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Brennan Johnson

Bedfordspurs said:
Johnson is not strong left side
Even less so when we have two right footers there in him and Spence
But what was worrying for both him and Spence was how many risks they had space and we went right
Now I get the penchants of players to go to what we they know we will have an impact Kudus … but if you don’t spread play you limit options
Brennan had one big of play where he went backwards there than beat walker… 30 seconds later he found Richy and it was a great save then cleared by a defender
Earlier he bullied walker in 80/20 in walkers favour which we have never seen before
I’d rather have a player have an impact on the result that one who may do “prettier things” but actually have no impact
It’s like when goalies have nothing to do but make that one save at the end … it’s what matters
Brennan for me is a weak link because of his game play but I still think part lf that is the lack of passing to him in the right way
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I agree.

With a fit Solanke, my left side would be Udogie and Richi until I see another signing or we get leftie Kulu available. Those 5 right footed centre mids just don't work the left side like they do the right. I'm certain Frank would have seen what we saw today though. He'll hopefully make adjustments from his centre mids.
 
Muttley said:
I agree.

With a fit Solanke, my left side would be Udogie and Richi until I see another signing or we get leftie Kulu available. Those 5 right footed centre mids just don't work the left side like they do the right. I'm certain Frank would have seen what we saw today though. He'll hopefully make adjustments from his centre mids.
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I’d like more options all round
I’ve said many times my reservation with Savio which is the fee
But he would instantly be our best left side player and IMO more of a goal threat there too than what was shown at city
But options are what is the we need and writing off 18 goals is such a spurs way of thinking
 
DTA said:
To get in to positions to, and then be able to consistently take the opportunity to score is a extremely rare trait that you are massively underestimating
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I'm not underestimating it I'm saying that it's a great trait to have but it makes him reliant on the work of others. I'm if Sarr doesn't intercept the though ball Johnson isn't going to take the ball, beat a man and ion up the chance for himself.

It works out fine on a day like today where we win the game and got through the rough spell and got the 2nd and then 3rd goals but as we saw last season thats not always the case. Sometimes we actually need him to also contribute, for him to be the player who helps others score not just waiting for an opportunity to put the ball into the back of the net himself.

Bedfordspurs said:
Johnson is not strong left side
Even less so when we have two right footers there in him and Spence
But what was worrying for both him and Spence was how many risks they had space and we went right
Now I get the penchants of players to go to what we they know we will have an impact Kudus … but if you don’t spread play you limit options
Brennan had one big of play where he went backwards there than beat walker… 30 seconds later he found Richy and it was a great save then cleared by a defender
Earlier he bullied walker in 80/20 in walkers favour which we have never seen before
I’d rather have a player have an impact on the result that one who may do “prettier things” but actually have no impact
It’s like when goalies have nothing to do but make that one save at the end … it’s what matters
Brennan for me is a weak link because of his game play but I still think part lf that is the lack of passing to him in the right way
Click to expand...
Johnson isn't strong on the right either. There's no difference in his performances no matter which side he plays on. He's also able to score the type of goals he does again irrespective of which side he is on.

I don't want a player who does pretty things. I want someone who controls the ball, links the play, progresses the the play forward. Someone who can help alleviate the pressure in trying moments, someone who can help break a settled defence, a player who doesn't automatically pass backwards of they're not receiving the ball in eons of space. I want someone who isn't completely reliant on the the work of others to have any impact and that's Johnson. If our others players are spoon feeding him he's having 0 impact or presence on the pitch. Maybe some goals is enough to satisfy you but I know that isn't what isn't going to win the big games and big competitions.
 
Muttley said:
I don't think it is zero contribution but something is broken. I feel like Johnson works his socks off but just doesn't know how to be relevant. He had only 27 touches in 80 mins on the pitch today. Richi had 23 touches in 73 mins but nobody is slating his contribution. It's about the same rate against relegation fodder. It's a shame fans don't have access to the running stats as I expect Johnson probably runs and runs in this setup.

As another benchmark, Kudus had 46 touches in 87 mins. This is perhaps a data point how much more relevant he is going to be at this club.

Our club is lacking natural lefties to be fair. Johnson could have easily had less touches as the system isn't setup on the left as well as the Porro / Kudus partnership with Sarr or Bergval on their inside. We need to keep trying to get something working on our left side. It's not just down to one player.
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Johnson averaged roughly the same number of touches when he played on the right. Let's not start believing a false narrative that him playing on the left makes any difference. Irrespective where he plays he isn't just someone has a regular contribution to the general game.
 
