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OMT - Tottenham Hotspur vs Eintracht Frankfurt

glorygloryeze said:
And honestly, why has Son been so undroppable for Ange?
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He hasn't when Odobert has been fit, Odobert as soon as he was signed was put on the left wing (I think at that time Son might of played up front, not sure he was dropped straight away). Since Odobert has been back, Son has been getting less minutes. Without Odobert, what options do we have? Werner, nope. Tel is still acclimatising to the club. Moore? He's not ready yet, and not sure about his fitness anyway. I'd be shocked if Son was a starter next season regardless of manager....
 
harr1984 said:
He hasn't when Odobert has been fit, Odobert as soon as he was signed was put on the left wing (I think at that time Son might of played up front, not sure he was dropped straight away). Since Odobert has been back, Son has been getting less minutes. Without Odobert, what options do we have? Werner, nope. Tel is still acclimatising to the club. Moore? He's not ready yet, and not sure about his fitness anyway. I'd be shocked if Son was a starter next season regardless of manager....
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I think if you look back over the season there have been MANY times Son could have been dropped but he kept playing him. Plus Son does the same thing all the time now: get the ball on the left and end up passing it back into midfield. It's quite boring!
Chickens are coming home to roost now.
A sad way for his Spurs career to end tbh
 
glorygloryeze said:
I think if you look back over the season there have been MANY times Son could have been dropped but he kept playing him. Plus Son does the same thing all the time now: get the ball on the left and end up passing it back into midfield. It's quite boring!
Chickens are coming home to roost now.
A sad way for his Spurs career to end tbh
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I agree, me and @Bishop were saying Son was done over a year ago. But dropping Son still comes down to lack of options - With Odobert out it was either Son, Werner or Moore (who has been unfit for a long period anyway) and if he had persisted with Werner you are deluded in thinking that was going to end well with the armchair managers on here.....
 
Benny_Lad said:
We really don’t have a great squad. We have 10/12 max you’d want to keep.
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Only ones I'd be gutted to lose would be Kulu, Begvall, Gray and Moore. And the last 3 down to potential rather than quality right now. The rest haven't shown anything like consistent high quality performances or fitness for us.

I think squad quality is an open question though as how much of it is down to poor coaching/tactics and general club turmoil and how much down to the individual player flaws. Romero case in point: played under 3 different coaches/systems since arrival. Generally error prone for us but absolute rock for Argentina and seems to have the interest of Real Madrid and other elite clubs.
 
Thought that was one of our better performances of the season. Not that I’ve made it to many games this season but was nice there was an atmosphere in the ground for once.
Do feel like we were much the better team but didn’t take the chances and that will come back to bite us next week. As you always feel like we could concede at any moment. First goal next week will be key.
 
harr1984 said:
I agree, me and @Bishop were saying Son was done over a year ago. But dropping Son still comes down to lack of options - With Odobert out it was either Son, Werner or Moore (who has been unfit for a long period anyway) and if he had persisted with Werner you are deluded in thinking that was going to end well with the armchair managers on here.....
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The armchair managers on here are irrelevant. It's about effectiveness and using what you do have effectively. Werner at least has pace and there have been times his pace in behind would have been preferred. We have had options a lot more times than Son has actually been dropped/substituted and that's on Ange.
Long-term it has been on the club and SK that Son's decline has been so painful, but here we are
 
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glorygloryeze said:
The armchair managers on here are irrelevant. It's about effectiveness and using what you do have effectively. Werner at least has pace and there have been times his pace in behind would have been preferred. We have had options a lot more times than Son has actually been dropped/substituted and that's on Ange.
Loing-term it has been on the club and SK that Son's decline has been so painful, but here we are
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Nah, this is just the sort of fanciful thing that gets said because Ange didn't do it. As soon as Werner was getting any game time people complained about his performances, the idea that Ange playing Werner more would have worked out better is to be polite optimistic and just a classic example of Ange being damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. All it highlights is that we need better wingers because Son isn't the answer, and Werner sure as hell isn't....
 
Surfless said:
What was pleasing tonight was seeing some of the players whose stop start seasons have impacted their flow starting to get into their rhythm. Rodri, Udogie and Solanke were excellent tonight, in all senses. Vdv was barreling about making up 10 yards on attackers in 20 yards, Romero was imperious at points, and Porro and Bergvall would have to slug it out for MOM. Vicario was a spectator and both Son and Madders had the chance to score and were a threat.

There's some on here now that will be almost disappointed we turned up, because of the anti Ange or anti Levy rhetoric, but the truth is that but for the width of a cross bar and a keeper who had a night to remember, we could be 3 or 4 up going to Germany.

