Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach

[Kingdawson]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

in 2 and a quarter seasons AVB needs to have made 4th at least once and taken us deep into the CL playing crowd pleasing football

if carlsberg could book mark a post

It's already been said on here by someone (and another stated his admiration for the post so technically 2 people) that this season is now considered 'reset' ie a write off so you can't include the first 2 seasons please AS. We will evaluate whether or not you can include season 3 after the first few games of next season.

 

[Pirate55]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Let's not make assumptions. Let's pull together some data from other/whole games and look at and discuss those.

Lets not make assumptions then. Please show me any contrary EVIDENCE to support your view that we don't start games in the said fashion.

 

[billyiddo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

People aren't drawing conclusions, they're commenting on what he's done here.
This isn't their final never to changed verdict on AVB.
This is what they think at the moment.

I think some people defending AVB think this is disrespectful or hurts the club or something.

i think calling for him to be sacked is pretty conclusive don't you? :lol:

i appreciate that that's a small minority tbf

saying it's not working and it has to change, though with regards to how we are playing is kind of conclusive - i think we will get better with our football as the 'better players' come in to the fold more/settle in to their surroundings etc - i don't think you can write this stuff off after 10 games or so (within those 10 games we have had some good performances as well btw) say we change our tactics - how many games do you give the new tactics before you decide if it's a success before moving on to the next? what if an important player gets injured and that effects how the team plays in this new set up - do you wait for them to return before judging if it's working or not?

i don't think we're in any place to say right now, conclusively, that it isn't going to work as the season goes on - it isn't working entirely right now, we've had some poor performances and we're failing to create chances but there are very good players still to make an impact in the attacking positions, i want to see the likes of Lamela/Eriksen/Chadli in the team for a good while before im ready to say one way or the other if it's working or not

 

[africanspurs]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Who are "these posters" and what did they say?

I never read much into anything anyone says to the media. It's mostly cliches and pleasantries. When someone is telling blatant lies to cover their own ass I might point it out.

that would be you, billy, gutter boy i suspect to name a few

stuff like tactically inept
**** at subs
Please shut up when talking to the media
stupid for playing bale central and not in the middle
doesnt rotate players well and plays them into injury
has his favourites and wont budge on them
doesnt have a plan B
dodgy and a disgrace to the club
traitor for chasing the England job (this after he stated from day 1 that he wanted to coach England and everyone said "thats cool, good luck when the time comes")
bad at transfers
only ever buys ageing players
doesnt give young players a chance and doesnt develop them

the list of stinking pile of crap is high long and blurs into one another

i dont even know why the debate that alot of people chewed his **** out and spat him out like he never gave us our best years

where is that redknapp thread , lets get it back up and put this to bed

 

[DHSF]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

It's already been said on here by someone (and another stated his admiration for the post so technically 2 people) that this season is now considered 'reset' ie a write off so you can't include the first 2 seasons please AS. We will evaluate whether or not you can include season 3 after the first few games of next season.

haha you cant just 'reset' progress. Had he taken over mid way through a season then fine but AVB didnt. He took over at the start of summer of last season, so he should be judged from last summer. If that was the case why was he getting plaudits last summer? You (royal you) cant just determine how he has done when you feel like it. haha. So funny.

 

[africanspurs]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Who are "these posters" and what did they say?

I never read much into anything anyone says to the media. It's mostly cliches and pleasantries. When someone is telling blatant lies to cover their own ass I might point it out.

i dont mind mentioning names that i THINK were involved

Who are "these posters" and what did they say?

I never read much into anything anyone says to the media. It's mostly cliches and pleasantries. When someone is telling blatant lies to cover their own ass I might point it out.

that would be you, billy, gutter boy i suspect to name a few

stuff like tactically inept
**** at subs
Please shut up when talking to the media
stupid for playing bale central and not in the middle
doesnt rotate players well and plays them into injury
has his favourites and wont budge on them
doesnt have a plan B
dodgy and a disgrace to the club
traitor for chasing the England job (this after he stated from day 1 that he wanted to coach England and everyone said "thats cool, good luck when the time comes")
bad at transfers
only ever buys ageing players
doesnt give young players a chance and doesnt develop them

the list of stinking pile of crap and hypocricy said against him is high, long and blurs into one another

i dont even know why the debate that alot of people chewed his **** out and spat him out like he never gave us our best years

where is that redknapp thread , lets get it back up and put this to bed

 