Bishop said:
I'm not underestimating it I'm saying that it's a great trait to have but it makes him reliant on the work of others. I'm if Sarr doesn't intercept the though ball Johnson isn't going to take the ball, beat a man and ion up the chance for himself.

It works out fine on a day like today where we win the game and got through the rough spell and got the 2nd and then 3rd goals but as we saw last season thats not always the case. Sometimes we actually need him to also contribute, for him to be the player who helps others score not just waiting for an opportunity to put the ball into the back of the net himself.


Johnson isn't strong on the right either. There's no difference in his performances no matter which side he plays on. He's also able to score the type of goals he does again irrespective of which side he is on.

I don't want a player who does pretty things. I want someone who controls the ball, links the play, progresses the the play forward. Someone who can help alleviate the pressure in trying moments, someone who can help break a settled defence, a player who doesn't automatically pass backwards of they're not receiving the ball in eons of space. I want someone who isn't completely reliant on the the work of others to have any impact and that's Johnson. If our others players are spoon feeding him he's having 0 impact or presence on the pitch. Maybe some goals is enough to satisfy you but I know that isn't what isn't going to win the big games and big competitions.
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Ha ha
If you think today’s finish was spoon feeding then your dropping in my estimation of a fan man

He did score the winner of a huge competition
 
Bishop said:
Johnson averaged roughly the same number of touches when he played on the right. Let's not start believing a false narrative that him playing on the left makes any difference. Irrespective where he plays he isn't just someone has a regular contribution to the general game.
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His touches don’t change
But then if his goal return doesn’t it’s a lot of goals
I mean like the most goals we scored when people said it was only because we only attacked
Maybe both things can be wrong and right
As I say, Josh’s for his limitations does the one thing that wins you games… he scores
You don’t win without scoring and he has shown that consistently here
 
Bedfordspurs said:
Ha ha
If you think today’s finish was spoon feeding then your dropping in my estimation of a fan man

He did score the winner of a huge competition
Click to expand...
The ball was played into his running path, he just needed to control which he did and then he finished it superbly but the genesis of that goal was with Sarr not Johnson. Sarr was key, I'd like to see Johnson occasionally be the key, be the man who helps others.
 
Bedfordspurs said:
His touches don’t change
But then if his goal return doesn’t it’s a lot of goals
I mean like the most goals we scored when people said it was only because we only attacked
Maybe both things can be wrong and right
As I say, Josh’s for his limitations does the one thing that wins you games… he scores
You don’t win without scoring and he has shown that consistently here
Click to expand...
He scored because others create for him. This is a team game, I've never understood the attitude that gives all the kudos to the man who put the ball into the back of net but minimises the contributions of these players that got it to that stage in the first place.

It's clearly a fundamental philosophical difference, I emphasise team elements and the Interrelated nature of how a football team works. For me a see a machine that is a bit broken and the various cogs are not correctly balanced.
 
Bishop said:
He scored because others create for him. This is a team game, I've never understood the attitude that gives all the kudos to the man who put the ball into the back of net but minimises the contributions of these players that got it to that stage in the first place.

It's clearly a fundamental philosophical difference, I emphasise team elements and the Interrelated nature of how a football team works. For me a see a machine that is a bit broken and the various cogs are not correctly balanced.
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But the teams can be amazing and not score
Scoring is the fundamental key to winning
It’s why teams get relegated and teams win totals
Haaland does nothing but score and he is machine
I think you’re massively under valuing what most pros and clubs value the most … goals
 
Bishop said:
I'm not underestimating it I'm saying that it's a great trait to have but it makes him reliant on the work of others. I'm if Sarr doesn't intercept the though ball Johnson isn't going to take the ball, beat a man and ion up the chance for himself.

It works out fine on a day like today where we win the game and got through the rough spell and got the 2nd and then 3rd goals but as we saw last season thats not always the case. Sometimes we actually need him to also contribute, for him to be the player who helps others score not just waiting for an opportunity to put the ball into the back of the net himself.


Johnson isn't strong on the right either. There's no difference in his performances no matter which side he plays on. He's also able to score the type of goals he does again irrespective of which side he is on.

