Daniel Levy - Chairman

[Bedfordspurs]

I cannot disagree with what you've said, because essentially, you are factually correct. I do think we can employ a certain sense of patterns v conclusive reasoning in many of the trends established.

What are conclusive facts are the failures of his actions with regards to positive results in the following:

Sacking Poch
Hiring Mourinho
Hiring Conte

None resulted in us being better.

I fully accept there is plenty of context to be added to these and all his decisions, and that we do not have a conclusive grasp of the facts surrounding any.

But in terms of raw facts, I think it's safe to make that statement re: those three.

I disagree but only because of context
We don’t know who do what was advising him at varying times
He sacked Poch for a valid reason. Our form was getting bad and the away form was the worst around. I believe Poch earned that season and some others agree with me (you do too) but many fans were behind the under current if he has to go just like they are now
Mou was a good available voice but inn convinced Covid knocked any real investment we could do and was clearly unplanned for
Then as much as I hated conte he is a top coach. We knower he would fudge us up because that’s what’s he does but that doesn’t take away any merit the guy has
All clubs gamble on their signings and the coaches. But if you hire and fire more you can get some right

 

[Bedfordspurs]

It could, there again maybe not mate. One thing is for sure; he was coming, and then he wasn't, and it was sudden!

Yep
I posted here many times it was done and I don’t do that because I’m not ITK and don’t claim to be unless j do
I’ve been fortunate to know some players here and other clubs who have told me things and also some guys locally
But the Dutch link came out do nowhere through a few guys form work who saw a spurs sign in my teams back ground
But I’m not sure how great he would be with what’s we needed to do. What i do know is he comes across as a class act and a great coach

 

[Jurgen the German]

Spurs fans are spoilt little children who expect the best and forget where they came from. Levy / Enic gets criticism and these fans never give credit for where they have taken the club. They seem to forget what the club was like before Levy and co turned up and if they had not turned up we could have quite easily have gone down the road of Leeds. It's pathetic how some of our fans are so shallow minded. I have given up trying to have a conversation with Levy out "fans" because they refuse to listen to the facts and just want to cry about the same old brick.

Levy out fans want a sugar daddy who want to spend billions and they want the club to turn into the teams they often cry about (City, Chelsea etc). They just won't admit it.

In a nutshell, Levy is a 9/10 (arguably a 10/10) in the commercial side of things but he’s a 2/10 when it comes to the football side.

 

[DubSpur]

In a nutshell, Levy is a 9/10 (arguably a 10/10) in the commercial side of things but he’s a 2/10 when it comes to the football side.

So getting us from, at best, being a midtable team to an almost constant qualifier for Europe, close to winning the league, and runners up in the CL rates as a 2/10??

Out of curiosity would have getting over the line in an extra one or two finals etc jumped him up much?

 

[thfcsteff]

I think it is very important to say here that I do NOT think Levy has ANYTHING other than very, very good intentions. I genuinely believe he wants the best for everything. I don't think of him as such evil underminer trying to bring the club down whilst he snaffles piles of wonga. Not at all. I think he has some brilliant skill sets (which he certainly does not need me to justify for him LOL), but I equally think he has some huge blindspots when it comes to football. It is -as we know- a business like no other.

What is interesting is whether the gradual intercession of football and business in the traditional sense (for purposes of discussion, the American 'franchise' sense) will end up fully blending? If so, the model upon which we are built could well have its day. I'm talking global leagues, salary caps, new competitions where no-one ever gets relegated, a place where (say) the Premier League becomes a full 'product' like the NFL is. Because if that is the case, then we will have our day before (some of us here) turn to dust.

When we look back at the history of the stadium, it's interesting to note the Stratford affair. I have always believed it was a ruse to squeeze more out of Haringay. I am now not so sure that if Daniel had not been surrounded by people pointing out to him the spiritually suicidal nature of the move, he wouldn't have done it because the numbers made it a very attractive model to achieve the goal of a new stadium. And I don't think it would've been because he doesn't care and only wanted the best deal, I think it'd have been because he wanted the best deal so why wouldn't you? The logic of football is somewhat illogical, and I think that has always been a huge blindspot for him.

I have heard, and know personally, many stories of his unwavering commitment to excellence with regards to how we are run as a club and the stadium project. It is relentless and totally unquestionable. He is very very committed. It is why I can never fully get on board with the 'out' mob, because it simply isn't right. Equally, his behaviour in the football side has frustrated me forever. But he is who he is. I largely choose to accept the huge positives, and pray that somewhere/somehow, the football side can work despite his instincts.

