There is too much to go through, so I'll focus on the Ancelotti part. yes he's won a lot of trophies, but at clubs that historically win a lot of trophies. he was head coach and not manager when working in Italy. As I pointed out to you, he won 2 titles in 10 years with Milan and Juve. You say that makes him a winner, but as I also pointed out, in the previous 10 years, those clubs won 8 titles. In terms of league football, he didn't show himself to be a great coach. Look at the player he had for a start. Nesta, Maldini, Seedorf, Sheva, Rui Costa, Kaka, Cafu, Pirlo, Gattuso, Costacurta and many others. There is simply non relation between winning titles with that lot and finishing top 4 at Spurs. Milan are regular title winners, as they are one of the biggest clubs in football and have always attracted the best players. It's not as if Ancelotti took over after they'd had a period in the wilderness and restored them to their former glories.
You say we were third and 10 points clear as if we were given this lead at the start of the season. To get to the point where we were 10 points clear Ancelotti would have had to match our run winning 10 and drawing 1 without defeat. The chances of him or any other manager getting close to that are slim to say the least. We won 31 out of a possible 33 points! The previous season Ancelotti had a better more experienced squad of players at Chelsea and the best he ever managed from an 11 games run was 23 points. He wasn't not trying. I said previously he got 72 points, but it was actually 71. If he could manage that with the squad he had at Cheslea, what makes you think he'd get over 60 points with our squad?
It seems your argument is that he won things at other clubs, so would take us to new heights. But there is no evidence at all that he's capable of doing this. All we know from his career that when having the best players his league placings on average have probably been lower than they should have been. If he's so capable then why do PSG need to spend extraordinary amounts of money? Why not let Carlo do his thing? How did he manage to not win the league last season, especially given they were in 1st place when he took over?
At the end of the day we've seen time and time again that what a coach has won at one club, especially in Europe, means little when it comes to managing in the Premier League. We saw it first hand with Ramos. It was so obvious that Monchi and the squad he built was the key to Sevilla's success. But so many fans, Comolli and Levy just ignored it and believed that Ramos was some master coach and his undistinguished career prior to Sevilla was just him warming up or something.
If you can't see from his time at Chelsea and in Italy that Ancelotti is as dependent on having quality players and huge amounts of money to spend then I don't know what else to say.
Were you in support of the removal of Jol and appointment of Ramos? Also did you back firing Harry and were you pleased with the appointment of AVB?
In turn, a lot to address. I'll address the issue of Ancelotti, us being 3rd and why I think a manager of his calibre would've done better. Put simply, they KNOW how to WIN. Our incumbent at that time was, frankly, in uncharted territories. I repeat, I believe that had he been able to focus, he would've SEEN what was going wrong/the small details that became big problems, and we would've finished 3rd. He wasn't capable of doing so, and for the second season running, we lost what should've been a guaranteed CL place. People are satisfied with that. I believe that for the squad he had, and the opportunities he had to sign world class players, it was the very very least we should've expected. I will never, ever be convinced we over-achieved with him, in fact, I believe we under-achieved. You (and many others) speak of Ramos as a total and utter failure, yet this "failure" came in, addressed a mental shortfall at the club with regards to winning big matches, won a massive match (a FINAL) using a combination of squad, confidence and astute tactical knowledge. He tried very very hard to change the culture. He (with Comolli and Levy) identified and snagged Luka Modric, only to see 52 million pounds worth of striker evaporate before his eyes. It was the first instance of some very bad luck that we publicly saw(there were strong rumours that Ramos had already been hit with a massive personal crisis back home in Spain) and after that, yes, between the new signings and the outgoings, it was a collective failure which Ramos most certainly didn't do anything to help. I talked with Clive Allen for some time a month before he got the tin-tack, and the upshot of the conversation was that Ramos had excellent ideas but had been shafted with the whole Keane and Berbatov thing. I further got the impression that communication was the major issue (not necessarily being understood, but on all sides, from direction to the cultural belief that players should look after themselves to the very best of their ability). Poyet didn't really help matters at all (much written about already). And thus he lost the dressing room. Few points and no ketchup in the canteen doth not a happy British-based player make! I will always wonder what he saw in Bentley, but aside from that, I don't actually subscribe to the view that he was a total, and utter, failure. Under him, we had players who learned how to win a trophy! The squad he had was always going to be decent once it gelled. Enter Harry. Who did for us what he did. Gave us enormous confidence, used his superb ability to empathize and communicate with players to the very very max, gave Bale the nurturing he needed on a human basis, figured out how to organize the side and let the rest take care of itself. Harry was enormously clever. I don't want to go into Harry stuff any further here mate, it's been a touchy subject and I am one of the people who becomes a magnet for arguments, but would be delighted to have a PM chat about his time if you're interested (I'd equally be interested in your views on his tenure). What I will say is that the unquestionable fact I personally witnessed under Harry, was winning our biggest match in 25 years or so at Eastlands with a superb performance that remains one of my top moments watching Spurs (this includes the early early 80s glory days). I will never forget that night and always thank him for his enormous part in it. What I can never forgive are the mistakes he made which he never copped to, and the way in which he repeatedly took his eye off the ball.