We're not, and that's a shame, but 7 weeks ago we'd have crumbled after conceding in 6 minutes. Tonight we rallied. Credit where it's due, that wasn't a team who aren't playing for their manager.

Let's call the rubbish when it happens, but also call the good when that occurs too.
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That's not a welcome message for a lot of Spurs fans right now mate.
 
I thought son had a son game
His pass for our goal was great
He is rarely ever beating his man as we know now
His shot wasn’t son of old but it was still a great shot well saved
He was decent last night and I’m one who thinks he shouldn’t be getting anywhere near the minutes he is getting
Maddison is the frustrating one
When in the final third… he is a player
Everywhere else on the pitch he is pedestrian
 
harr1984 said:
Nah, this is just the sort of fanciful thing that gets said because Ange didn't do it. As soon as Werner was getting any game time people complained about his performances, the idea that Ange playing Werner more would have worked out better is to be polite optimistic and just a classic example of Ange being damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. All it highlights is that we need better wingers because Son isn't the answer, and Werner sure as hell isn't....
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The problem there is Ange somehow for some reason decided to bring Werner back in despite him already proving he was even close to adequate. Honestly a big black mark for me with Ange is his wide player optics.

He's brought in Johnson and Werner who are cack and still rates Son. This isn't the man I would want to be picking our wide options next season. Tbh the first Werner loan made me wonder but I accepted that as a gamble but the return was pretty much the thing that sealed the deal for me, his player rating is abstract and not in a good way.
 
Surfless said:
What was pleasing tonight was seeing some of the players whose stop start seasons have impacted their flow starting to get into their rhythm. Rodri, Udogie and Solanke were excellent tonight, in all senses. Vdv was barreling about making up 10 yards on attackers in 20 yards, Romero was imperious at points, and Porro and Bergvall would have to slug it out for MOM. Vicario was a spectator and both Son and Madders had the chance to score and were a threat.

There's some on here now that will be almost disappointed we turned up, because of the anti Ange or anti Levy rhetoric, but the truth is that but for the width of a cross bar and a keeper who had a night to remember, we could be 3 or 4 up going to Germany.

We're not, and that's a shame, but 7 weeks ago we'd have crumbled after conceding in 6 minutes. Tonight we rallied. Credit where it's due, that wasn't a team who aren't playing for their manager.

Let's call the rubbish when it happens, but also call the good when that occurs too.
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Exactly this. Wasn't quite the turning over some were going on about was going to happen was it? But don't tell me, at their place it will be :rolleyes:. Fact is Frankfurt are a decent team, but guess what - with our first team available so are we. We should have won but didn't, still all to play for - enjoyed the match, a good game of football and had the feel of a proper European tie.....
 
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The long balls and the quick forward passes are what we have to deal with next week
Their side looked huge in the ground. Every player looked like they were 6 ft 4
I don’t know if that came across on tele or ish just me
But they didn’t seem great in the air considering
I did like the speed they got the ball forward though
 
harr1984 said:
Nah, this is just the sort of fanciful thing that gets said because Ange didn't do it. As soon as Werner was getting any game time people complained about his performances, the idea that Ange playing Werner more would have worked out better is to be polite optimistic and just a classic example of Ange being damned if he does and damned if he doesn't. All it highlights is that we need better wingers because Son isn't the answer, and Werner sure as hell isn't....
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I'm using Werner as just one example who for certain situations could bring attributes that Son simply doesn't have now: pace to run in behind.
Are you honestly telling me that Son has been managed well by Ange this season? Are you honestly telling me that every game where Son wasn't injured he absolutely should have started no matter what?
 
glorygloryeze said:
I'm using Werner as just one example who for certain situations could bring attributes that Son simply doesn't have now: pace to run in behind.
Are you honestly telling me that Son has been managed well by Ange this season? Are you honestly telling me that every game where Son wasn't injured he absolutely should have started no matter what?
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No in an ideal world Son would barely feature at all. But the fact is with Odobert injured for the majority of period we are talking about, Ange's options were Werner who has been awful or Moore who is barely ready for big boy football and has been out injured/ill for a period of time too. As has been demonstrated with Odobert before and after his injury, if he has a player he deems good enough to play ahead of Son or rotating with him then he will. He was even giving Moore game time when he was available. If you think Werner deserved more game time then fair enough, but you won't find me arguing with Ange on that one....
 
What I find frustrating is that at times last night we looked pretty close to being a good team. Which leads me to think another manager might be able to achieve more, not least with making the subs with sufficient time to influence the game. But how we could do with a "Son replacement", a proven 20 goal a season striker. I find myself looking back to the days of Keane and Defoe....
 
Has Moore completely fallen out of favour or something ?
He wouldn't have played any worse than Johnson or Sonny, he is fearless, give him a go
Nothing bad can come of it
 
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