It is why Pochettino represented such a huge, huge moment and opportunity. It is why June 1st 2019 broke a small piece of my Tottenham heart, and why Nov 19th 2019 broke another. We got so, so close to the impossible model.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

I think it is very important to say here that I do NOT think Levy has ANYTHING other than very, very good intentions. I genuinely believe he wants the best for everything. I don't think of him as such evil underminer trying to bring the club down whilst he snaffles piles of wonga. Not at all. I think he has some brilliant skill sets (which he certainly does not need me to justify for him LOL), but I equally think he has some huge blindspots when it comes to football. It is -as we know- a business like no other.

What is interesting is whether the gradual intercession of football and business in the traditional sense (for purposes of discussion, the American 'franchise' sense) will end up fully blending? If so, the model upon which we are built could well have its day. I'm talking global leagues, salary caps, new competitions where no-one ever gets relegated, a place where (say) the Premier League becomes a full 'product' like the NFL is. Because if that is the case, then we will have our day before (some of us here) turn to dust.

When we look back at the history of the stadium, it's interesting to note the Stratford affair. I have always believed it was a ruse to squeeze more out of Haringay. I am now not so sure that if Daniel had not been surrounded by people pointing out to him the spiritually suicidal nature of the move, he wouldn't have done it because the numbers made it a very attractive model to achieve the goal of a new stadium. And I don't think it would've been because he doesn't care and only wanted the best deal, I think it'd have been because he wanted the best deal so why wouldn't you? The logic of football is somewhat illogical, and I think that has always been a huge blindspot for him.

I have heard, and know personally, many stories of his unwavering commitment to excellence with regards to how we are run as a club and the stadium project. It is relentless and totally unquestionable. He is very very committed. It is why I can never fully get on board with the 'out' mob, because it simply isn't right. Equally, his behaviour in the football side has frustrated me forever. But he is who he is. I largely choose to accept the huge positives, and pray that somewhere/somehow, the football side can work despite his instincts.

It is why Pochettino represented such a huge, huge moment and opportunity. It is why June 1st 2019 broke a small piece of my Tottenham heart, and why Nov 19th 2019 broke another. We got so, so close to the impossible model.

Nailed a lot there
Clubs can’t do it the right way anymore because the clubs themselves have allows it to happen
So a self sufficient club sticking with pin the rules and delivering a major trophy is almost, almost impossible
Pool are doing it though and I hate that club, but credit where is is due
But they stick with the plan there and back it to work
New guy comes in and can’t get the target they want so they wait
That’s the kind of patience we as fans and key as a chairman could learn from

 

[Yiddo]

I cannot disagree with what you've said, because essentially, you are factually correct. I do think we can employ a certain sense of patterns v conclusive reasoning in many of the trends established.

What are conclusive facts are the failures of his actions with regards to positive results in the following:

Sacking Poch
Hiring Mourinho
Hiring Conte

None resulted in us being better.

I fully accept there is plenty of context to be added to these and all his decisions, and that we do not have a conclusive grasp of the facts surrounding any.

But in terms of raw facts, I think it's safe to make that statement re: those three.

Are they mistakes if the fans caused the toxic atmosphere and a lot of the fans wanted these managers to be sacked? surely thats not all on Levy as his hands were always pushed in these situations, Jol probably not but the ones you have pointed out.

 

[Batspur]

Are they mistakes if the fans caused the toxic atmosphere and a lot of the fans wanted these managers to be sacked? surely thats not all on Levy as his hands were always pushed in these situations, Jol probably not but the ones you have pointed out.

Who appointed those ridiculous managers?

End of the day you have to look at who has been in charge for nearly a quarter of a century. Who has made historically bad football decisions?

The buck should have stopped 15 years ago at least. But we have a dictator. From Jol to Kane . From Poch to Nuno. From Carrick to Bale.

It's all one man's decision. I still can't get my head around any mature fan still thinking he can be a successful owner of our club.

It's just ludicrous. He has failed in every single action as an MD.

 

[Jurgen the German]

So getting us from, at best, being a midtable team to an almost constant qualifier for Europe, close to winning the league, and runners up in the CL rates as a 2/10??

Out of curiosity would have getting over the line in an extra one or two finals etc jumped him up much?

That’s the positives as you see them but it doesn’t mention the litany of crap decisions he’s made on the football side.

 

[Batspur]

That’s the positives as you see them but it doesn’t mention the litany of crap decisions he’s made on the football side.

If he had a brain Tottenham Hotspur would be one of the most successful teams in the world.

He has squandered any legacy he wanted to achieve. The most useless chairman ever. He had everything. We've achieved nothing under his stewardship.

The biggest debt in world football...but...but....it's leveraged. A two year delay on delivering the stadium at twice the cost. But...but ..he bought some cranes. fudges sake.


