Where is it going wrong in attack?

[billyiddo]

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2013/nov/03/tottenham

This was another poor attacking performance from Tottenham Hotspur, and it is remarkable that André Villas-Boas' side are fourth in the Premier League having scored only nine goals in 10 matches.
Spurs have depended on their excellent defensive record – only five goals conceded – but these raw statistics are rather misleading, suggesting Villas-Boas deliberately sacrifices attacking firepower in order to keep it tight at the back. In reality, Spurs are one of the division's more adventurous sides – they have the second-highest average share of possession, behind Emirates Marketing Project, and have attempted the most shots. They have simply not been creative or clinical enough.
For this trip to Goodison Park, Villas-Boas continued with two wingers, Andros Townsend and Aaron Lennon. The former is capable of going down the line but generally cuts inside before shooting with his left foot, whereas Lennon's deployment on the left flank hampers his crossing ability without boosting his goalscoring potential. Lennon presented Roberto Soldado with one fine early chance but otherwise both wingers were unproductive.
Spurs were actually dominating possession too much in the first half.
Townsend and Lennon are more suited to direct attacking: Townsend impressed on England duty by driving forward powerfully from deep positions, while Lennon's best contributions are in similar situations – think of his assist for Peter Crouch at the San Siro, for example. Neither are regular goalscorers or proficient at playing clever through-balls, and neither was particularly useful in this situation.
While Soldado is adept at converting crosses, he is not a limited, old-fashioned target man who depends solely on that method of service. At Valencia, he was equally capable of bursting past the opposition's back four on to through-balls, often finishing first time from clever angles. In this Tottenham side, it is difficult to pinpoint a player capable of playing those type of passes.
A peculiar but perhaps revealing statistic is that Spurs have been caught offside fewer times, nine, than any other Premier League team. Being flagged offside is clearly not a virtue in itself, but it is a natural consequence of having a striker regularly sprinting on to through-balls, something evidently not happening at Spurs.
Lewis Holtby is tactically intelligent but not a catalyst in the manner of Oscar or Mesut Özil, and it is extremely rare to see Spurs' attacking quartet combining in dangerous zones. Lennon, Townsend, Holtby and Soldado seem like independent actors, and the closest thing Spurs have had to cohesion this season is when Gylfi Sigurdsson and Christian Eriksen have been fielded together, forming clever triangles with Soldado towards the left of the pitch against Norwich and Chelsea.
It is understandable, given so many arrivals and the departure of last season's star performer, that Villas-Boas is still attempting to find his best attacking combination – but he still seems surprisingly far away from an adequate solution. Eriksen is surely the key player, while the Argentinian attacker Erik Lamela will grow in prominence over the course of the season.
Villas-Boas will be reluctant to make any changes that risk jeopardising the fine defensive record and Spurs do not need to become more attacking, simply more efficient with their attacking.

 

[Modric THFC]

André Villas-Boas issued a staunch defence of Tottenham Hotspur's goals record this season as his side missed the chance to go second in the Premier League at Everton.

Both Everton and Spurs were unable to close the gap on the leaders, Arsenal, after producing a lacklustre goalless draw at Goodison Park, albeit one with nine minutes of added time after Hugo Lloris suffered a head injury in an accidental collision with Romelu Lukaku. The visiting goalkeeper was able to continue having refused to leave the field and it was the Everton striker who ultimately departed with a thigh problem.

The draw means Spurs have scored only nine league goals this season – three of them penalties. Only Hull have scored fewer among the top 10 teams in the Premier League. Villas-Boas, however, bristled at the post-match questions over his team's lack of penetration and pointed to a return of 30 goals from 17 matches in all competitions – including 15 in the Europa League and six in the Capital One Cup – as evidence of a functioning cutting edge.

