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Tottenham vs The Scum

milo said:
I'm not going to argue. It's pointless. Racists target Islam and Muslims for abuse because they think they can get away with pretending that they are being critical of a religion rather than being racist when the only reason they are singling it out is because of the race of many people who have that faith. If you feel comfortable with that, you are giving cover to racists.
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Good post.
 
milo said:
I'm not going to argue. It's pointless. Racists target Islam and Muslims for abuse because they think they can get away with pretending that they are being critical of a religion rather than being racist when the only reason they are singling it out is because of the race of many people who have that faith. If you feel comfortable with that, you are giving cover to racists.
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And we go full circle to the explicit reason I mentioned it in the first place in an earlier post.
 
milo said:
I'm not going to argue. It's pointless. Racists target Islam and Muslims for abuse because they think they can get away with pretending that they are being critical of a religion rather than being racist when the only reason they are singling it out is because of the race of many people who have that faith. If you feel comfortable with that, you are giving cover to racists.
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Muslims are not a race of people. When someone preaches hate towards Jewish people it is called anti-semitism, not racism. I have worked with white British Muslims as well as Muslims from Jordan, India and various other countries. My partner is Chinese. She’s not religious but if she was, I could convert to her religion but I can’t ever convert to her race.

I think we need to distinguish between racist people who have it in for anyone not of their race who indulges their prejudices towards other races of people or people who practise a certain faith because they associate those people with a particular religion and being critical of certain ideologies and ideas that have roots in religious text. We’re capable of having two ideas in our head at the same time. I’m critical of Christians in America who are against abortion but it has nothing to do with race.
 
Jurgen the German said:
Muslims are not a race of people. When someone preaches hate towards Jewish people it is called anti-semitism, not racism. I have worked with white British Muslims as well as Muslims from Jordan, India and various other countries. My partner is Chinese. She’s not religious but if she was, I could convert to her religion but I can’t ever convert to her race.

I think we need to distinguish between racist people who have it in for anyone not of their race who indulges their prejudices towards other races of people or people who practise a certain faith because they associate those people with a particular religion and being critical of certain ideologies and ideas that have roots in religious text. We’re capable of having two ideas in our head at the same time. I’m critical of Christians in America who are against abortion but it has nothing to do with race.
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Directing hate against Islam is used as cover by some racists who know that they get called out for saying the same things about race. Islam is not a race is frequently a tell for this.
 
milo said:
Directing hate against Islam is used as cover by some racists who know that they get called out for saying the same things about race. Islam is not a race is frequently a tell for this.
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Milo just to be clear, so you’re saying anyone who is critical of any aspect of Islam just as they may also be critical of Catholicism or Christianity is racist? Because that is how it is coming across. Of course there is real bigotry directed towards people of Islamic faith because of the colour of their skin but that is very different to being critical of religious doctrine. I don’t think it’s right or helpful to lump everyone into the same category.
 
Jurgen the German said:
Milo just to be clear, so you’re saying anyone who is critical of any aspect of Islam just as they may also be critical of Catholicism or Christianity is racist? Because that is how it is coming across. Of course there is real bigotry directed towards people of Islamic faith because of the colour of their skin but that is very different to being critical of religious doctrine. I don’t think it’s right or helpful to lump everyone into the same category.
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I'm clearly not saying that but I am saying that a lot of people use criticism of religion to disguise racism.

Here's an idea. Why don't you and I stay quiet and listen and learn from our Muslim brothers and sisters on this board? I am sure that there are people on here who would be willing to tell us about their experience if we are willing to listen and try to understand.
 
I've mentioned this before possibly. But I went Legoland with my family a few years ago. I have brown skin and a short beard. As we were walking towards a ride after lunch a white man decided to start loudly saying "terrorist, bomber" to me. Being with my wife and kids it would have been insanity for me to confront him as I would have ended up in a prison cell. We walked away and left early with my wife and oldest son shaken. I was just angry.

Its happened to us many times. It's vile. These people see me as someone else even though I was born here. My kids are 3rd generation but this brick reminds them they are different.

Its racism. We are treated as a monolith. All exactly the same. And we are all individuals with our own values and ideals. Many of us are culturally Muslim if anything and we see it as an identity much like ethnicity.

This may seem like semantics to some but removing racism from our suffering is a step towards silencing objection to said racism.

I hope this make sense.
 
LutonSpurs said:
I've mentioned this before possibly. But I went Legoland with my family a few years ago. I have brown skin and a short beard. As we were walking towards a ride after lunch a white man decided to start loudly saying "terrorist, bomber" to me. Being with my wife and kids it would have been insanity for me to confront him as I would have ended up in a prison cell. We walked away and left early with my wife and oldest son shaken. I was just angry.

Its happened to us many times. It's vile. These people see me as someone else even though I was born here. My kids are 3rd generation but this brick reminds them they are different.

Its racism. We are treated as a monolith. All exactly the same. And we are all individuals with our own values and ideals. Many of us are culturally Muslim if anything and we see it as an identity much like ethnicity.

This may seem like semantics to some but removing racism from our suffering is a step towards silencing objection to said racism.