I don't want a player who does pretty things. I want someone who controls the ball, links the play, progresses the the play forward. Someone who can help alleviate the pressure in trying moments, someone who can help break a settled defence, a player who doesn't automatically pass backwards of they're not receiving the ball in eons of space. I want someone who isn't completely reliant on the the work of others to have any impact and that's Johnson. If our others players are spoon feeding him he's having 0 impact or presence on the pitch. Maybe some goals is enough to satisfy you but I know that isn't what isn't going to win the big games and big competitions.
Click to expand...

Johnson had 5 assists and 11 goals in the Prem last season.
The season before was 5 goals and 11 assists.
Funnily enoughm, he won a big game and a big trophy in May by being there to scruff the only goal.
I know the point you're making, but I think you'll only ever get Johnson if you see what he does do versus what he doesn't.
 
thfcsteff said:
Johnson had 5 assists and 11 goals in the Prem last season.
The season before was 5 goals and 11 assists.
Funnily enoughm, he won a big game and a big trophy in May by being there to scruff the only goal.
I know the point you're making, but I think you'll only ever get Johnson if you see what he does do versus what he doesn't.
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Clearly I look at football in a different way to you guys. I do see what he does and I see what he doesn't and I value what he's not doing more than what he does. I need more than just goals and I honestly don't really even care for raw assist stats, they don't tell a great deal without context.
 
Bishop said:
Clearly I look at football in a different way to you guys. I do see what he does and I see what he doesn't and I value what he's not doing more than what he does. I need more than just goals and I honestly don't really even care for raw assist stats, they don't tell a great deal without context.
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I agree stats do not tell the whole story in many cases. I tend to make an exception for goals and assists. Especially goals. I've seen some lumps in football over the decades, inert sausages whose presence on a pitch woud confuse many casual observers. The only thing they could do? Score goals.
In the modern game I absolutely accept that a player should be able to do everything/multi-task, and be part of a fully-functional successful side. But I think there are some players who have a knack for certain things.
However you did make it clear that you 'value what he's not doing more than what he does'.
It's a hard standard to hold IMO, and would surely lead you to ask questions of, say Sarr, because he does not produce enough key assist passes or score enough goals as an 8 (I would always choose the perspective of what he does do and how important his specific qualities are to the team).
Where a player like Johnson could become problematic is if he isn't scoring/assisting because then -to your point- he's not bringing anything. In which case Frank wouldn't play him is my guess...
 
Muttley said:
I don't think it is zero contribution but something is broken. I feel like Johnson works his socks off but just doesn't know how to be relevant. He had only 27 touches in 80 mins on the pitch today. Richi had 23 touches in 73 mins but nobody is slating his contribution. It's about the same rate against relegation fodder. It's a shame fans don't have access to the running stats as I expect Johnson probably runs and runs in this setup.

As another benchmark, Kudus had 46 touches in 87 mins. This is perhaps a data point how much more relevant he is going to be at this club.

Our club is lacking natural lefties to be fair. Johnson could have easily had less touches as the system isn't setup on the left as well as the Porro / Kudus partnership with Sarr or Bergval on their inside. We need to keep trying to get something working on our left side. It's not just down to one player.
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He could easily have had an assist too when he pulled back for Richarlison and he hit it at a defender.
 
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Johnson may not be the best winger, but he has useful tools with his speed and finish, i actually think he is quite aware and intelligent on positioning and where the ball needs to go - if used well, he is a dangerous player, drags defenders to him you bet teams are worried about him and his late runs into the box

TF would be well aware when to play him best

Such a silky finish, and his direct and fast runs into box cause havoc
 
I'm just happy to have him in the squad, as he's a very potent weapon if used correctly. I get it, I do want him to create more as well for his teammates but he really is more of a second striker/inside forward. Thing is, he does have more competition which is great. It will push him on and hopefully his confidence will continue to be high.
 
Bishop said:
The ball was played into his running path, he just needed to control which he did and then he finished it superbly but the genesis of that goal was with Sarr not Johnson. Sarr was key, I'd like to see Johnson occasionally be the key, be the man who helps others.
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The mental gymnastics we do when we want to laud a player we love or put down another we don't, would fill a psychology book. If you want to talk about genesis, then Porro's ball to Richy was probably even more relevant. However the exodus was all Johnson's.... from the vision to see the space, the timing of the run, the initial control, the coolness of mind and the nonchalant flick with the outside of the boot were pure genius... but things that can only be appreciated with an unbiased mind.....
 
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