Thomas Frank - Head Coach

[harr1984]

Vinai literally made a statement on Friday so it's not going to be today unless he himself is losing the control of the club. If you think there's a new director of football coming in, there's no point firing the manager now unless they have a clear idea of who the new DoF wants in the role.

You don't not take action because of a statement you made about ambition. It's more of a concern not to take action, I honestly thought talk of a relegation scrap was nonsense but we have been on a downward trajectory for some time and even the clubs at the bottom take points off of us. We have to act or it's going to continue to spiral and be too late....

 

[Mrs Vert]

Well considering we was told last season Ange had to adapt to all the injuries and come up with a plan, you can't then come up excuses for Frank and say 'Yeah but if he had x,y and z' it would be better. You're dealt with the hand you're dealt with, Ange was missing plenty of players throughout the season.

What I do know is for all the teams faults under Ange, I would much rather watch his side over what has been served up this season. And if he had the opportunity to work with Kudus, Simons and Muani it would have been a far more enjoyable experience than this utter mess. Yesterday morning I said Frank still should be given at least the season if not longer barring an absolute disaster. Well yesterday was an absolute disaster.....

For me its like saying would I prefer to eat fried brick or boiled brick!

The decline was under Ange too.

Would I prefer to see us losing 4-3 as prefer to 2-1? I was at the Chelsea game when we tanked and we kept trying. I applauded that. But we couldn't keep doing that aa we never added properly and only replaced when people dropped.

But I still dont think he cares too tough about defense. And we cant keep outscoring Ozzie style. Its not sustainable. And what Frank is doing isnt working. We did lose against dross with our better attack. And again it goes back to the board cos Ange had to pur a 18yr midfielder in defense and he STILL didnt cover for Destiny cos board felt it was fine for Spence to be there,for how many windows??!

I give up with this club!!

 

[Mikey10]

Reporters camped outside the training ground today, it's done isn't it ?

Sky for one have reporters outside training grounds and stadiums every day. How else do they fill the SSN channel with bolloc ks 24/7?

We would employ an interim wouldn't we and hope there is a bounce till the summer and then take it from there

Excellent! Sounds like a flawless, well thought out strategy. We’re going to be fine!

 

[Mrs Vert]

Vinai literally made a statement on Friday so it's not going to be today unless he himself is losing the control of the club. If you think there's a new director of football coming in, there's no point firing the manager now unless they have a clear idea of who the new DoF wants in the role.

Its ok to say something one day and with new info change your mind. For their sake they better backtrack and start finding an answer and quick

 

[Finney Is Back]

Well there’s two points I was making.

1. Reading through the posts it is clear that a section of the fan base who didn’t want Ange sacked have been really anti-Frank. They never really got behind him.

Almost like they wanted him to fail so they could say: “see I told you…should have kept Ange”

2. If things like the placebo effect is proven. And even a doctor knowing whether a drug is real or a placebo has a proven effect (so they have to hide the placebo from the doctor too during medical studies: a double blind). Then it is an interesting question: did the divisive negative fans effect TS’ performance. Did it have no effect at all? Does having the fans fully onboard help a manager?

I didn’t want Conte sacked and I didn’t want Ange appointed but despite those things I still got behind Ange.

I would’ve love to be able to get behind Frank but he hasn’t given us anything to get behind. The football is dirge and the results are dire.

 

[Mrs Vert]

Sky for one have reporters outside training grounds and stadiums every day. How else do they fill the SSN channel with bolloc ks 24/7?



Excellent! Sounds like a flawless, well thought out strategy. We’re going to be fine!

At this point we are gonna have to wing it and hope! At least last season we had fewer games to hold out before relegation . We have 5mth this season and quite frankly we don't have the mental fortified to survive it. So we best get someone to change it fast.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Some players for numerous reasons, franks office will be there, he will have to go there if sacked

I can't imagine they are sending people there unless they think there is a good chance there is an announcement of sorts today.

At the very least the CEO and DoF should be having a meeting to discuss what order to go after the 3 or 4 targets to replace Frank (though I suspect they’ll just do it from home on a zoom call, so those at the training ground will be disappointed).

 

[Mikey10]

At this point we are gonna have to wing it and hope! At least last season we had fewer games to hold out before relegation . We have 5mth this season and quite frankly we don't have the mental fortified to survive it. So we best get someone to change it fast.

Somewhere in Sandbanks, Sandra is doubling ‘Arry’s Sanatogen, polishing his zimmer, and sourcing an assisted living facility in the N17 area…

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

GHod not Frank V Ange, this debates in Rocky V territory

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Some players for numerous reasons, franks office will be there, he will have to go there if sacked

I can't imagine they are sending people there unless they think there is a good chance there is an announcement of sorts today.