[billyiddo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

in 2 and a quarter seasons AVB needs to have made 4th at least once and taken us deep into the CL playing crowd pleasing football

if carlsberg could book mark a post

don't worry mate, i know you're positively itching for the chance to call us up on any hypocrisy you see over the Redknapp saga - that much has been quite evident the past year or so

 

[africanspurs]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

don't worry mate, i know you're positively itching for the chance to call us up on any hypocrisy you see over the Redknapp saga - that much has been quite evident the past year or so

billy

i am chomping at the bit, foaming at the mouth, you have no idea.

naturally people will dress it up in some sort of organic, au natural and hippy positive beverage filled to the brim with excuses and clauses .....a good head of sanctimonious and self righteous "i support the club, all who criticise my manager need to look themselves in the mirror" etc etc

nah , am just **** stirring abit, but i do believe 99% of those people making us **** about harry we being unfair, biased and hypocritical in many of the things they said about him. and they wouldnt say that about anyone else

i just want people to stand tall on that and give anyone as good as they gave harry

 

[milo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Lets not make assumptions then. Please show me any contrary EVIDENCE to support your view that we don't start games in the said fashion.

I don't wish to be rude but if you are making the claim that it is typical of how we start games then the onous is one you to provide evidence to support this. I haven't made any comments on our tempo or penetration early in games, I just commented that a 30 minute window is a short period of time to draw conclusions from.

 

[billyiddo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

It's already been said on here by someone (and another stated his admiration for the post so technically 2 people) that this season is now considered 'reset' ie a write off so you can't include the first 2 seasons please AS. We will evaluate whether or not you can include season 3 after the first few games of next season.

i think you're missing the point somewhat KD - the 'reset' thing is just a way of explaining how some feel (i don't want to speak for the original poster but it's something i have said before so let me clarify) with regards to what has happened over the summer transfer window. it's not meant in relation to AVBs 'X year plan' it's just way of saying how the work of the first season has been disrupted in a playing and coaching point of view, it's entirely reasonable to see how such a turnaround in playing staff (plus the loss of Bale) can effect things. it's not a get out of jail free card - we still need to show signs of improvement and we still have our targets and if we show know progress in either than questions will be asked

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Away to Villa before Townsend's fluke was the one the that stood out for me.
We had just lost to West Ham and we came out and played exactly the same way.
Passing the ball round our own half with a big hole in our midfield.

But this supposedly is us controlling the game and waiting for the right time to strike

This is an example of not allowing the debate to go anywhere. I mean what are you actually countering? Which point do you disagree with? You've just said that we passed the ball around in our own half and that some people think this is waiting for us to strike. But how are you disagreeing with it? You've just stated a fact, and interpreted it in your own way without any way to justify it.

To me, it completely looks like it ties in with our philosophy of being patient, shading out the game and understanding how best to make the breakthrough. In these games, there is an element of the opposition not trying to keep the ball themselves, which means we have more. But they also do that because they know we are capable of keeping it. Teams just don't keep the kind of possession we do out of luck.

So I do think it is us trying to be patient. But it is also because that is our style. We aren't going to change it just because we lost a game before. One Brendan Rodgers quote I do like is 'plan B is to do plan A better' because it's absolutely right. Plucky little teams start lumping it forward and abandoning their beliefs because they've lost a game, not a top club. And our style will have benefits, as well as drawbacks. Just like absolutely any system possible to play in all of football.

And it's also worth saying to people wanting us to score more first half goals - if we decide to become a first half team we will score less goals in the second half overall. It's that simple. We won't have both. So at the moment, we are taking the benefits of stepping up in the second half as opposed to the first. Again, both options have merits.