"I don't think it is dramatic," said Villas-Boas. "We are on 30 goals in 17 games and it is the second highest ever at the club at this stage so I don't worry about that. Hull are sitting 10th and we are fourth. The chances are coming and sometimes they go your way and the opponent is not there to stop it. The team is creating more chances and more shots. I can carry on about all the good statistics and others can carry on about all the negative statistics and the debate will go nowhere.

"At the moment it is results that have put us in fourth and in one of the spots for the Champions League. You can have more goals, less goals. We all want excitement but right now the team is doing extremely well."

But the Spurs manager conceded his team should have been more clinical during a dominant first-half display. He added: "I am not disappointed with that result. In the end it was a good result and the only time Everton had a good go at us was in the last 25 to 30 minutes. We had a very good game and could have been a bit more clinical.

"I am still happy with the team, but because of what Everton did in the final stages it was a fair result. We couldn't be more happy with the players. They pressed well and had great motivation. There was a lot at stake for both teams with the chance to go second and I think we did extremely well."

Lloris required lengthy treatment after taking that blow to the head from Lukaku but Villas-Boas eventually agreed to the goalkeeper's request to continue. "Hugo still doesn't recall everything about the incident," he said. "It was a very difficult moment for us and I am happy he is well.

"I made the call to keep him on the pitch because of the signs he was giving. He was determined to continue and looked concentrated, driven and focused enough for me not to make the call to replace him. The saves he made after the incident proved that right."

Villas-Boas accepted the referee, Kevin Friend, was correct not to award a penalty when Jan Vertonghen fell under a Seamus Coleman challenge in the first half and again when the roles were reversed in the second half. "There was minimal contact," he said. Everton's manager, Roberto Martínez, however, believed Vertonghen should have been punished for his touch on the defender.

"They tell you decisions level themselves out over a season but it doesn't happen," said Martínez. "We had a similar situation at Villa and at the Etihad [Stadium]. Seamus gets impeded. He doesn't over-react, he gets back on his feet and it should have been a penalty."

:-k

Or AVB could accept the league statistics mean more than barely competitive cup games and stop hiding behind them.

And there's no way he should have been making that decision on Lloris. He was nowhere near him to even talk to him and it's a doctor's decision in the first place.

 

[Rorschach]

André Villas-Boas issued a staunch defence of Tottenham Hotspur's goals record this season as his side missed the chance to go second in the Premier League at Everton.

Both Everton and Spurs were unable to close the gap on the leaders, Arsenal, after producing a lacklustre goalless draw at Goodison Park, albeit one with nine minutes of added time after Hugo Lloris suffered a head injury in an accidental collision with Romelu Lukaku. The visiting goalkeeper was able to continue having refused to leave the field and it was the Everton striker who ultimately departed with a thigh problem.

The draw means Spurs have scored only nine league goals this season – three of them penalties. Only Hull have scored fewer among the top 10 teams in the Premier League. Villas-Boas, however, bristled at the post-match questions over his team's lack of penetration and pointed to a return of 30 goals from 17 matches in all competitions – including 15 in the Europa League and six in the Capital One Cup – as evidence of a functioning cutting edge.

"I don't think it is dramatic," said Villas-Boas. "We are on 30 goals in 17 games and it is the second highest ever at the club at this stage so I don't worry about that. Hull are sitting 10th and we are fourth. The chances are coming and sometimes they go your way and the opponent is not there to stop it. The team is creating more chances and more shots. I can carry on about all the good statistics and others can carry on about all the negative statistics and the debate will go nowhere.

"At the moment it is results that have put us in fourth and in one of the spots for the Champions League. You can have more goals, less goals. We all want excitement but right now the team is doing extremely well."

But the Spurs manager conceded his team should have been more clinical during a dominant first-half display. He added: "I am not disappointed with that result. In the end it was a good result and the only time Everton had a good go at us was in the last 25 to 30 minutes. We had a very good game and could have been a bit more clinical.

"I am still happy with the team, but because of what Everton did in the final stages it was a fair result. We couldn't be more happy with the players. They pressed well and had great motivation. There was a lot at stake for both teams with the chance to go second and I think we did extremely well."

