consolidate our position while addressing unbalanced aspects of our squad, only to be shot down by posters to the tune of 'ungrateful', 'unrealistic', and 'detached from reality', 'FM fanboy', etc.. How are those posters any different in their perceived ability to 'handle' others' views? After all - this is a thread about discussing our transfer policy.

In the very next sentence you basically render all input on this message-board irrelevant since none of us appear to really know what's cutting. Hell, why are we here if not to throw about a few opinion and debate Spurs-related topics? I don't agree with his transfer policy in its entirely - if in your view that is seen as an attack on posters such as yourself , then perhaps I need to start re-wording my posts

"I think Levy has done a brilliant job and wouldn't swap him for anyone"

now where have i read that before :-k

I too think he has done a good job but would never go as far as to say "wouldnt swap him for anyone" whilst at the same time question him on and on for not backing his managers

 

[jimmyb]

Who have I 'attacked', Jimmy?

Simply noted how it has become increasingly impossible these days to raise 'concerns' towards our chairman's transfer policy, who in the eyes of some appears to be doing EVERYTHING right and never in the wrong - I don't see the word 'apologist' as provocative or puerile, nor is it considered insulting in my view - simply describes a stance on a subject.

But in your view - is this attack any different to the constant victimisation of posters who window after window express their desperate desire to finally see our manager make a statement in the transfer market (I'm not taking about spending 40m btw) and finally consolidate our position while addressing unbalanced aspects of our squad, only to be shot down by posters to the tune of 'ungrateful', 'unrealistic', and 'detached from reality', 'FM fanboy', etc.. How are those posters any different in their perceived ability to 'handle' others' views? After all - this is a thread about discussing our transfer policy.

In the very next sentence you basically render all input on this message-board irrelevant since none of us appear to really know what's cutting. Hell, why are we here if not to throw about a few opinion and debate Spurs-related topics? I don't agree with his transfer policy in its entirely - if in your view that is seen as an attack on posters such as yourself , then perhaps I need to start re-wording my posts

Come on, fella. Stop being disingenuous. I know you're not stupid. You know perfectly well that describing someone as an "apologist, peddling propaganda" is pejorative language.

The same applies to posters who dismissively shoot down those that criticise Levy. I'm not excusing them.

Discussing transfer policy with an open mind is fine. It's just people getting wound up about it, when they don't have a clue what is actually going on, that is totally illogical.

 

[Jurgen the German]

The big problem, as I see it, is that too many fans simply have very little understanding of the kind of decisions that Levy has to make and the options that he has to weigh up.

They have little understanding of business. They have little understanding of money. They have little understanding of risk. They have little understanding of long term strategy. They have little understanding of negotiation.

But that doesn't stop that posting reams of uninformed nonsense about all of the above.

It's understandable. They are fans. They think like fans.

But a chairman of a football club cannot think like a fan.

Most of what you said may very well be true, but some people do get extremely defensive when people even question Levy, never mind have a go at him.

On any occasion where a poster questions an aspect of Levy's performance, the way he leaves deals to the last minute for example, all you get in return is "look at the rich clubs list! That's Levy". Or if you mention how clubs with less resources still manage to sign players in a window and we don't, they come back with " maybe that's why they're struggling for cash". Now you can't tell me that Levy's habit of leaving deals is the only reason why we are in a good financial state.

 

[jimmyb]

Most of what you said may very well be true, but some people do get extremely defensive when people even question Levy, never mind have a go at him.

On any occasion where a poster questions an aspect of Levy's performance, the way he leaves deals to the last minute for example, all you get in return is "look at the rich clubs list! That's Levy". Or if you mention how clubs with less resources still manage to sign players in a window and we don't, they come back with " maybe that's why they're struggling for cash". Now you can't tell me that Levy's habit of leaving deals is the only reason why we are in a good financial state.

Of course not.

But let me ask you a question. Do you believe that it is mere coincidence or accident that Levy so often leaves deals until the last minute?

And if your answer to that question is no, do you believe that he sees good reason for leaving deals until the last minute?

As a fan, I find it frustrating when we don't sign players or when we sign them later than I feel we should sign them.

But as someone with a little understanding of business, I appreciate that a clever and thorough man like Levy will have very good reasons for doing what he does. Reasons based on intimate knowledge, understanding and experience of the transfer market - all of which we lack.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Of course not.

But let me ask you a question. Do you believe that it is mere coincidence or accident that Levy so often leaves deals until the last minute?

And if your answer to that question is no, do you believe that he sees good reason for leaving deals until the last minute?

As a fan, I find it frustrating when we don't sign players or when we sign them later than I feel we should sign them.

But as someone with a little understanding of business, I appreciate that a clever and thorough man like Levy will have very good reasons for doing what he does. Reasons based on intimate knowledge, understanding and experience of the transfer market - all of which we lack.

You want my take? This may be controversial but I'm not convinced Levy knows a great deal about football. Don't get me wrong, fantastic businessman, but the decision to constantly leave deals late shows a lack of understanding of how football works. We finished a point behind Arsenal last season, when your trying to finish in the top 4, every point counts and you can't give your rivals a head start as we do by not concluding our business earlier. We did it once again with Adebayor this season, possibly one of the reasons he's been so poor is he didn't have a pre season.

