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Transfer speculation

Vega said:
The original JJetset‏@jetsetyid 1m1 minute ago
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You know you all wanted an update and HERE IT IS!
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We're hijacking the neymar deal.
 
billyiddo said:
We shouldn't get involved in any player where the club wants a buy back clause - you're essentially being paid to develop their players if they're a success and if they aren't then you've bought a player not good enough for the top level
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You are absolutely right with this. You are buying a player anticipating them to be a success, so to have to then sell the player for £50m when other strikers are going for far more is basically saying Leicester are paying a £25m loan fee. It's a short term measure allowing a smaller club to be able to get a higher quality player.
 
with regards to Neymar I got sent this earlier


10:29:59 RICHARD PEARCE : have you seen how they've structured the deal?

10:30:22 JULIAN HILL : nope

10:30:24 RICHARD PEARCE : Counterparty A has a contract with Counterparty B

Counterparty C will pay Counterparty A €300mm to be an ambassador for an one of Counterparty C’s events. This payment will not be eligible to tax due to the domicile of Counterparty C

Counterparty A will then pay €222mm to Counterparty B to allow them to terminate the contract

Counterparty D will then enter into a contract with Counterparty A for zero upfront cost

Counterparty D will pay Counterparty A €30mm per year plus performance bonuses

10:30:29 RICHARD PEARCE :

Counterparty A = Neymar

Counterparty B = FC Barcelona

Counterparty C = Qatar Sports Investment

Counterparty D = PSG

10:30:35 RICHARD PEARCE : to get round financial fair play

10:30:43 JULIAN HILL : haha, genius

10:31:33 RICHARD PEARCE : so net neymar paid 80mn eur to be a product 'ambassador' for qatar, barca get 222mn eur and psg pay no upfront but 650k gbp a week after taxto neymar.
 
Glenda's Legs said:
Janssen was bought on 12 July. As the window for non-PL transfers opens 1 July, I'd say that was an early rather than late signing. And he didn't even have the Euros to contend with.
Obviously the earlier we can get a player (the right player) in, the better. But it's just not always possible. Janssen may have been lacking in confidence last season, but it can't be put down to being a late addition to the squad.

I wonder also if Poch's stated preference for versatile players who can play more than one position is also adding to the complexities of the process? eg A good RB needs to at least be able to play RWB as well (but to be able to cover CB or LB would be useful); a DM who is comfortable at CB (or vice versa); or a CM who can play AM - if we are looking for these types of players, then fishing in an already limited pool is made all the more challenging.
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Bang on. That and the fact that the player has to show the right mentality. We are not going to buy players with a bad attitude meaning no more of the Adebayor signings (despite how good he was for us initially). Combine that with wages and the pool is quite considerably shrunk.

Yes it would be idea to get a player in for a full pre-season, but for us and the way we do things, that is not always going to be possible. Because we are viewing transfers as long term buys, this makes sense i.e. to hold out for the right player and not be forced into buying. However, if we were in another situation i.e. needing a short term fix, I am sure that they would identify the player quite quickly and buy them i.e. the resigning of Defoe and Keane, the multiple buys under Santini etc....

I am absolutely sure that everyone at the club would rather buy their preferred targets early on. What I am also sure of is that they won't pay over the odds to do that and that we are not in a position to be able to force any club or player's arm into accepting our terms. I have complete trust that the club is working hard to get in the right players to "freshen things up", but here's the key. To freshen things up, you don't need to buy a player at the beginning of pre-season and buying the wrong player doesn't freshen anything up. To really freshen things up and give a lift to the team, you need a VDV type signing. I live in hope that we get something like that.
 
markysimmo said:
with regards to Neymar I got sent this earlier


10:29:59 RICHARD PEARCE : have you seen how they've structured the deal?