Lloris required lengthy treatment after taking that blow to the head from Lukaku but Villas-Boas eventually agreed to the goalkeeper's request to continue. "Hugo still doesn't recall everything about the incident," he said. "It was a very difficult moment for us and I am happy he is well.

"I made the call to keep him on the pitch because of the signs he was giving. He was determined to continue and looked concentrated, driven and focused enough for me not to make the call to replace him. The saves he made after the incident proved that right."

Villas-Boas accepted the referee, Kevin Friend, was correct not to award a penalty when Jan Vertonghen fell under a Seamus Coleman challenge in the first half and again when the roles were reversed in the second half. "There was minimal contact," he said. Everton's manager, Roberto Martínez, however, believed Vertonghen should have been punished for his touch on the defender.

"They tell you decisions level themselves out over a season but it doesn't happen," said Martínez. "We had a similar situation at Villa and at the Etihad [Stadium]. Seamus gets impeded. He doesn't over-react, he gets back on his feet and it should have been a penalty."

:-k

Actually in this match I'd say they did Roberto.

 

[Spursalot]

Or AVB could accept the league statistics mean more than barely competitive cup games and stop hiding behind them.

And there's no way he should have been making that decision on Lloris. He was nowhere near him to even talk to him and it's a doctor's decision in the first place.

The league statistics are important, you're right. Currently the most useful statistic has us fourth in the premier league, so in the champions league spots. At the end of the day that is what he will be rated against.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

Or AVB could accept the league statistics mean more than barely competitive cup games and stop hiding behind them.

And there's no way he should have been making that decision on Lloris. He was nowhere near him to even talk to him and it's a doctor's decision in the first place.

AVB is a clever guy. He doesn't say anything without considering it and knows exactly what 'line' to take before any interview.

It's likely that he knows full well that scoring 5 goals against Tiblisi or 4 against a weakened Villa in the Capital One Cup doesn't mean that everything is hunky dory in the league. But I think he also knows his players, knows exactly what he is trying to achieve and likely expects a bit less fluidity as new signings assimilate to their environment while all the while having pressure on results. With that in mind he's gotten us solid defensively and given us a good platform to improve. And coming out and criticising the players attacking contributions won't really help anything right now. Much better to protect them and praise them since it's clear they are trying to improve upon it collectively.

 

[milo]

André Villas-Boas issued a staunch defence of Tottenham Hotspur's goals record this season as his side missed the chance to go second in the Premier League at Everton.


:-k

Rossi, I've lost count of the number of times that you have been asked but please provide links when copying from elsewhere.

 

[SpurMeUp]

We're a new team with a lot of young players. That is the crux of our problems. We don't know our best attacking players who are all new - maybe bar Lennon who's been out for a while. We have to give them time and there are encouraging signs. First half we were very very good. One thing is missing tho:

The Assist.

It has been missing most of the season and last season. Bale could bang them in. Sigi can now and again. Townsend tries. But we're lacking in team goals. The Chelsea goal shows we can. With time comes better understanding of movement, and awareness of others movement. Sigi shot at the end, had he crossed it, Paulinho would have tapped in. We would have won the game.

When we have possession and and have worked the ball to within sight of the box, we show our inexperience. This is where better teams come into their own. For example, **** will have a runner from midfield or the wing looking to sprint past the oppositions back 4. But the player in possession doesn't pass to that runner - they will pass to someone who's on the shoulder of the last man - and he will flick the ball onto the runner. A triangle - 3 players - but crucially its a more complex build up and less predictable. It requires team work and team movement off the ball. One man is in possession - but two other players are moving - and they are moving not just for the first pass - but for the one after.

That is what Soldado is missing. Better movement in and around him. Balls to him that he can flick on to runners, and receive back.

