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Coronavirus

It’s reverse racism with the non EU vs EU thing
Most people don’t want the brown skinned people being very naive that there the ones who will save their lives
And the minimum wage threshold will give opportunities for others to get back to work in the lower paid unskilled jobs
It’s already been exercised in construction as they see it coming

and it was incredibly hard for them to get here under EU rules which changed a lot over time

we have under the EU a tiered system so a EU National is tier 1 and an Indian for example is tier 2 and needs sponsoring to work here

The EU have never controlled non-EU migration. That is I00% on the UK. We let in as many people from non-EU nations as we want. Currently, and for the last few years, non-EU migrants have far exceeded EU migrants.

What is interesting is the immigration thing is becoming outdated. It was a core issue used by those campaigning for Brexit, and then they distanced themselves from it. Farrage was up front - he is happy to say he used immigration to get Brexit over the line. Perceptions around immigration seem to be changing?

The UK will need some immigrants. We don't have people willing to care for the elderly in homes and clean up after them. We don't have people willing to breathe in toxic fumes and work for a pittance on building sites. Or people who will pick fruit. Maybe post Corona, we'll all be begging farmers to give us a job. You never know.
 
The EU have never controlled non-EU migration. That is I00% on the UK. We let in as many people from non-EU nations as we want. Currently, and for the last few years, non-EU migrants have far exceeded EU migrants.

What is interesting is the immigration thing is becoming outdated. It was a core issue used by those campaigning for Brexit, and then they distanced themselves from it. Farrage was up front - he is happy to say he used immigration to get Brexit over the line. Perceptions seem to be changing?

The UK will need some immigrants. We don't have people willing to care for the elderly in homes and clean up after them. We don't have people willing to breathe in toxic fumes and work for a pittance on building sites. Or people who will pick fruit. Maybe post Corona, we'll all be begging farmers to give us job. You never know.
Of course we need immigrants it when I’ve tried to employ people from ex colonised countries with suitable qualifications we have to get a tiered EU visa
That’s been in place for years
We don’t and isn’t for someone from Hungary for example
That visa costs money and is a risk and there are varying levels (4 I think). That’s EU rules not UK rules (unless my HR were telling me lies)
Don’t think for one second I’m anti anyone coming here and adding value, i welcome it. But I also don’t get why it was made so hard for people from countries we robbed

I work with loads of South Africans and it a mare for them to get a visa here too
 
Of course we need immigrants it when I’ve tried to employ people from ex colonised countries with suitable qualifications we have to get a tiered EU visa
That’s been in place for years
We don’t and isn’t for someone from Hungary for example
That visa costs money and is a risk and there are varying levels (4 I think). That’s EU rules not UK rules (unless my HR were telling me lies)
Don’t think for one second I’m anti anyone coming here and adding value, i welcome it. But I also don’t get why it was made so hard for people from countries we robbed

I work with loads of South Africans and it a mare for them to get a visa here too

I think your HR were telling you porkies. Why would the EU control immigration from non-EU nations? The immigration system we have in place for visas for those from outside the EU is UK law. UK controlled. We could have changed how we issue visas to non-EU immigrants at any time.
 
I think your HR were telling you porkies. Why would the EU control immigration from non-EU nations? The immigration system we have in place for visas is UK law. UK controlled. We could have changed how we issue visas to non-EU immigrants at any time.
Maybe
Was always told it was EU law as EU nationals don’t apply for visas
 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52095331

A coronavirus app that alerts people if they have recently been in contact with someone testing positive for the virus "could play a critical role" in limiting lockdowns, scientists advising the government have said.

The location-tracking tech would enable a week's worth of manual detective work to be done in an instant, they say.

But the academics say no-one should be forced to enrol - at least initially.

UK health chiefs have confirmed they are exploring the idea.

"NHSX is looking at whether app-based solutions might be helpful in tracking and managing coronavirus, and we have assembled expertise from inside and outside the organisation to do this as rapidly as possible," said the tech-focused division's chief Matthew Gould.

Instant alerts
The study by the team at the University of Oxford's Big Data Institute and Nuffield Department of Population Health was published in the journal Science.

It proposes that an app would record people's GPS location data as they move about their daily lives. This would be supplemented by users scanning QR (quick response) codes posted to public amenities in places where a GPS signal is inadequate, as well as Bluetooth signals.

If a person starts feeling ill, it is suggested they use the app to request a home test. And if it comes back positive for Covid-19, then an instant signal would be sent to everyone they had been in close contact with over recent days.

Those people would be advised to self-isolate for a fortnight, but would not be told who had triggered the warning.

_111486864_social_contacting_app_2_-3x640v-nc.png

In addition, the test subject's workplace and their transport providers could be told to carry out a decontamination clean-up.

"The constrictions that we're currently under place [many people] under severe strain," said the paper's co-lead Prof Christophe Fraser.

"Therefore if you have the ability with a bit more information and the use of an app to relax a lockdown, that could provide very substantial and direct benefits.

"Also I think a substantial number of lives can be saved."

To encourage take-up, it is suggested the app also acts as a hub for coronavirus-related health services and serves as a means to request food and medicine deliveries.

The academics note that similar smartphone software has already been deployed in China. It was also voluntary there, but users were allowed to go into public spaces or on public transport only if they had installed it.

One of the ethics specialists involved in the Oxford study said he did not think similar arrangements would be appropriate in the UK, but added that private enterprises might still impose restrictions.