 

[Modric THFC]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

i think calling for him to be sacked is pretty conclusive don't you? :lol:

i appreciate that that's a small minority tbf

saying it's not working and it has to change, though with regards to how we are playing is kind of conclusive - i think we will get better with our football as the 'better players' come in to the fold more/settle in to their surroundings etc - i don't think you can write this stuff off after 10 games or so (within those 10 games we have had some good performances as well btw) say we change our tactics - how many games do you give the new tactics before you decide if it's a success before moving on to the next? what if an important player gets injured and that effects how the team plays in this new set up - do you wait for them to return before judging if it's working or not?

i don't think we're in any place to say right now, conclusively, that it isn't going to work as the season goes on - it isn't working entirely right now, we've had some poor performances and we're failing to create chances but there are very good players still to make an impact in the attacking positions, i want to see the likes of Lamela/Eriksen/Chadli in the team for a good while before im ready to say one way or the other if it's working or not

We don't have to throw everything out and start again. I just wanna see us play differently at home against defensive teams to start off and see where we go from there. High tempo quick passing in an attempt to break teams down.

 

[billyiddo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

That's happening on both sides tbh. The ones that defend AVB always come up with the same excuses and the ones attacking him usually come up with the same points to criticise him on. Naturally the side that you're on will not annoy you as much as the points being raised by the 'other side' so people will throw statements like 'voice of reason' to the posts that go with their point to somehow insinuate that the 'other side' are not being reasonable.

Any real neutral that reads this thread will simply see it as both sides putting their arguments across...no big deal.

it is happening on both sides, you're right - but i hope you can see that it's one side that is doing the complaining/asking the questions whilst the other is responding to those questions/complaints - so if the questions never change, neither will the answers

 

[milo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

billy

i am chomping at the bit, foaming at the mouth, you have no idea.

naturally people will dress it up in some sort of organic, au natural and hippy positive beverage filled to the brim with excuses and clauses .....a good head of sanctimonious and self righteous "i support the club, all who criticise my manager need to look themselves in the mirror" etc etc

nah , am just **** stirring abit, but i do believe 99% of those people making us **** about harry we being unfair, biased and hypocritical in many of the things they said about him. and they wouldnt say that about anyone else

i just want people to stand tall on that and give anyone as good as they gave harry

I think that is a very divisive attitude. I wonder whether you feel the same in real life or whether you are carrying over arguments from previous seasons and feel that you have a point to prove to some posters.

 

[diego_maradona]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

haha you cant just 'reset' progress. Had he taken over mid way through a season then fine but AVB didnt. He took over at the start of summer of last season, so he should be judged from last summer. If that was the case why was he getting plaudits last summer? You (royal you) cant just determine how he has done when you feel like it. haha. So funny.

Think he was taking the ****.

As I've said a number of times before when opinions are as polarised as they are, the truth lies usually lies somewhere between the two sides. AVB has had plenty of time to stamp his style on the side however I will defend him in saying this high turnover of players means we kind of have hit the reset button a little. Not AVB necessarily but the club as a whole. In a little over a year and a half we've gone from Modric, VdV, King, Bale, etc to 7 new stars this season not to mention Sig, Dembele, Vertonghen, Lloris.

I'll be honest, I don't really care how we judge AVB necessarily. I'm more interested in our state as a club and where we are. If we forget about AVB for a second and look at the club, the squad, we can see an awful lot of change.

There are cultural significances to take into account. Both of the club, and the individual players. Somehow we need to align the two, they need to learn about the club, the history, the fans, the ambitions. The club needs to learn about the players and who they are and how they can take the club forward.

Sometimes it clicks, and other times it will take some time. I find it no mean feat for AVB to have overseen the club to remain as successful as we've been in recent history whilst under going such a large change. Of course Bale takes a huge slice of that credit. But we were not a one man team regardless of what people said.

I've always said there would be some initial pain whilst these things take shape. It's as big a radical change as when Arnesen first came on board

 

[milo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

We don't have to throw everything out and start again. I just wanna see us play differently at home against defensive teams to start off and see where we go from there. High tempo quick passing in an attempt to break teams down.

Out of interest, how do you think taking two dramatically different approaches to our game would impact on the new players settling into the team and English football? Do you think that bedding in the new players could be a consideration for the manager when he is considering match day tactics?

 

[milo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Think he was taking the ****.