Our movement around the oppositions back 4 lacks certainty and players are not quite sure when or where to run, or they don't fully believe in it. But it will come. We have to give it time.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

I also don't think it is too unfair to say that it's easier to gain a winning mentality by being solid and not losing before it is to try and be fancy and fluid and hope the solidity comes later. One is confidence building, the other is confidence draining.

So while it would be fantastic to turn up to a place like Everton, dominate possession AND create loads of chances, really only a select few teams in the world will be capable of that and not really us in this learning stage with new signings to acclimatise.

We are learning how to be solid, to press as a team and take care of the ball. We are learning to be intelligent in games with regards to our tempo and how to get results during this process. The next stage will be to have fluid football alongside this solidity. But right now it is clear the team is still learning when to make a risky pass and when to make an easy one in the final third. But while that happens, we are winding up crowds to a hilarious extent on away games because we are turning up to places and not letting the home team have the ball for long periods.

I'm sure everything else will come. We could have started off playing nicer football but I'm pretty sure results wouldn't be there if we did.

 

[Kingdawson]

I also don't think it is too unfair to say that it's easier to gain a winning mentality by being solid and not losing before it is to try and be fancy and fluid and hope the solidity comes later. One is confidence building, the other is confidence draining.

So while it would be fantastic to turn up to a place like Everton, dominate possession AND create loads of chances, really only a select few teams in the world will be capable of that and not really us in this learning stage with new signings to acclimatise.

We are learning how to be solid, to press as a team and take care of the ball. We are learning to be intelligent in games with regards to our tempo and how to get results during this process. The next stage will be to have fluid football alongside this solidity. But right now it is clear the team is still learning when to make a risky pass and when to make an easy one in the final third. But while that happens, we are winding up crowds to a hilarious extent on away games because we are turning up to places and not letting the home team have the ball for long periods.

I'm sure everything else will come. We could have started off playing nicer football but I'm pretty sure results wouldn't be there if we did.

I'm sorry mate but you've been saying this for a while now and it doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime soon. You also said our home performances have suddenly improved because of one game vs norwich and look what's happened since then.

In terms of the football we're producing it's safe to say it's the worst brand of football since Santini was in charge. 1 and a quarter years playing an utterly hideous brand of football at home where we create about 1 clear cut chance every 5 games is more than disturbing and something needs to be done about it.

 

[diego_maradona]

I'm sorry mate but you've been saying this for a while now and it doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime soon. You also said our home performances have suddenly improved because of one game vs norwich and look what's happened since then.

In terms of the football we're producing it's safe to say it's the worst brand of football since Santini was in charge. 1 and a quarter years playing an utterly hideous brand of football at home where we create about 1 clear cut chance every 5 games is more than disturbing and something needs to be done about it.

How would you change it? Is it just a personnel thing? A formation?

 

[Rossi22]

Rossi, I've lost count of the number of times that you have been asked but please provide links when copying from elsewhere.

Don't you trust me?

 

[Robspur12]

I'm sorry mate but you've been saying this for a while now and it doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime soon. You also said our home performances have suddenly improved because of one game vs norwich and look what's happened since then.

In terms of the football we're producing it's safe to say it's the worst brand of football since Santini was in charge. 1 and a quarter years playing an utterly hideous brand of football at home where we create about 1 clear cut chance every 5 games is more than disturbing and something needs to be done about it.

Spot on. No point talking about where we are now, in the grand scheme of things it is neither here nor there. If we carry on with this pattern of play we will not qualify for the Champions League I can guarantee it. We have been lucky in at least 2 of our wins surely that luck will run out at some point.

 

[kanoute16]

I'm sorry mate but you've been saying this for a while now and it doesn't look like it's going to happen anytime soon. You also said our home performances have suddenly improved because of one game vs norwich and look what's happened since then.

In terms of the football we're producing it's safe to say it's the worst brand of football since Santini was in charge. 1 and a quarter years playing an utterly hideous brand of football at home where we create about 1 clear cut chance every 5 games is more than disturbing and something needs to be done about it.

