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Ange in or out?

Ange in or out?

  • In

    Votes: 85 52.5%

  • Out

    Votes: 77 47.5%
  • Total voters
    162
paxtonwolf said:
You take Raya out of that who is a keeper and his role is nowhere as exerting as an outfield player, our trio of players has more minutes than the rest by a fair distance.

You have to got to think that one of Porro, Gray or Kulsevski are about to breakdown/pick up an injury sometime soon
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Bless their hearts, having to play two games of football week. I wonder if they also have to hold down a full time job as well
 
veryoldspur said:
Bless their hearts, having to play two games of football week. I wonder if they also have to hold down a full time job as well
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This comes across quite ignorant mate

These are professional athletes operating at peak performance, very different from a couple of games with the boys or even games at a lower division level.

The number of top teams dealing with significant amounts of injuries as the football schedules increase is directly highlighting there is a limit/capacity to what these players can do. And even if they don't get injured, the performance level clearly drops (see Son, Porro, Deki)
 
Muttley said:
Out of interest, do they include the mins over 90 mins?

On WhoScored I see the following for domestic + international.
Porro 3010 mins
Sarr 2208 mins
Kulu 3269 mins

That feels about right to me, especially Sarr who has been rotated and subbed a lot. He's definitely not played more than the other 2.
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It has Kulu on 2491 mins for a start so big disparity must be using different data sources or algorithms to present the data. Although looking at the appearances for the total minutes played on transfermarkt looks like the highest anyone is on is in the 30s so must be that this particular data set hasn't been.updated in a while and whoscored is more up to date?
 
Kompakted said:
It has Kulu on 2491 mins for a start so big disparity must be using different data sources or algorithms to present the data. Although looking at the appearances for the total minutes played on transfermarkt looks like the highest anyone is on is in the 30s so must be that this particular data set hasn't been.updated in a while and whoscored is more up to date?
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So the difference is 778 mins

On WhoScored.....

Europa League 402 mins
League Cup 376 mins

QED
 
Finney Is Back said:
For some reason @Kompakted thinks that only premier league games count (oh and perhaps internationals)
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I'm going by the sources I am using and actually my point stands in that actually our players are not playing an abnormal amount of minutes, they're within tolerance of normal and actually due to the injuries many of our players are well below average mins for this stage of a season with only Kulu and Porro being in the mix of the top minutes played. Therefore the idea that they're all running on fumes and this explains the poor performances just doesn't really stack up to me.
 
Kompakted said:
I'm going by the sources I am using and actually my point stands in that actually our players are not playing an abnormal amount of minutes, they're within tolerance of normal and actually due to the injuries many of our players are well below average mins for this stage of a season with only Kulu and Porro being in the mix of the top minutes played. Therefore the idea that they're all running on fumes and this explains the poor performances just doesn't really stack up to me.
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But why does everyone need piles and piles of data to try and force through a point of view, when the eye test in this case is sufficient? I mean, great, use data, but as shown, when the extrapolated information is placed in specific contexts, people get different results.

Why is it that people simply cannot accept what we have seen since November with regards to the same players playing over and over again? Why is it hard to fathom that when you compress that and match it with not being able to get any respite/rotation, it stresses the body and mind?

I've also noticed that when this point gets spotlit as accurate, then come the 'training session' blamers (we've had it factually established that there has been minimal proper training due to the physical/mental demands right now)...

I think there are several factors at play obviously, but we are seeing a core group of players playing an abnormal amnount of football in a very crunched period of time, more than virtually every other team, and fatigue has been a huge factor. Why is that hard to deny?
 
metalgear said:
Angeball is inefficient ...we run a lot more and achieve a lot less.
View attachment 18856
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Look this data has been batched up with some highly subjective definitions (offensive or defensive? fudge ff - and what is a sprint exactly?). and there are too many outliers suggesting the boundaries have been drawn based on averages but there are ancient prescribed ways to properly define such things.

let’s see the individual actions plotted sensibly for all the players who ended up injured and let’s have a proper analysis not this flimflam.
 
thfcsteff said:
But why does everyone need piles and piles of data to try and force through a point of view, when the eye test in this case is sufficient? I mean, great, use data, but as shown, when the extrapolated information is placed in specific contexts, people get different results.