As I've said a number of times before when opinions are as polarised as they are, the truth lies usually lies somewhere between the two sides. AVB has had plenty of time to stamp his style on the side however I will defend him in saying this high turnover of players means we kind of have hit the reset button a little. Not AVB necessarily but the club as a whole. In a little over a year and a half we've gone from Modric, VdV, King, Bale, etc to 7 new stars this season not to mention Sig, Dembele, Vertonghen, Lloris.

I'll be honest, I don't really care how we judge AVB necessarily. I'm more interested in our state as a club and where we are. If we forget about AVB for a second and look at the club, the squad, we can see an awful lot of change.

There are cultural significances to take into account. Both of the club, and the individual players. Somehow we need to align the two, they need to learn about the club, the history, the fans, the ambitions. The club needs to learn about the players and who they are and how they can take the club forward.

Sometimes it clicks, and other times it will take some time. I find it no mean feat for AVB to have overseen the club to remain as successful as we've been in recent history whilst under going such a large change. Of course Bale takes a huge slice of that credit. But we were not a one man team regardless of what people said.

I've always said there would be some initial pain whilst these things take shape. It's as big a radical change as when Arnesen first came on board

=D> That's a top post right there

 

[Modric THFC]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

This is an example of not allowing the debate to go anywhere. I mean what are you actually countering? Which point do you disagree with? You've just said that we passed the ball around in our own half and that some people think this is waiting for us to strike. But how are you disagreeing with it? You've just stated a fact, and interpreted it in your own way without any way to justify it.

To me, it completely looks like it ties in with our philosophy of being patient, shading out the game and understanding how best to make the breakthrough. In these games, there is an element of the opposition not trying to keep the ball themselves, which means we have more. But they also do that because they know we are capable of keeping it. Teams just don't keep the kind of possession we do out of luck.

So I do think it is us trying to be patient. But it is also because that is our style. We aren't going to change it just because we lost a game before. One Brendan Rodgers quote I do like is 'plan B is to do plan A better' because it's absolutely right. Plucky little teams start lumping it forward and abandoning their beliefs because they've lost a game, not a top club. And our style will have benefits, as well as drawbacks. Just like absolutely any system possible to play in all of football.

And it's also worth saying to people wanting us to score more first half goals - if we decide to become a first half team we will score less goals in the second half overall. It's that simple. We won't have both. So at the moment, we are taking the benefits of stepping up in the second half as opposed to the first. Again, both options have merits.

But this is exactly where the debate is.

To most people watching us passing it around unable to get the ball out of our own half for two games in a row is not what we want.
But according to you and the AVB book this is 'the plan'.
In that game the central two didn't want the ball from the defence. Villa (and West Ham before it) were happy to let us have the ball in our own half knowing we were predictability going to play it down the flanks and back to the defence again. That's why we keep the possession we do.

People are waiting for us to come good when everything gels but AVB's gameplan is so defensive that he to writes the first half in games to save energy! Should people only pay to watch the second half?

 

[billyiddo]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

billy

i am chomping at the bit, foaming at the mouth, you have no idea.

naturally people will dress it up in some sort of organic, au natural and hippy positive beverage filled to the brim with excuses and clauses .....a good head of sanctimonious and self righteous "i support the club, all who criticise my manager need to look themselves in the mirror" etc etc

nah , am just **** stirring abit, but i do believe 99% of those people making us **** about harry we being unfair, biased and hypocritical in many of the things they said about him. and they wouldnt say that about anyone else

i just want people to stand tall on that and give anyone as good as they gave harry

Affy, i know you are - i think maybe you thought you were hiding it better than you have been, you've let your guard down on more than one occasion

it's a shame that i gave off that impression - i could go through and explain point by point (of you earlier post, regarding hypocrisy) why that is not the case but i don't want to drag this on any further right now. personally i see very few things that have happened over the past year that have a direct incident that we can compare with Redknepp and judge whether someone his being hypocritical. i guess you see it differently id happily take this discussion to PM if you wanted to.

 

[Modric THFC]

Re: ***The Official AVB Discussion Thread***

Out of interest, how do you think taking two dramatically different approaches to our game would impact on the new players settling into the team and English football? Do you think that bedding in the new players could be a consideration for the manager when he is considering match day tactics?

But its how most teams play. They are set up be more conservative and defensive away. They are let off the leash at home and have a go.
We seem always to be in away mode.