I hope this make sense.
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As painful as it was to read, thank you for sharing your experiences. I can’t begin to imagine how you must have felt at Legoland.

This thread really has lived up to its name. I hope that it is a catalyst and if it educates just one person, it will be well worth all the constructive comments.
 
I am an atheist, in fact I’m very against religion of all forms, I think it stunts the human race and divides us.

im sure that it’s the culprit throughout the ages of mass murder and a reason for some of the awful things a human can do to another human being.

it’s the biggest killer since the dawn of time.

I just see people, not race,, colour, and I don’t understand why people can’t feel like me…

we all have mothers (except maybe scara :p), feelings, a functioning brain that can allow us to make choices for the better, we have the ability to create music, pieces of art, poetry. To brighten up someone’s day.

Instead we waste our time, it’s 2021 and we can’t even get over the fact that other people have different skin, culture.

people are racist of course, but generally people are just plain nasty and in many cases evil.

and whilst we endure the social media age, worrying about image and followers, sticking to our own groups in our little pond, vilifying others…

I guess I'm just not hopeful.

man made inventions I hate the most:

religion
Money

just brings out the very worst in people.

The fans applauding Saka was correct and proper in the current climate and makes me fiercely proud of our fans.

it was a very decent thing to do and the world could really do with so much more of it.
 
LutonSpurs said:
I've mentioned this before possibly. But I went Legoland with my family a few years ago. I have brown skin and a short beard. As we were walking towards a ride after lunch a white man decided to start loudly saying "terrorist, bomber" to me. Being with my wife and kids it would have been insanity for me to confront him as I would have ended up in a prison cell. We walked away and left early with my wife and oldest son shaken. I was just angry.

Its happened to us many times. It's vile. These people see me as someone else even though I was born here. My kids are 3rd generation but this brick reminds them they are different.

Its racism. We are treated as a monolith. All exactly the same. And we are all individuals with our own values and ideals. Many of us are culturally Muslim if anything and we see it as an identity much like ethnicity.

This may seem like semantics to some but removing racism from our suffering is a step towards silencing objection to said racism.

I hope this make sense.
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Random side add to this.., hopefully to make you laugh
The serious part. I should have been in one of the trains into London with one of 7/7 bombers that got in at Luton. I changed my plans that day very late (my wife didn’t even know so had a panic)
About a month later I got on an underground train to white city for work. A lad gets in with full Asian garb and a beard to match and lumps a fitness first rucksack on his lap. The carriage empties. I’m sat opposite him and he just said…. It’s one way to get a seat in London. Made me laugh and we spoke for a bit about exercise as he was heading to the gym
 
Bedfordspurs said:
I’m quite anti religion myself
I see a LOT of good in it but the divisive nature of it is what puts me off
Religions have created states, caused wars and divided countries
But those who believe I also envy. That belief i something you can’t physically see is impressive
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Theres nothing wrong with religion, itd the religious we need to worry about.
 
If you leave Islam what is the punishment as directed by the quran?

I dont think people hate Muslims rather can't believe in their practice.

You can't seem to critique mohammad vs Jesus without being labelled. It's insanity that you cannot have any opinion against Islam otherwise you are deemed racist or intolerant... what about versus that are in the quran against the kaffirs, the dhimmis those that have to either convert or pay jizya for protection .... i strongly oppose such values.


Ill be told its out of context but why is it there in the first place. I should be allowed to have my views and opinions without being called a racist. I simply do not subscribe to Islam's train of thought. I don't hate Muslims but have sympathy towards them.
 
Gazza said:
If you leave Islam what is the punishment as directed by the quran?

I dont think people hate Muslims rather can't believe in their practice.

You can't seem to critique mohammad vs Jesus without being labelled. It's insanity that you cannot have any opinion against Islam otherwise you are deemed racist or intolerant... what about versus that are in the quran against the kaffirs, the dhimmis those that have to either convert or pay jizya for protection .... i strongly oppose such values.


Ill be told its out of context but why is it there in the first place. I should be allowed to have my views and opinions without being called a racist. I simply do not subscribe to Islam's train of thought. I don't hate Muslims but have sympathy towards them.
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Ive never used this term in my life before but here goes…


lol
 
Gazza said:
If you leave Islam what is the punishment as directed by the quran?

I dont think people hate Muslims rather can't believe in their practice.

You can't seem to critique mohammad vs Jesus without being labelled. It's insanity that you cannot have any opinion against Islam otherwise you are deemed racist or intolerant... what about versus that are in the quran against the kaffirs, the dhimmis those that have to either convert or pay jizya for protection .... i strongly oppose such values.


Ill be told its out of context but why is it there in the first place. I should be allowed to have my views and opinions without being called a racist. I simply do not subscribe to Islam's train of thought. I don't hate Muslims but have sympathy towards them.
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Dude have you read the bible?
 
LutonSpurs said:
There isn't one. Rida in context means treason, not apostasy. In this context means treason against the state.
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In context its written in countries constitutions that you cannot leave Islam of face the death penalty. Stoning women for adultery, chopping the hands of thieves etc ... none of it sits well with me in the slightest.
 
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