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Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

Silly McSilly Face said:
Did I say i supported military action against Iran on behalf of Israel?


Whole section on Iran under threat from state actors, following on from Russia.
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That was definitely the impression I got from your posts. If that’s not your position and I was wrong then I apologise

I will have a read of the link.

Anyway… the international war has started now and will probably last decades in an asymmetrical sense

In will mean potentially millions of lives lost

It will cost billions/Trillions

It will mean more refugees, I read somewhere that Iran takes more refugees than any other country, this will also include huge numbers of Iranian refugees as well.

My belief is that it will actually make Israel more unsafe in the long run. BIBI is actually doing massive harm to Israel itself in the longer term

I just hope the Uk doesn’t get involved. But I won’t hold my breath.

We have seen how this plays out.

It’s just depressing man.
 
DTA said:
That was definitely the impression I got from your posts. If that’s not your position and I was wrong then I apologise

I will have a read of the link.

Anyway… the international war has started now and will probably last decades in an asymmetrical sense

In will mean potentially millions of lives lost

It will cost billions/Trillions

It will mean more refugees, I read somewhere that Iran takes more refugees than any other country, this will also include huge numbers of Iranian refugees as well.

My belief is that it will actually make Israel more unsafe in the long run. BIBI is actually doing massive harm to Israel itself in the longer term

I just hope the Uk doesn’t get involved. But I won’t hold my breath.

We have seen how this plays out.

It’s just depressing man.
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I think we have to be very careful about getting involved in military action. I was merely discussing the international law points and weighing in on the "Israel and Iran are just as bad as each other" to point out that Israel is a friendly state to the UK and not assessed as a threat in significant contrast to Iran and that people need to separate emotions over Israeli action in Gaza/West Bank from Israeli action against Iran and assess that on its own merit (just as two wrongs dont make a right, a wrong dome by someone doesnt make everything they do wrong).

The other point i was trying to make is the threat a nuclear armed Iran represents may be deemed intolerable and it is those considerations those in power must weigh up. And they're not easy decisions.

Trump is ideologically opposed to US foreign military intervention, yet has just authorised s significant and unprecedented US attack on Iran. This attack has received vocal support from our own PM, which illustrates how ideology may not stand when confronted by the realities of life by security and military advisors, some of the details of which I'm sure are unknown outside of a very tight inner circle.
 
Silly McSilly Face said:
I think we have to be very careful about getting involved in military action. I was merely discussing the international law points and weighing in on the "Israel and Iran are just as bad as each other" to point out that Israel is a friendly state to the UK and not assessed as a threat in significant contrast to Iran and that people need to separate emotions over Israeli action in Gaza/West Bank from Israeli action against Iran and assess that on its own merit (just as two wrongs dont make a right, a wrong dome by someone doesnt make everything they do wrong).

The other point i was trying to make is the threat a nuclear armed Iran represents may be deemed intolerable and it is those considerations those in power must weigh up. And they're not easy decisions.

Trump is ideologically opposed to US foreign military intervention, yet has just authorised s significant and unprecedented US attack on Iran. This attack has received vocal support from our own PM, which illustrates how ideology may not stand when confronted by the realities of life by security and military advisors, some of the details of which I'm sure are unknown outside of a very tight inner circle.
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It’s not like a British Prime Minister has been wrong in following an American President before right?

BIBI wanted that war as well, said it would make the world a safer place.

So now Iran’s nuclear capabilities have been destroyed, that’s as far as it will go right?

I’m pretty sure that’s not going to be the case. It’s going to escalate and we will get involved at some point down the line.

Anyway I’m bowing out of this discussion for now. The situation It’s depressing.
 
DTA said:
It’s not like a British Prime Minister has been wrong in following an American President before right?

BIBI wanted that war as well, said it would make the world a safer place.

So now Iran’s nuclear capabilities have been destroyed, that’s as far as it will go right?

I’m pretty sure that’s not going to be the case. It’s going to escalate and we will get involved at some point down the line.

Anyway I’m bowing out of this discussion for now. The situation It’s depressing.
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It will likely escalate Iran's desire to attack the west, yes. Unfortunately we've been playing this dance for decades.

Lesser discussed point on degrading Iran's weapons production capabilities - are you in favour of action to degrade Russia's ability to attack Ukraine? Because Iran has been central to that capability over the last 3 years.
 
Baleforce said:
I wouldn’t call it flag shagging nonsense with Iran involved, they are a threat to others through their funding and sheltering of terrorists.

Not to mention of course their continued threats and aggression towards Israel.

That Israel are targeted makes it our war as far as I’m concerned, the UK was crucial in the founding of Israel, and had we stood up in the 30’s the reason for it would never have happened in the first place.

Sometimes you need to step in and smack the fudgers down before they are in a position to cause real damage.
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What about international law. Why is it applied to Iran but not the western bloc. Israel have nukes too and they have shown much depraved intent than anyone in the world put together.

So the double standards are insane for me
 
LutonSpurs said:
What about international law. Why is it applied to Iran but not the western bloc. Israel have nukes too and they have shown much depraved intent than anyone in the world put together.

So the double standards are insane for me
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For me Israel is a unique case, they are under such aggressive threat in the region, until the surrounding countries accept Israel’s existence, they need to be protected.

We are a long long way from making up for what we allowed to happen in Europe under in the 30’s and 40’s.
 
Baleforce said:
For me Israel is a unique case, they are under such aggressive threat in the region, until the surrounding countries accept Israel’s existence, they need to be protected.

We are a long long way from making up for what we allowed to happen in Europe under in the 30’s and 40’s.
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Agreed that Israel is a unique case, but its a bit like Northern Ireland. The violence is only going to stop when there is a compromise and for me that must involve a two-state solution with the same western investment and protection afforded to an independent, recognised Palestine.
 
Silly McSilly Face said:
Agreed that Israel is a unique case, but its a bit like Northern Ireland. The violence is only going to stop when there is a compromise and for me that must involve a two-state solution with the same western investment and protection afforded to an independent, recognised Palestine.
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The current Israeli government has never believed in the 2 state solution. For longer than Hamas have existed
 
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We would be incredibly stupid to get involved in a war on/invasion of Iran.

Given the parallels with the build up to the Iraq war it seems incredible that anyone could be dumb enough to be sold the same lie twice.

But then I look at the outcome of Brexit and the groundswell of support for reform and it seems inevitable.

We truly are living in an age of idiocracy.
 
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Baleforce said:
For me Israel is a unique case, they are under such aggressive threat in the region, until the surrounding countries accept Israel’s existence, they need to be protected.

We are a long long way from making up for what we allowed to happen in Europe under in the 30’s and 40’s.
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What who allowed to happen?
 
Crab.C.Nesbitt said:
We would be incredibly stupid to get involved in a war on/invasion of Iran.

Given the parallels with the build up to the Iraq war it seems incredible that anyone could be dumb enough to be sold the same lie twice.

But then I look at the outcome of Brexit and the groundswell of support for reform and it seems inevitable.

We truly are living in an age of idiocracy.
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The government and leading elites did not want Brexit for gods sake.
 
Crab.C.Nesbitt said:
We would be incredibly stupid to get involved in a war on/invasion of Iran.

Given the parallels with the build up to the Iraq war it seems incredible that anyone could be dumb enough to be sold the same lie twice.

But then I look at the outcome of Brexit and the groundswell of support for reform and it seems inevitable.

We truly are living in an age of idiocracy.
Click to expand...

Idiocracy? You have no idea what is coming.
 
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