The guy is a loser. He's made us a banter club. We are laughed at. Forest, Ipswich, Leicester fans laugh at us. We are sexy. A total joke. A quarter of a century from this idiot dictating his plans. But still folks queuing up to defend the fool.

 

[Lemonade Money]

Some decent appointments (mixed with some really bad ones) but none of them given proper backing when the going got tough and some terrible lurches from one style to another....

Jol.... Levy didn't listen to Arnesen who said Jol should get the gig and instead brought in Santini. We then wasted the start of the season under Santini before Jol came in after 13 games and turned it around, we missed out on UEFA Cup football by just 2 points. Had Levy listened to the man that actually knew about football we likely would've been back in Europe a season earlier. Jol then got us successive 5th place finishes in the league to get us European football 2 years in a row (would likely have been three if Levy had listed to Arnesen) only for his position to be completely undermined only 2 games into the following season when John Alexander and Paul Kemsley were photographed in a Spanish hotel with Ramos who then claimed that we had made him a "dizzying offer" to become our manager.

In addition to the above I can't help but wonder whether Levy not listening to Arnesen here played a part in his departure to Chelsea? Imagine having Arnesen's proven football experience only to have your recommendation ignored by Daniel Levy?

Ramos - got a Cup, then got his best two players sold and completely inadequately replaced and then sacked when results went south largely as a result of that.

Harry - did an absolutely fantastic job at Spurs, lifted the whole club, but then got the sack anyway after finishes of 4th, 5th, 4th because Levy couldn't swallow his pride that an Englishman might want to manage his country. Another terrible decision.

AVB - disastrous failure at Chelsea, quite what it was about his failure at Chelsea that indicated that he would be a good option for us I have no idea. Did reasonably well in the first season (just one place worse than Redknapp) didn't get the players that he asked for and then was sacked after about a quarter of his second season.

Poch - best manager the club has had since ENIC took over. Wasn't the chairman's first choice but at least he was on the list. Did an absolutely remarkable job with finishes of 5th, 3rd, 2nd, 3rd, 4th (and a CL final) with a fraction of the resources of the top clubs. Operated during a period when our chairman had allowed our recruitment department and budget to be cut to the bone. Unceremoniously sacked as soon as it looked like we might miss out on Europe for a season, something the man had more than earned. An appalling decision and a terrible way to treat the man who was mostly responsible for Levy's massive overspend on the stadium project not putting the club into serious financial trouble.

Jose - a terrible appointment. Showed how poisonous he was in his second spell at Chelsea and also at Man Utd. The chairman then compounded his terrible mistake in hiring him by making another one in firing him both far too late but then also just too early! (firing him just before the cup final was absolutely crazy and laid bare the fact that winning trophies was not anything like a priority for THFC!)

Nuno - perfection of a manager search over the summer that ended up with us getting about our 14th choice manager. Sacked as soon as 'Levy out/ENIC out" chants were very audible in the stadium. I love the way that you call the 'fans/media' dumbasses instead of concentrating on the man that makes the decisions at our club.

Conte - a good appointment that should've been made the summer that Nuno came in. Fact he didn't want the job in the summer but was fine to take it a few months' later suggests to me that the financial offer (and perhaps transfer budget promised) had changed in the interim. Why?

Some good points, but I will counter your obvious bias with the following:
The no 'proper backing' was largely due to not bankrupting the club and/or building the stadium, so we could be sitting here bemoaning the club being docked points/where's the stadium he promised/was a cup worth it?
Interesting point about Arnesen, but he no doubt got a 'dizzying offer' from Chelsea, and didn't stay long there either.
Ledley said Ramos never prepared for league games, and was only bothered about cups, and there were rumours his head was elsewhere by the second season. And like you said, Redknapp did fantastic with the 'completely inadequately' replenished squad.
I'm not getting into the Poch debate.

 

[thfcsteff]

Are they mistakes if the fans caused the toxic atmosphere and a lot of the fans wanted these managers to be sacked? surely thats not all on Levy as his hands were always pushed in these situations, Jol probably not but the ones you have pointed out.

Yes, they are mistakes in my book. His hands are only pushed when he feels they're being pushed.

 

[afsoc4life]

I ignore posts and posters who refuse to give credit to Levy for anything. Has he made silly decisions? Yes. I was very disappointed with the timing of Jose's sack. I didn't like how Jol was dumped. Has he made good decisions? Yes. The standard of the club's facilities is up there. He hired Pochettino and gave him a chance.

