Ange in or out?

[Mrs Vert]

I'd like to see the stats of subs used compared to whether we win, lose or draw games. I think there is a pattern where winning means more subs, whereas losing means less subs. You're also implying that subs are late in games. I've always questioned Ange with regards to subs and whether he trusts his next 5 or 6 players.

Yeh I dont think he does. Which makes me thinks some of the players we bought. He not a fan of. All well and good wanting teens and building for future. But we also need players for the now.

If our subs bench are too busy watching Dora the explorer. Then we better accept we ain't winning anything soon and hope we don't keep dropping in the league. We have a manger who plays in a way that supports inflicting injuries. And I thought by 2nd season everyone is use to it. I guess it don't help having extra internationals ...but whatever

 

[Mrs Vert]

Given that we have not won one since 2008, for the sake of not blowing up something this club committed to 18 months ago, and which with the current model will take some time, I'll take my chances and stick.

And if we go down caretaker route. We def ain't winning with Mason

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Are you forgetting about the airshot Palmer inexplicably missed in the first half that 9/10 times he would bury? Or the Jackson one on one where Dragusin did well to recover from?

No
I’m just quoting the details based on shots taken
I can’t really allow for things didn’t happen
Surely 9/10 Sonny doesn’t miss the one on ones, no?

 

[jamonserrano]

The only reason I want to keep Ange is the fear of Southgate.

 

[Mrs Vert]

I've never been one to call for a manager's head; I'll usually advocate for patience, but this guy doesn't want to learn and I can see this turning into another Christian Gross situation, only this time around we won't have a Klinsmann to take control on the pitch at Selhurst. He's got to go for me, it's just a matter of when and what state we'll have left ourselves in by the time the trigger gets pulled.

The thing is he tweaked it when he really wanted to beat City and help Arsenal win the league......so he has it in him. Just not seen much of it since. Which to be honest irks me

 

[Mrs Vert]

You need high quality eggs to make a world class omelette.

And we buy from Lidle

 

[glasgowspur]

What about the air hostesses though? And what type of snacks are being served?

Margot Robbie and karine vanesse from pan am serving olives, hot dough balls with a hot sweet tomato sauce and steamed seabass on bed of sliced potato for the in flight meal.
Bookings now being taken, get in quick, limited availability.

 

[Baleforce]

You need high quality eggs to make a world class omelette.

If you don’t have the right ingredients, pick a different recipe.

 

[SpurMeUp]

Picking up on @Baleforce and @glasgowspur analogies I think Angel’s side is better compared to a racing car. Maybe a Colin Chapman Lotus.

A stripped out (light) setup to give it as much chance as winning as possible, the car/team is always close to breaking. Plenty of racing cars take it too far and light weight components break with the car not winning the race. But long term the race teams who try to push the boundaries are the teams that win. They come back and refine the parts to be light and strong enough, and then they get it right, with a winning advantage.

We don’t want to be the safe side in the middle of the pack. We should be aiming high and aspiring to outplay Chelsea, City, Pool etc. you don’t do that by being safe.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Why can't we get a balance purchases of experience and young?

And ange probably won't get time if we get out knocked out cups and still in bottom half. Cos everyone injured and he don't like what we got left

I think we will
Bit this summer was the big clear out
We lost a lot of pakyers who weren’t wanted
A hell of a lot
Form the current squad I’d say there there are only 2 more the club want to lose now which are Reggie and Richarlison, plus Gil who anything could happen for but I have no faith in
That’s a huge turnover of players gone in the last window

 

[Baleforce]

Picking on @Baleforce and @glasgowspur analogies I think Angel’s side is better compared to a racing car. Maybe a Colin Chapman Lotus.

Stripped out (light) to give it as much chance as winning as possible. It is always close to breaking. Plenty of racing cars take it too far and light weight components snap with the car not winning the race. But long term the race teams who try to push the boundaries are the teams that win. They come back and refine and perfect, and then they get it right, with a winning advantage.

We don’t want to be the safe side in the middle of the pack. We should be aiming high and aspiring to outplay Chelsea, City, Pool etc. you don’t do that by being safe.

You still need to pick up points in every race though, or the sponsor money dries up and you go out of business.

 

[tommysvr]

I don't know why Ange waits til we are losing a match to make subs at 80min. When we are on the ropes he is rarely proactive.

I think he was severely hampered with what he could do. Romero off after 15, Johnson after 53. I was hoping he'd replace Kulusevki with Maddison at the same time (Kulusevki made 13 passes all game from CM!) but understandable at that point he didn't what to change anything.

He could have then made a sub around 65 mins, but with the way our injuries are going there's a very high chance we end the game with 10. He also mentioned his plan was to take Micky off around 60 mins, so that was obviously in his thinking too.