I agree with this - the brand of football at the moment is pretty awful and this is why I am left feeling utterly disillusioned. Yes we are fourth, yes we have a lot of new players, yes we need to give them time blah blah blah. These are all excuses that shield the real truth - the manager's tactics are negative, cautious and ****ing boring!

What can we do to solve this? For a start we could pass the ball better, more quickly, up the tempo of our game and make some intelligent runs (off the ball, that's right movement OFF THE BALL). Everything is too rigid, too planned! The players need to have a license to express themselves a bit more. It's all too predictable and slow at the moment. A similar scenario happened early on last season and avb changed his mindset. With bale and Lennon we had the ability to run teams ragged. This season we have no width, there are fewer chances and soldado is looking like a very expensive mistake tbh. This guy is a proven goal machine but not in a team that creates so few chances and is scared to make a forward pass!

BOLD and BRAVE are two words I think we could learn from - we need to be both these words but I don't think avb knows this which worries me a lot!

 

[billyiddo]

I agree with this - the brand of football at the moment is pretty awful and this is why I am left feeling utterly disillusioned. Yes we are fourth, yes we have a lot of new players, yes we need to give them time blah blah blah. These are all excuses that shield the real truth - the manager's tactics are negative, cautious and ****ing boring!

What can we do to solve this? For a start we could pass the ball better, more quickly, up the tempo of our game and make some intelligent runs (off the ball, that's right movement OFF THE BALL). Everything is too rigid, too planned! The players need to have a license to express themselves a bit more. It's all too predictable and slow at the moment. A similar scenario happened early on last season and avb changed his mindset. With bale and Lennon we had the ability to run teams ragged. This season we have no width, there are fewer chances and soldado is looking like a very expensive mistake tbh. This guy is a proven goal machine but not in a team that creates so few chances and is scared to make a forward pass!

BOLD and BRAVE are two words I think we could learn from - we need to be both these words but I don't think avb knows this which worries me a lot!

i entirely disagree that our tactics are negative - we set up to control games, which we do - we dominate possession in vital areas but are lacking the final bit of ingenuity to convert that possession in to clear cut chances. that may be a negative outcome but is in no way a negative approach to take to the field

the way yourself and others talk down the need to be patient is the problem

Yes we are fourth, yes we have a lot of new players, yes we need to give them time blah blah blah

yes we do need to give them time and it's about time some of you started doing this rather than paying lip service to the idea.

 

[Kingdawson]

How would you change it? Is it just a personnel thing? A formation?

Firstly i'd abandon this closing down tactic we've adopted at home (or at least minimise it drastically). I've said since the first few games of last season that our performances will not improve if we continue to adopt this tactic (think it was after the 1-1 vs Norwich) and it's proved to be the case. We're so fascinated with closing down the opposition when we should be encouraging them to keep the possession in non threatening positions so they start to get comfortable thus pushing a few more players forward.

All this closing down stuff does is improve our possession count...woopdeedoo we have the highest percentage stat in the league but what good is that when we create **** all? people cream themselves over this possession stat but it really isn't that big a deal at all. Let the opposition have possession in their half or even a little further up the field...don't continuously close them down imo.

 

[diego_maradona]

I'm stunned at the amount of people who have basically said this is it. This is AVB's vision. This is "as good as it gets" with AVB. "He's negative, cautious and ****ing boring".

Maybe we should start a vote to see how many people think we should sack him. Seriously. From what I've read tonight I think it will be a pretty close run thing.



I'm not saying he's perfect by any stretch. But this is a new side and I'm happy to give him a chance. He lost Luka, VdV and Ledley the season before. Last season he lost Gareth.

He practically has a brand new team from the side he inherited, and he still has us sat in fourth with one of our best starts to a league following on from our record points total. I can't believe this is "as good as it gets" with AVB. He deserves the chance to show us exactly his blueprint of success for this club. I'm sure he sees the same issues we do. He has shown he is capable of learning and I'm sure he can solve our goal scoring issues.