To blame him for selling players in the past is ridiculous. The way some posters make their points nowadays has me very worried. Life is not black and white. There are grey areas and one must always remember that even we are making decisions or logical conclusions based on the information or data we have (which is at best incomplete).

 

[thfcsteff]

I ignore posts and posters who refuse to give credit to Levy for anything. Has he made silly decisions? Yes. I was very disappointed with the timing of Jose's sack. I didn't like how Jol was dumped. Has he made good decisions? Yes. The standard of the club's facilities is up there. He hired Pochettino and gave him a chance.

To blame him for selling players in the past is ridiculous. The way some posters make their points nowadays has me very worried. Life is not black and white. There are grey areas and one must always remember that even we are making decisions or logical conclusions based on the information or data we have (which is at best incomplete).

I think this is all so true.
In Levy's case, the dialectic principle works.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Well most of them were absolutely knackered after a lot of them going to the very last weekend of the World Cup and then also going a full PL season and all the way to the Champions League final without a single player in the squad being refreshed (and losing an important one in Dembele). The reason for Eriksen's change has always been clear IMO. He had told the club he wasn't going to sign a new contract and wanted a move. The manager wanted to bring in Grealish to replace him only to be let down (again) by the recruitment team (or more pertinently one person).

Additionally when you have a manager openly saying that a (painful) rebuild is required it doesn't always go down great with the existing squad. He's been proven right since though hasn't he? We absolutely needed a rebuild and we've since cycled through a whole bunch of inferior (for us) managers rebuilding ever since.

History is a narrative. One man’s story: his-story.

Poch lost his job primarily as the club let him call the shots with transfers - he had earnt it and wanted greater control, Poch refreshed our midfield with Ndombele and LeCelco. 100m of crap. These two signings lost Poch his job.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Yep
I posted here many times it was done and I don’t do that because I’m not ITK and don’t claim to be unless j do
I’ve been fortunate to know some players here and other clubs who have told me things and also some guys locally
But the Dutch link came out do nowhere through a few guys form work who saw a spurs sign in my teams back ground
But I’m not sure how great he would be with what’s we needed to do. What i do know is he comes across as a class act and a great coach

Fans act as though a manager is everything. But he is only as good as the players at his disposal.

 

[DubSpur]

That’s the positives as you see them but it doesn’t mention the litany of crap decisions he’s made on the football side.

I'm not saying he's 10/10. For me a 2/10 would be taking us backwards, towards relegation and not to our highest average finish in the league. Looks to me that you are ignoring all positives and just considering the negatives.

 

[parklane1]

I ignore posts and posters who refuse to give credit to Levy for anything. Has he made silly decisions? Yes. I was very disappointed with the timing of Jose's sack. I didn't like how Jol was dumped. Has he made good decisions? Yes. The standard of the club's facilities is up there. He hired Pochettino and gave him a chance.

To blame him for selling players in the past is ridiculous. The way some posters make their points nowadays has me very worried. Life is not black and white. There are grey areas and one must always remember that even we are making decisions or logical conclusions based on the information or data we have (which is at best incomplete).

That sums up my feeling about Levy as well but i doubt there is anyone on here who has not made silly/bad decisions in their life and workplace. As for the rest of your post i do agree with he has done wonders for our club and and its a lot more good then bad.

We live in a age where [ SOME] fans think they know how clubs are run and will bitch and bitch because they believe they know better. To be honest most of the fans on this board are more rounded with their opinions but the rest of social media is full of kneejerkers and arseholes [ it reminds me of that old saying EMPTY VESSELS MAKE THE MOST NOISE].

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

We live in a age where [ SOME] fans think they know how clubs are run and will bitch and bitch because they believe they know better

Tbh I think the majority give me the complete opposite impression. (given their wants and desires)

 

[thfcsteff]

History is a narrative. One man’s story: his-story.

Poch lost his job primarily as the club let him call the shots with transfers - he had earnt it and wanted greater control, Poch refreshed our midfield with Ndombele and LeCelco. 100m of crap. These two signings lost Poch his job.

I disagree 100%.
What lost Poch his job was -
a) Levy's obsession with Mourinho
b) Mourinho's incessant flirting with Levy post-CL Final
c) Levy's inability to stick with decisions he'd made

He gave the manager two players he wanted. Poch had been trying to refresh the side for two seasons. Suddenly gets two at once (albeit Lo Celso was initially a loan signing on deadline as I remember meaning he missed pre-season). He then sacked him three months later. It shows that either he was so obsessed with getting Mourinho that he sacked Poch for that, or he suffered transactional 'business' mentality in so much as 'I got you two players, they are not working yet, fans are complaining, out you go.'

Either way, I personally think blaming those signings is erroneous. Poch always said Ndombele would need time...