 

[Baleforce]

I think he was severely hampered with what he could do. Romero off after 15, Johnson after 53. I was hoping he'd replace Kulusevki with Maddison at the same time (Kulusevki made 13 passes all game from CM!) but understandable at that point he didn't what to change anything.

He could have then made a sub around 65 mins, but with the way our injuries are going there's a very high chance we end the game with 10.

Yesterday yes, but it’s been a theme for a long time.

 

[tommysvr]

Yesterday yes, but it’s been a theme for a long time.

The numbers don't back that up: https://thfcdb.com/people/ange-postecoglou/reports

 

[Baleforce]

The numbers don't back that up: https://thfcdb.com/people/ange-postecoglou/reports

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Yes they do, he makes the majority of his subs in garbage time. Around a third in the last 10 of the game.

 

[tommysvr]

Yes they do, he makes the majority of his subs in garbage time. Almost a third in the last 10 of the game.

Funny how it compares with Poch then. Here's a breakdown by AI:

Normalized comparison (per 18 months):

Pochettino (adjusted):
• 46-49: ~11 subs
• 50-54: ~1 sub
• 55-59: ~11 subs
• 60-64: ~26 subs
• 65-69: ~31 subs
• 70-74: ~32 subs
• 75-79: ~42 subs
• 80-84: ~38 subs
• 85-89: ~36 subs
• 90-94: ~17 subs
• 95-99: ~1 sub
• 100-104: <1 sub

Postecoglou:
• 46-49: 22 subs
• 50-54: 2 subs
• 55-59: 11 subs
• 60-64: 33 subs
• 65-69: 28 subs
• 70-74: 32 subs
• 75-79: 35 subs
• 80-84: 41 subs
• 85-89: 45 subs
• 90-94: 15 subs
• 95-99: 5 subs


Key Takeaways After Normalization:


Pochettino's Most Active Periods:
1. 75-79 mins: 139 substitutions
2. 80-84 mins: 126 substitutions
3. 85-89 mins: 120 substitutions


Postecoglou's Most Active Periods:
1. 85-89 mins: 45 substitutions
2. 80-84 mins: 41 substitutions
3. 75-79 mins: 35 substitutions

1. They're Actually Very Similar

• The normalized numbers show these managers have remarkably similar substitution patterns
• Both make most changes between 60-89 minutes
• Peak substitution periods align closely

2. Key Differences

• Postecoglou makes more early second-half changes (46-49 mins: 22 vs ~11)
• Postecoglou is slightly more active in the 60-64 window (33 vs ~26)
• Their late-game approaches are very close, with both having peaks in the 75-89 minute period

3. Strategic Implications

• Both managers follow similar modern tactical approaches to game management
• Postecoglou shows slightly more willingness to make earlier second-half interventions
• The similarity in patterns suggests both managers adhere to similar principles about when to impact games with changes

I think if you looked at just about any manager, 75-90 mins would be the most active period. But Ange is also very active at half time, and it's had a big impact in certain games.

 

[Baleforce]

Poch got the same criticism around leaving things too late iirc.

 

[tommysvr]

Poch got the same criticism around leaving things too late iirc.

Take your pick then. Who do you want a report on?

Villas-Boas (18 months) Peak Periods:
1. 75-79 mins: 39 substitutions
2. 70-74 mins: 37 substitutions
3. 60-64 mins: 29 substitutions

Jol (3 years) Peak Periods:
1. 80-84 mins: 62 substitutions
2. 75-79 mins: 60 substitutions
3. 70-74 mins: 50 substitutions

Redknapp (3.5 years) Peak Periods:
1. 70-74 mins: 62 substitutions
2. Multiple periods tied: 60 substitutions each
▪ 46-49 mins
▪ 75-79 mins
▪ 80-84 mins
▪ 85-89 mins

Key Observations:

1. Timing Differences
• Villas-Boas peaks earliest (75-79)
• Jol peaks latest (80-84)
• Redknapp shows the most consistent high-volume substitution pattern across multiple periods

2. Pattern Distinctions
• Villas-Boas: More concentrated peaks with clear drop-offs
• Jol: Gradual build-up to late-game peak
• Redknapp: Uniquely flat pattern with consistent high numbers across multiple periods (60-89 mins)

3. Early Second Half
• Redknapp notably active at 46-49 mins (60 subs)
• Jol and Villas-Boas more conservative (20 and 15 subs respectively)

 

[Mrs Vert]

If those are what the numbers say then fine. But just by memory I use to think the same with Poch and other managers. But if subbing at 80 yields more in turning results around than not when losing. Then I stand corrected and won't moan about it again

 

[Baleforce]

Take your pick then. Who do you want a report on?



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Jose