 

[Robspur12]

Firstly i'd abandon this closing down tactic we've adopted at home (or at least minimise it drastically). I've said since the first few games of last season that our performances will not improve if we continue to adopt this tactic (think it was after the 1-1 vs Norwich) and it's proved to be the case. We're so fascinated with closing down the opposition when we should be encouraging them to keep the possession in non threatening positions so they start to get comfortable thus pushing a few more players forward.

All this closing down stuff does is improve our possession count...woopdeedoo we have the highest percentage stat in the league but what good is that when we create **** all? people cream themselves over this possession stat but it really isn't that big a deal at all. Let the opposition have possession in their half or even a little further up the field...don't continuously close them down imo.

But the closing down high up the pitch works superbly for Arsenal and Southampton. Having possession is surely a good thing? what we need to be is to be threatening with what we have. Move the ball more quickly and take risks as well as have midfielders making runs into the box ( which siggy does well but Paulinho does not). I think we need more quick passers and midfielders willing to run beyond soldado. In that respect I would try sig and eriksen with sandro holding and drop Paulinho and Dembele. But what do I know.

 

[elltrev]

Firstly i'd abandon this closing down tactic we've adopted at home (or at least minimise it drastically). I've said since the first few games of last season that our performances will not improve if we continue to adopt this tactic (think it was after the 1-1 vs Norwich) and it's proved to be the case. We're so fascinated with closing down the opposition when we should be encouraging them to keep the possession in non threatening positions so they start to get comfortable thus pushing a few more players forward.

All this closing down stuff does is improve our possession count...woopdeedoo we have the highest percentage stat in the league but what good is that when we create **** all? people cream themselves over this possession stat but it really isn't that big a deal at all. Let the opposition have possession in their half or even a little further up the field...don't continuously close them down imo.

And plays a part in our amazing defensive record in fairness.

 

[diego_maradona]

Firstly i'd abandon this closing down tactic we've adopted at home (or at least minimise it drastically). I've said since the first few games of last season that our performances will not improve if we continue to adopt this tactic (think it was after the 1-1 vs Norwich) and it's proved to be the case. We're so fascinated with closing down the opposition when we should be encouraging them to keep the possession in non threatening positions so they start to get comfortable thus pushing a few more players forward.

All this closing down stuff does is improve our possession count...woopdeedoo we have the highest percentage stat in the league but what good is that when we create **** all? people cream themselves over this possession stat but it really isn't that big a deal at all. Let the opposition have possession in their half or even a little further up the field...don't continuously close them down imo.

Thanks mate. I'm glad to finally read a reasoned debate from a fan offering a solution rather than something as simple as BUY BENTEKE. Interesting thought. So your thought is by allowing teams to come at us we can counter and not be faced with 10 men behind the ball?

 

[Robspur12]

I agree with this - the brand of football at the moment is pretty awful and this is why I am left feeling utterly disillusioned. Yes we are fourth, yes we have a lot of new players, yes we need to give them time blah blah blah. These are all excuses that shield the real truth - the manager's tactics are negative, cautious and ****ing boring!

What can we do to solve this? For a start we could pass the ball better, more quickly, up the tempo of our game and make some intelligent runs (off the ball, that's right movement OFF THE BALL). Everything is too rigid, too planned! The players need to have a license to express themselves a bit more. It's all too predictable and slow at the moment. A similar scenario happened early on last season and avb changed his mindset. With bale and Lennon we had the ability to run teams ragged. This season we have no width, there are fewer chances and soldado is looking like a very expensive mistake tbh. This guy is a proven goal machine but not in a team that creates so few chances and is scared to make a forward pass!

BOLD and BRAVE are two words I think we could learn from - we need to be both these words but I don't think avb knows this which worries me a lot!

Saw this after I had written my post but I'd go along with you mostly except perhaps we have too many players on the pitch unable to play killer passes and with the inverted winger we have players out wide not on their strongest side.