What went wrong?

[1882]

fudging HELL.... just when I thought I'd got Sunday out of my system, it comes and smacks me right in the face again...

2-0 up, I wouldn't have minded him bringing Dawson & Sandro on then, taking Kranjcar and Saha off, leaving Ade up front on his own, and saying 'fudge it, we've got OUR goals... protect what we have... you're not having any of it'

But we didn't, we collapsed, for whatever reason, be it arrogance that the job was already done, or a true inferiority complex that even at 2-0 up we're still not safe... something that we're REALLY going to have to overcome if we REALLY want 3rd... 'cos losers think that way, WINNERS don't!

 

[DanishWhite]

Care to point out what was poor in the Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Everton games? I thought we played those games beautifully, and both were a joy to watch. Our views and expectations do differ, thats obvious.

Maybe one year in the CL led you to believe we would be like Rinus Michels Ajax team this season?

Our expectations are also different, you are right. I expected to be in a three way battle for 4th come March, not sitting 7pts clear in 3rd, and people talking about the title.

As I pointed out, arsenal was the only diabolical PL performance this year. The other two cup games are not even worth talking about, imo.

Where have we played badly, and been at full strength? You dismiss the tough run and injuries like it doesnt actually make a difference, which is just pointless. Considering the situation at Anfield, we played very well to get a point.

City we played very well....dismiss that all you like because we lost, but the fact is, they havent dropped a single point at home, and we very nearly won it...I doubt you would have a single bad thing to say about that game had Defoe scored, even though the rest of the game would have been identical.

Playing "badly", and taking 14pts from 24, with the 3 away games we have had this year and the injuries, suggests to me that you are letting certain results cloud your overall judgement.

You don't get the point, because you are not reading what I write - rather you are making up points and doing strawmen (such as the Rinus Michels one).

It doesn't matter if we have injuries, a managers tax court case and all that.

I am not slagging, blaiming anyone (albeit lots of things could have been improved easily) for it. I am just observing, that overall we haven't been playing very well for a while.

My point is - and refrain from perverting it again, please - I was not suprised about the Arsenal result, because we haven't played well for a while and we have looked shaky too. That simply.

Now, there are plenty of reasons to excuse and on the other hand plenty of things which could have helped to prevent it. But things happened as the did. We didn't play well, in fact we were brick, and we haven't played really well for a while. I have seen all our games for a while now and I have been far from impressed. Even games like Saudi Sportswashing Machine wasn't a great performance (albeit a great result, respect for them). We simply don't look comfortable and in control as in the fall. There, I said it. If you expect less, fine with me. Just don't project things onto me, which I didn't say.

 

[Pirate55]

Couldnt agree more

I agree - The set up was ok it was the players that were at fault.Kranchie was a weakness from the start. He is fine against lesser teams but when up against City and Arse his lack of pace is exposed - hence we conceded 5 in both those games. Parker today was always chasing after players from behind - he was jogging more than running (too tired or is he injured). Ade and Saha showed no fight at all. We need a big reaction against united - we need pressing all over the pitch like the Arse did to us and we did to Liverpool at home earlier this season. Our best performance imo.

 

[thfcsteff]

The thing with the Newcash thrashing was it was achieved against a side missing their two strongest midfielders, both of whom have been excellent this season, and against a side who lined up 4-4-2 away from home DESPITE that. Pardew admitted total blame for their paucity that day, as he should've; they were awful and we clinically took advantage of them.

Having seen that, the ONE thing I did NOT expect us to do last Sunday, was go there with a 4-4-2, let alone one which left one of the KEY ELEMENTS WHICH makes my pants sticky AT FULL-PELT on the bench. Lennon is not just about his pace, he's about the attention he attracts, his ability to work with the full-back (on either side) and (obviously) his all-round threat too. Putting Niko in that position was absolutely baffling. I have rarely wanted an explanation from the manager, but I'd love to hear Harry's logic there. Furthermore, if you see (as he said he did, as I did, as we all probably did) that even at 2-0 we were losing the midfield (and as such, momentum, whether due to Parker's booking or not) then you have to make changes!

The half-time changes were absolutely bizarre, not so much for what they were, but for HOW they shaped up! You feel the momentum shift, you've seen it, the players are supposedly showing HT dressing room bewilderment, well time for the tin-hat rally talk, shape it up as 4-5-1, tell them to remember how great they are in possession, tell them to BE PATIENT AND KILL THE MOMENTUM AND PACE OF THE GAME, and then, as the goons get more desperate, as the minutes tick down, look to hit them on the break. It was there, sitting there to be done, yet Harry failed so spectacularly I am absolutely baffled, because he doesn't usually.

I have to wonder if finally the England thing is/has getting/got to him?

I absolutely lament the fact that we never ever seem able to have Harry distraction-free.
Last season, we lost CL football/4th spot IMHO because Harry was distracted and we went on an absolute ****er of a run.
Whilst I don't see anything like that happening this season, it is a worry that at such a critical juncture in the season, Harry appears to have suffered one of his 'clueless-I-don't-know-what-happened' moments.

To me, it was pretty fudging clear what happened. Yes, blame the players all you want, but it's the manager who sends them out in a formation and with a game plan.

Instructive quotes from Saha's book about Fergie, how he came into the dressing room on-time 3-0 up having scored a brace and got the hairdryer from a manager who was furious at what he'd missed.

We really need to get angry about losing like this from the very top (as another poster said elsewhere)...here's hoping it's corrected come Sunday.

 

[totman]

My point is - and refrain from perverting it again, please - I was not suprised about the Arsenal result, because we haven't played well for a while and we have looked shaky too. That simply.

And my point is, that I dont agree that we've played poorly since the new year, which is what you said originally. No ones perverting anything here mate, Ive pointed out why I disagree with that, in alot of detail