Place is a resort, its always busy there, he may well be off but also you will always get decent footage there of arrivals and departures.

 

[Daisuk]

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[Junior19]

Funny how those who dislike Frank most correlate with those who didn’t want Ange sacked. It is so black and white.

We’ll never know if Frank might have done better with a unified fanbase actually supporting him and the side. Injuries are undoubtedly the biggest thorn in the side. But maybe the negativity from those who didn’t want Ange sacked had an impact? If placebos and double blinds are proven to have an effect, maybe the negativity from these supporters has also had an effect? Who knows.

Oh give it a rest, will you. I respect your sticking up for the manager, but it is getting a bit tedious with the entrenchment here.

Most of us don't want any coach fired at all! If you ignore the stupid "fudge off, Ange" and "tinkle off, Thomas"-posts that are beneath common dignity most of us want to support whoever is in charge for as long as it is humanely possible. There may be different breaking points for people, and there may be different core reasons for that breaking point being reached.

Yes, it is black and white, but not in the way you think. A sacked coach means we've failed. Again.

I for one don't want to fail, I don't like to fail.

However, every now and then you come to the conclusion (as it seems you have, and I commend you for it) that a situation is untenable and a resolution has to be sought. That was my process with Ange, that was my process with Conte, and that was my process with every manager, even He Who Must Not Be Named. And that will be my process with Thomas Frank.

I do not want to see him sacked, but I DO want to see something, _anything_ that can convince me that the trajectory we're on is changing, and that he can bring about improvement.
And so far, I've seen nothing of the slightest of such at thing. I can assure you, nothing will give me greater joy than us steamrolling Dortmund in the Champions League on tuesday, trash Burnley on the weekend, and then wallop Frankfurt the following wednesday. I'd even settle for a single point or two from the 4 games following after that. The problem? I have ZERO trust or belief in it, zero confidence, and also, zero indications that the players have any belief in it. And quite frankly, less and less indications that Frank has any belief in it.

As for being supportive, I think I've made my stance clear on several occations. I will never boo players, never do anything to single out spacegoats or not support the club. I will however exercise my right to write my criticism of the managers path, selection and choices. That is NOT equal to "dislike Frank".

If the coach bring improvement, the criticism on style etc becomes background noise, ebbing and flowing as it always will. But if the trajectory is upwards, it remains in the background. Failing to improve, and it becomes the roaring thunderstorm we're currently in.

 

[SpurMeUp]

There is definitely a bit of number one out there in the fan base, if you look on social media, we have a LOT of fans who completely misremember everything else about Ange because, trophy.

For me it’s actually quite simple, Ange, thank you for finding a way to get us a trophy, but he wasn’t this free flowing, brilliant to watch manager over a season that he’s made out to be - personally I think had he stayed he’d probably also be getting sacked now as we struggle in the league again and get thumped in the champs league with that game plan - however it’s fair to say, we will never know if that would have been the case. I think we need to move on though.

I do think some were never going to accept Frank based on this, and the knives have been out since the start. However there’s also plenty, myself included who recognise it’s not all Frank, he’s a lot going against him with the squad, the leadership etc. However I don’t think he’s the right man to fix it either.

We need to stop the comparisons I feel, I don’t think Frank is the right man for us, I don’t think Ange was the right man for us (long term) and if I’m honest, I don’t think we’ve had the right man for us since Poch left. This entire situation is a mess, and it’s on the club.

Excellent post.

Ange had a vision and to be fair to him never quite realised it. And he simply ran out of time. Some fundamentals were missing like set pieces, effectively contesting throw-ins, defensive stability. But Ange wasn’t a failure! It was a ride and one that ended with a Pot.

Frank might be a reaction to Ange. Solid. A builder. A focus on the little things that Ange ignored focusing on the big picture. The only lament for Frank is he didn’t get a fit attack to win him points/time to develop individual player and the team.

In both cases fans are more vital than they appreciate. Individually no fan is that powerful. Collectively they make and break managers. It’s a two-way thing - earn the fans respect fast. Poch had it easier leading a club in the ascendancy- on the rise - playing ina humble old stadium without expectation.

 

[kb 1984]

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So the BBC are still trying to get manger sacked & this is journalism is it. Guess it will get lots of clicks

 

[billyiddo]

GHod not Frank V Ange, this debates in Rocky V territory

At this stage it's what flavour brick would you prefer to eat

 

[Mcfee]

So the BBC are still trying to get manger sacked & this is journalism is it. Guess it will get lots of clicks

It’s part of the game at this level and everyone knows it, none more so than the managers themselves.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

At this stage it's what flavour brick would you prefer to eat

I just don't see the relevance of the entrenchment anymore

 

[kb 1984]

It’s part of the game at this level and everyone knows it, none more so than the managers themselves.