10:30:22 JULIAN HILL : nope

10:30:24 RICHARD PEARCE : Counterparty A has a contract with Counterparty B

Counterparty C will pay Counterparty A €300mm to be an ambassador for an one of Counterparty C’s events. This payment will not be eligible to tax due to the domicile of Counterparty C

Counterparty A will then pay €222mm to Counterparty B to allow them to terminate the contract

Counterparty D will then enter into a contract with Counterparty A for zero upfront cost

Counterparty D will pay Counterparty A €30mm per year plus performance bonuses

10:30:29 RICHARD PEARCE :

Counterparty A = Neymar

Counterparty B = FC Barcelona

Counterparty C = Qatar Sports Investment

Counterparty D = PSG

10:30:35 RICHARD PEARCE : to get round financial fair play

10:30:43 JULIAN HILL : haha, genius

10:31:33 RICHARD PEARCE : so net neymar paid 80mn eur to be a product 'ambassador' for qatar, barca get 222mn eur and psg pay no upfront but 650k gbp a week after taxto neymar.
Click to expand...

That is outrageous if true but symptomatic of using obtuse rules to try and govern financial fair play. I find the whole ethos of FFP inherently unfair. It is geared towards allowing richer clubs to have an advantage over smaller clubs, plain and simple. A far fairer way would be to introduce a wage cap that is equal for all teams in the league. Everyone then has the same limitations. A complete level playing field. That would be far more condusive to a more longer-term vision being adopted by clubs, less hoarding of players, a more competitive league and a greater focus on development of talent which is actually what we all want.
 
La Liga have stated they will not accept the payment from “financial dopers” Paris Saint-Germain to trigger Neymar’s €222m release clause.

PSG are understood to be scheduled to meet with La Liga officials today as they aim to rubber-stamp their £199million move for the Brazilian.

But the Spanish League are not happy at losing one of their marquee players and a spokesman for the office of La Liga president Javier Tebas said: “We will not accept the money for the liberation clause, the reason is that we have doubts that this money is in accordance with UEFA Financial Fair Play rules.”

Speaking to the Madrid-based paper AS prior to the announcement that Neymar had been granted permission to leave Barca training, Tebas slammed the French outfit and said they could not “gift” their supporters new players by “taking them” from others.

“The complaint is ready and will be presented to UEFA, the European Union and the Swiss courts,” Tebas said.

“Basically, the complaint will be over unfair competition and against teams that receive financial injections from owners that ‘gift’ players to their fans by taking them away from others. PSG are a clear example of ‘financial doping’ by club/state.

“PSG’s accounts reflect that they have more commercial income than Real Madrid or Manchester United, which is to say that their brand value is bigger than these two clubs. Well, that is impossible.”

Meanwhile, Barca have released a statement saying Neymar’s full €222m buyout must be met in order for the transfer to happen.

Barcelona earlier confirmed on Wednesday the 25-year-old had been allowed to miss training.

The club tweeted: “Neymar Jr hasn’t trained with the permission of the coach”.

http://www.teamtalk.com/news/neymar-row-erupts-as-la-liga-label-psg-financial-dopers
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
You are absolutely right with this. You are buying a player anticipating them to be a success, so to have to then sell the player for £50m when other strikers are going for far more is basically saying Leicester are paying a £25m loan fee. It's a short term measure allowing a smaller club to be able to get a higher quality player.
Click to expand...
For Leicester it makes sense. For them him performing and improving to the point of City wanting him back for that is a big enough win to be worth it.

For us it wouldn't make sense imo.
markysimmo said:
with regards to Neymar I got sent this earlier


10:29:59 RICHARD PEARCE : have you seen how they've structured the deal?