"My favourite restaurant might ask me to show that I was low-risk before allowing me into a crowded place, and I think that would be a perfectly reasonable price to pay for this step towards returning to normal life," Prof Michael Parker told the BBC.

He added that employers might also be justified in requiring staff to use the app if they worked "in an old people's home, with vulnerable groups or [were based] in very crowded places".

And while he said that the general public should not be compelled to use the app to begin with, he did not rule this out if the majority failed to do so.

"The key question is - does it require everyone to do it for it to be effective?" Prof Parker explained.

"It's not essential that everyone does... but perhaps a high proportion of the population needs to.

"This is a really unusual situation where lives are at risk, so there is a case to be made to make at least some actions compulsory - but there would need to be a really clear case for that and careful oversight."

Extended range
The paper adds that the app could be updated to tackle the pandemic more aggressively if required.

For example, it says, the stay-at-home alerts could be expanded to second or even third-degree contacts.

And while the paper advocates the app being used in conjunction with home tests, Prof Fraser said his team was currently exploring whether it would still be effective if it relied on people using a questionnaire or 111 helpline advisers to diagnose the condition.

He acknowledged some people might be wary of using the service, but hoped they would do so to "save a lot of lives".

"We already have tracking apps on our phones for more trivial tasks - the reason we have live traffic information is because we allow the people that provide the mapping service to track us," he said.

"What we're suggesting here is essentially sharing anonymised information [to] put to good use."
yeah-thats-going.jpg
 
It's surprising to read that a lot of people on here have bought into the "Premier League" view on history i.e. nothing happened before it. Most immigrants to this country from the 16th century onwards started at the bottom of the pile, I know my ancestors from Ireland and Germany in the 19th century did. This has happen in virtually every country in the world but it's only the British who can be blamed for it. It has always made me mad that actions taken by the ruling classes are laid at my door.
 
At least folks appreciate migrant workers some more now. Was quite different a couple of years ago.

Yeah. As well as bashing immigration, it was only a couple of years ago that Boris and Gove were telling us that they and the public had “had enough of experts” too.

They’d be pretty fudged without them now, given that Patrick Vallance and Chris Whitty are basically running the country.

Funny how things turn out.
 
It is a funny world, run on PR and words. Obama was hugely slick and a PR dream which largely masks his mistakes where as Boris makes mistakes and his are exposed because his PR is to some poor.

Funny old world
 
Yeah. As well as bashing immigration, it was only a couple of years ago that Boris and Gove were telling us that they and the public had “had enough of experts” too.

They’d be pretty fudged without them now, given that Patrick Vallance and Chris Whitty are basically running the country.

Funny how things turn out.

Despite Boris, Cummings and Gove being the team behind Brexit, I don't dislike them. That said, it is clear this government - trusting their experts? - were not agile enough. Fair play they changed track, from herd immunity, which is what Sweden seems to be following, to a contain approach. But either way, we needed them to act fast and think ahead. And this government with experts or not, didn't.

We don't have testing kit - for me this is the biggest bo bo of the lot. The WHO made it simple saying "test, test, test" about a month back. We still can't test many NHS workers. Wtf!? 1 in 4 NHS staff are off, and the small number of tests carried out, suggests only 15% of those isolating have the virus!

Our government had time to address this. They failed so far. If there are shortages of chemicals for testing, commander some planes, send representatives to the factories in China... Whatever. Do what you have to do and fast. Ventilators are maybe not as crucial. To be frank, those that require them, don't always pull through, and I don't think they save as many lives as we initially thought. Though of course, the UK needs more, and this government did drop the ball on that too.

We can't go back, so now hopefully we get the testing going, both to track the virus, and to allow those with antibodies to help others. Going back to your experts point - how can we not have testing facilities when there are supposed experts telling Bojo and chums what to do? Germany is testing our total corona tests since this began, every week. Is our government on top of this, thinking ahead, acting fast? Not yet.
 
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There is an argument to suggest that it doesn’t take every country to work on testing as long as they share the method once it’s discovered.

If you can but ventilators from Dubai you can ask Germany for their method of testing if they get their first and have been working longer.

Thats just a theory
 
I like theories. But there are tests to check if people have the virus - we know how to. The government have simply failed to buy enough chemicals that the test uses, or put in place the infrastructure to carry out the testing. That really is poor.

That mistake not to buy or make the required chemicals will ultimately cost many lives. Cost many billions. And will leave the UK paralysed for longer.
 
Yeh mistakes will be and have been made, that’s life unfortunately and Boris will have to answer the hard questions.

Someone said to me today, it’s ok to not do everything right during a global pandemic crisis and I think that’s true of everyone to an extent.

I truly believe politics is a set of circumstance a lot of the time, it’s how you react and to a man or woman most leaders make mistakes because by nature of any incident you could always do more, always.

The danger is we lose sight of today moaning about what might of been and in this case we need to all do our bit.
 
I like theories. But there are tests to check if people have the virus - we know how to. The government have simply failed to buy enough chemicals that the test uses, or put in place the infrastructure to carry out the testing. That really is poor.

That mistake not to buy or make the required chemicals will ultimately cost many lives. Cost many billions. And will leave the UK paralysed for longer.
Gove the Toad telling porkies again it seems!

 
There is an argument to suggest that it doesn’t take every country to work on testing as long as they share the method once it’s discovered.

If you can but ventilators from Dubai you can ask Germany for their method of testing if they get their first and have been working longer.

Thats just a theory
Hopefully we can appropriate something like this Israeli system to finally speed up testing in April

 
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