I accept sometimes deals take longer than expected for a variety of reasons. But take the Lloris transfer in the summer, we had a deal in place, but Levy tries to be too clever and goes back to Lyon with an offer for LESS MONEY even though they had already accepted a deal.

 

[jimmyb]

You want my take? This may be controversial but I'm not convinced Levy knows a great deal about football. Don't get me wrong, fantastic businessman, but the decision to constantly leave deals late shows a lack of understanding of how football works. We finished a point behind Arsenal last season, when your trying to finish in the top 4, every point counts and you can't give your rivals a head start as we do by not concluding our business earlier. We did it once again with Adebayor this season, possibly one of the reasons he's been so poor is he didn't have a pre season.

I accept sometimes deals take longer than expected for a variety of reasons. But take the Lloris transfer in the summer, we had a deal in place, but Levy tries to be too clever and goes back to Lyon with an offer for LESS MONEY even though they had already accepted a deal.

I disagree. I suspect that Levy knows a great deal about football.

I don't mean that he knows much, if anything, about tactics or the specific strengths and weaknesses of individual players. But he knows (and understands, crucially, since many chairmen don't) the business of football very well. I'm quite certain that he understands that there is a risk to leaving deals late. I'm quite certain that he understands that, in an ideal world, all transfer deals would be concluded swiftly so that signings would be given the optimum amount of time to settle in or, in January, to help the club's performances immediately.

But given that he knows and understands that, he must therefore have very good reasons indeed for leaving so many transfer deals so late. Unlike most fans (and managers, for that matter), Levy sees the big picture; the long term plan. And it seems to me that his transfer policy, like it or not, is geared towards long term growth of the club - even if that might mean the occasional (or even frequent) disappointment in the short term.

As to the Lloris transfer, we only have one side's account of the affair. Aulas is known as something of a loudmouth. Levy is the opposite. But if Levy was inclined to give his version of events, I suspect that it would differ somewhat from that given us by Aulas.

 

[ArcspacE]

But as someone with a little understanding of business, I appreciate that a clever and thorough man like Levy will have very good reasons for doing what he does. Reasons based on intimate knowledge, understanding and experience of the transfer market - all of which we lack.

Here's a classic example, Jimmy - yes the great businessman in him might have saved us a few thousand on Holtby but could well have cost us the FA Cup's 5th Round (hypothetically) and a far bigger potential loss (both financially and on a football level) should we have paid up and brought him a week ago. Same with Lloris and the first 2-3 games of the season. As JtG mentioned - great businessman but what about his footballing acumen?

 

[jimmyb]

Here's a classic example, Jimmy - yes the great businessman in him might have saved us a few thousand on Holtby but could well have cost us the FA Cup's 5th Round (hypothetically) and a far bigger potential loss (both financially and on a football level) should we have paid up and brought him a week ago. Same with Lloris and the first 2-3 games of the season. As JtG mentioned - great businessman but what about his footballing acumen?

Sorry.........but there's no way that a transfer strategy could be determined (or abandoned) on the basis of getting a player in a few days before a game which Spurs ought to have won with their eyes closed anyway.

As others have said, it's so easy to be wise with hindsight. What if we had paid the full £500K extra or so that Schalke wanted just to sign him in time for the Leeds game but then AVB, understandably, started him on the bench and Spurs raced into a 5-0 first half lead, needing only to coast through the rest of the game?

That would have been £500K wasted for want of patience and proper negotiation.

Now imagine such wastage in every transfer deal we conclude. Soon adds up.

 

[ArcspacE]

How do you know it would have been wastage if it meant next round qualification?

What is proper negotiation?

 

[ArcspacE]

Jimmy - in fact, don't bother answering those - it is becoming increasingly clear to your mind Levy can do no wrong and every deal is blessed with extreme precision, proper negotiations and utmost commitment to extracting the best value possible, while in turn scrutinizing every small detail. And we cannot question anything he does because we haven't managed a Premier League club ourselves or signed a professional player so there we have it. If that's how you really feel - fair enough

 

[Crawley]

Jimmy - in fact, don't bother answering those - it is becoming increasingly clear to your mind Levy can do no wrong and every deal is blessed with extreme precision, proper negotiations and utmost commitment to extracting the best value possible, while in turn scrutinizing every small detail. And we cannot question anything he does because we haven't managed a Premier League club ourselves or signed a professional player so there we have it. If that's how you really feel - fair enough

My oh my. Anyone else detect the irony in that post?

 

[Crawley]

In case you're wondering Arcy, it's because you exhibit the exact same sentiments, but against levy rather than for.

 

[ArcspacE]

I'm not 'against' Levy - I have no idea where you read that or where I actually posted it or why you need to polarise everything in pro- or anti- takes. In fact, my first post on the subject today clearly outlined my strong appreciation of his efforts toward the club in general

I simply feel some of his transfer decisions/overall strategy can be questioned (different to his overall chairman doings) and find it increasingly bizarre the turmoil such heresy generates.