10:30:22 JULIAN HILL : nope

10:30:24 RICHARD PEARCE : Counterparty A has a contract with Counterparty B

Counterparty C will pay Counterparty A €300mm to be an ambassador for an one of Counterparty C’s events. This payment will not be eligible to tax due to the domicile of Counterparty C

Counterparty A will then pay €222mm to Counterparty B to allow them to terminate the contract

Counterparty D will then enter into a contract with Counterparty A for zero upfront cost

Counterparty D will pay Counterparty A €30mm per year plus performance bonuses

10:30:29 RICHARD PEARCE :

Counterparty A = Neymar

Counterparty B = FC Barcelona

Counterparty C = Qatar Sports Investment

Counterparty D = PSG

10:30:35 RICHARD PEARCE : to get round financial fair play

10:30:43 JULIAN HILL : haha, genius

10:31:33 RICHARD PEARCE : so net neymar paid 80mn eur to be a product 'ambassador' for qatar, barca get 222mn eur and psg pay no upfront but 650k gbp a week after taxto neymar.
Click to expand...
If that gets you around FFP the regulation is pretty pointless.

To me it seems more like an attempt to get around the release clause only being available to the player himself (citation needed) as we've seen before in other deals. At the same time I'm guessing it gives them some leeway in terms of accounting to stay within FFP, but I doubt that they can just totally bypass FFP in this manner.
 
r-u-s-x said:
I think buyback is different than first refusal as it will be in the contract he signed upon moving - not a 100% sure but it it certainly seems enforceable.
http://www.danielgeey.com/football-transfers-buy-back-clauses-explained/
"Should a buy-back provision be triggered, there is usually a contractual obligation to enforce the contract and transfer the player accordingly."
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That is indeed how it works. It was the same for Morata with Real Madrid.

My thoughts are that it is effectively akin to third party ownership and should be banned by FIFA.
 
Jordinho said:
La Liga have stated they will not accept the payment from “financial dopers” Paris Saint-Germain to trigger Neymar’s €222m release clause.

PSG are understood to be scheduled to meet with La Liga officials today as they aim to rubber-stamp their £199million move for the Brazilian.

But the Spanish League are not happy at losing one of their marquee players and a spokesman for the office of La Liga president Javier Tebas said: “We will not accept the money for the liberation clause, the reason is that we have doubts that this money is in accordance with UEFA Financial Fair Play rules.”

Speaking to the Madrid-based paper AS prior to the announcement that Neymar had been granted permission to leave Barca training, Tebas slammed the French outfit and said they could not “gift” their supporters new players by “taking them” from others.

“The complaint is ready and will be presented to UEFA, the European Union and the Swiss courts,” Tebas said.

“Basically, the complaint will be over unfair competition and against teams that receive financial injections from owners that ‘gift’ players to their fans by taking them away from others. PSG are a clear example of ‘financial doping’ by club/state.

“PSG’s accounts reflect that they have more commercial income than Real Madrid or Manchester United, which is to say that their brand value is bigger than these two clubs. Well, that is impossible.”

Meanwhile, Barca have released a statement saying Neymar’s full €222m buyout must be met in order for the transfer to happen.

Barcelona earlier confirmed on Wednesday the 25-year-old had been allowed to miss training.

The club tweeted: “Neymar Jr hasn’t trained with the permission of the coach”.

http://www.teamtalk.com/news/neymar-row-erupts-as-la-liga-label-psg-financial-dopers
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Complaining about what Barca and Real have been doing to others for years?
 
Bedfordspurs said:
This puts a whole new context into everything

To date is been every players dream to go Barca or Madrid...
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I think it will still be the case for south american and latino players for the next few years.
But I think it may have sewn the seed of doubt for many.
 
braineclipse said:
For Leicester it makes sense. For them him performing and improving to the point of City wanting him back for that is a big enough win to be worth it.

For us it wouldn't make sense imo.

If that gets you around FFP the regulation is pretty pointless.

To me it seems more like an attempt to get around the release clause only being available to the player himself (citation needed) as we've seen before in other deals. At the same time I'm guessing it gives them some leeway in terms of accounting to stay within FFP, but I doubt that they can just totally bypass FFP in this manner.
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Completely agree. Leicester are just setting themselves up as a "selling club" with this sort of purchase. But good luck to them. As you say, I can see the benefits to Leicester for this, but this is just a glorified loan move, and absolutely calls into question as to who owns him really.
 
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