Why is it that people simply cannot accept what we have seen since November with regards to the same players playing over and over again? Why is it hard to fathom that when you compress that and match it with not being able to get any respite/rotation, it stresses the body and mind?

I've also noticed that when this point gets spotlit as accurate, then come the 'training session' blamers (we've had it factually established that there has been minimal proper training due to the physical/mental demands right now)...

I think there are several factors at play obviously, but we are seeing a core group of players playing an abnormal amnount of football in a very crunched period of time, more than virtually every other team, and fatigue has been a huge factor. Why is that hard to deny?
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Well I might as well load you up with the next 4 or 5 narratives you'll need to get you through the rest of the season.

We're in the Feb phase now where players aren't injured but they're not fit enough to be in the match day squad. After that there is the Mar phase where they are in the match day squad but not fit enough to start. Then there is the Apr phase where they are fit enough to start but not play 90. Then there is the May stage where they are fit enough to play 90 but haven't yet recaptured their top form.

It's all gonna be OK in June though. The squad will be in a perfect condition for match days.
 
Muttley said:
Well I might as well load you up with the next 4 or 5 narratives you'll need to get you through the rest of the season.

We're in the Feb phase now where players aren't injured but they're not fit enough to be in the match day squad. After that there is the Mar phase where they are in the match day squad but not fit enough to start. Then there is the Apr phase where they are fit enough to start but not play 90. Then there is the May stage where they are fit enough to play 90 but haven't yet recaptured their top form.

It's all gonna be OK in June though. The squad will be in a perfect condition for match days.
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Sorry?
I am not exactly sure what you're looking to do here?
Do you genuinely believe that people at the club are hiding behind an 'empty excuse'?
Nobody is saying that we couldn't be doing better with certain things regardless, but to deny the major, major impact injuries and fatigue have had on our season is (in my opinion) a perverse engagement in conformation bias against the manager.
 
thfcsteff said:
Sorry?
I am not exactly sure what you're looking to do here?
Do you genuinely believe that people at the club are hiding behind an 'empty excuse'?
Nobody is saying that we couldn't be doing better with certain things regardless, but to deny the major, major impact injuries and fatigue have had on our season is (in my opinion) a perverse engagement in conformation bias against the manager.
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Oh, you may have taken it that way. More likely, my wording was not so great. My bad.

I was actually meaning you've done a good job being the voice of reason through the injury crisis. I was just suggesting you now need to be ready to be the same for the next phases. They won't be as black and white as the injury and fatigue one. Ange will legitimately talk about these topics. We saw it with players like Biss (post Malaria) and Madds last season when fans got on their backs for not being at their peak. It wasn't possible in their recovery processes and fans started slating them. I actually wasn't digging out the club at all, at least in my head.

This season will be tough right down to the very last kick in my opinion. It will be ages before we have a clean slate of players back at peak fitness and form. It could well be June as I joked i.e. not happen at all.

Make sense?
 
thfcsteff said:
But why does everyone need piles and piles of data to try and force through a point of view, when the eye test in this case is sufficient? I mean, great, use data, but as shown, when the extrapolated information is placed in specific contexts, people get different results.
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Sadly nearly everyone in todays game is a stats or data junkie, never mind that half these things are slanted to show what the writer thinks or wants to try and prove their posistion.
 
Muttley said:
Oh, you may have taken it that way. More likely, my wording was not so great. My bad.

I was actually meaning you've done a good job being the voice of reason through the injury crisis. I was just suggesting you now need to be ready to be the same for the next phases. They won't be as black and white as the injury and fatigue one. Ange will legitimately talk about these topics. We saw it with players like Biss (post Malaria) and Madds last season when fans got on their backs for not being at their peak. It wasn't possible in their recovery processes and fans started slating them. I actually wasn't digging out the club at all, at least in my head.

This season will be tough right down to the very last kick in my opinion. It will be ages before we have a clean slate of players back at peak fitness and form. It could well be June as I joked i.e. not happen at all.

Make sense?
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Got it.
I was't sure and yes, I did misinterpret it. I'll take half of this on mate ;-)
 
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