I know I would expect more from the BBC I normally get my UK news from the 6 o'clock news. It's football & they need clicks I guess

 

[harr1984]

Oh give it a rest, will you. I respect your sticking up for the manager, but it is getting a bit tedious with the entrenchment here.

Most of us don't want any coach fired at all! If you ignore the stupid "fudge off, Ange" and "tinkle off, Thomas"-posts that are beneath common dignity most of us want to support whoever is in charge for as long as it is humanely possible. There may be different breaking points for people, and there may be different core reasons for that breaking point being reached.

Yes, it is black and white, but not in the way you think. A sacked coach means we've failed. Again.

I for one don't want to fail, I don't like to fail.

However, every now and then you come to the conclusion (as it seems you have, and I commend you for it) that a situation is untenable and a resolution has to be sought. That was my process with Ange, that was my process with Conte, and that was my process with every manager, even He Who Must Not Be Named. And that will be my process with Thomas Frank.

I do not want to see him sacked, but I DO want to see something, _anything_ that can convince me that the trajectory we're on is changing, and that he can bring about improvement.
And so far, I've seen nothing of the slightest of such at thing. I can assure you, nothing will give me greater joy than us steamrolling Dortmund in the Champions League on tuesday, trash Burnley on the weekend, and then wallop Frankfurt the following wednesday. I'd even settle for a single point or two from the 4 games following after that. The problem? I have ZERO trust or belief in it, zero confidence, and also, zero indications that the players have any belief in it. And quite frankly, less and less indications that Frank has any belief in it.

As for being supportive, I think I've made my stance clear on several occations. I will never boo players, never do anything to single out spacegoats or not support the club. I will however exercise my right to write my criticism of the managers path, selection and choices. That is NOT equal to "dislike Frank".

If the coach bring improvement, the criticism on style etc becomes background noise, ebbing and flowing as it always will. But if the trajectory is upwards, it remains in the background. Failing to improve, and it becomes the roaring thunderstorm we're currently in.

Top post. This whole thing about those who liked Ange have it in for Frank are talking nonsense. I don't mind admitting my preference was for Ange to be given this season to see if he could build on the trophy win and if he had learnt about handling injuries better etc But when he was sacked I accepted the argument that league results were just not good enough. I never wanted Frank, he didn't inspire me that after winning a European trophy and get Champions League football the solution to kick on would be to employ a guy who IMO played uninspiring football and had never managed in Europe in his life. But there were many who gave good arguments about why he would work, so I was open to see it - Any manager or player who comes here will always get my support to begin with and I'd like to think I give them a fair opportunity to prove me right or wrong.

But as the weeks gone on it just felt like there was literally no evident attacking plan - It's been done to death a million times but even to this day I have no idea what we work on in training in an attacking sense, and the even sadder part for me is that the defending is no better. We all agree we need some better players to be where we believe we should be challenging, but I question anyone's sanity who thinks this group can't perform better and more cohesively than have been week in week out.

And this idea that we've lost x number of goals and assists with Son, Maddison, Kulu and whoever else - well yeah, that's because of the way Ange had us attacking. Son was past his best last season but still got some half decent numbers because of how we setup. There is no chance he would get anywhere near those numbers in this team and setup - He's not a centre forward, do you think he's going to get a load of goals from these balls we just keep chucking in the box? And with the instructions our wide players have, he wouldn't produce much at all as he's lost his pace. Same with Madders and Kulu, at best we would be getting a slightly less brickier version of what we have been seeing - they would not be getting the numbers they did last season.

Most fans have been reasonable, for season one just wanting to see something they can get behind and at the very least I was hoping he'd be given the season. But Frank has failed here, and worryingly it only getting worse and he's lost the fans meaning I can't see anyway back for him. And let's be clear, he's far from the only problem here, and he will go on to prove he's a good manager at a different place but hes not the answer for this club.....

 

[harr1984]

I just don't see the relevance of the entrenchment anymore

I get it, but it's natural for comparisons with previous managers especially when things are going badly.

It's the same on every clubs forum. The West Ham one still go on about how getting rid of Moyes was a mistake a la Poch, how Lopetegui/Potter shouldn't have been sacked and would be doing better than Nuno etc

Unfortunately until a manager is successful we will always see this subject crop up (and probably to a lesser extent even when we are doing well ).....