With regards to Jol, yes, I felt he had taken us as far as he could. He simply could not ever win the big match. And yes, I had felt a certain degree of antipathy towards Harry for some of his behaviours, and watching him hitch his skirt and ignore the glittering prize that was his present (at that time) job left me feeling enormous negativity. I always said a little bit of self-criticism, honesty and apology might've been the difference. Instead, he flip-flopped and tried to play the club using his friends in the media (all IMHO - trust me, I'm already tinkling off some people by airing this view and I'll hear about it).
I was pleased with the appointment of AVB. Time will tell if I drank the cool-aid or if he actually has a master-plan. But as you would doubtless agree, in top flight football the devil is in the details, the nuances. One thing your friend Ancelotti would've known last season was that despite the importance of keeping it simple and fresh, it is also important to know your enemy. The tactics at Arsenal (the match which cost us 3rd IMHO) were unforgivable for a top-level coach. I'll explain if you'd like, but I think deep down you'd agree. As for the match at Villa (when through their own stuttering incompetance, the goons had actually given us a chance to get it back!!!) we found ourselves stuck in a match against vastly inferior opposition where we were unable, for some reason, to start at pace OR have a tactical plan to work around a side content to sit deep and defend. Let's face it, this was not an uncommon problem. These are moments when the next-level coaches find a way. Because there are simply some matches where you have to have a plan 'B' or adjust your style to contain the opposition I will never ever understand what happened at the Bernabeu for example. I will never understand why, when we saw the excellent TEAM role the much-maligned Pienaar played in Milan, we could not get him on the pitch to do similar at the Bernabeu. Top coaches realize that fantasy football cannot always be played if you want to win important matches, and it is something that the likes of Mourinho clearly recognize.
Your point about money and top players is absolutely noted. The fact is that Mancini was given the financial (and calendar) latitude to succeed and even then barely, barely struggled over the finishing line. But he has, over the seasons, developed another dimension to his work. He has grown and continues to grow.
The comparisons between AVB and Ramos are unnerving in a couple of senses. Both were left with players that needed shifting, and both lost centre-piece talents. In AVB's case, I genuinely feel sorry for him in the sense that he made it very very clear that he wanted Moutinho, and for whatever excuse, we didn't get that deal done (I am a Levy fan, but that was a major major fudge up regardless of the politics - we should've done the business earlier). I sincerely hope he is given the time to impose his view and will on the club as from what I've seen, it is one which will lead us to great long-term success. I admit to being worried about his communicative skills, and further, I hope he shows a willingness to be flexible and understand that some players needs warm man-management not iron-fisted do-as-you're-told.
In closing this part of the discussion, yes, your points are interesting to consider. Ancelotti and Mourinho have not slummed it for a couple of decades, though in Mourinho's case, we could say he delivered Chelsea what they hadn't ever had and in Portugal delivered the seemingly impossible. Yes, they are clever, smart men, going where they know they will have a war-chest. But equally they are men who are prepared to take on the hottest of hot-seats. I personally feel that either of them would've been a wonderful appointment for us, and personally prayed that we would be in the CL, that Harry would get his beloved England job and that Levy would wave a 60million warchest at Mourinho and he would come. It wasn't as pie-in-the-sky/dreamer as it might sound; we did have preliminary talks with Mourinho's people when that scenario looked like happening, and there was interest from the other direction. Who knows if it would've happened in the end? But one thing's for sure. Unless we win something/finish in the CL places this season, I wouldn't bet against us (sadly) having a chat in a year's time about how Mourinho is managing Bale at Madrid...again, happy to go to PM if you'd like to continue the conversation in certain areas. Best...
