Tottenham Hotspur v Sheffield Utd League cup semi Final first leg

[thfcsteff]

Some of it is negative. I happen to think it's realism more than negativity for the most part to be truthful. I think a lot of people just realise we've gone backwards in the last two seasons and most don't enjoy the football.

When you lose Luka Modric and Gareth Bale, and when your previous side was built around such players (not to mention Ledders) then yes, there is rebuilding to be done. I think the 'realism' should come when people get ****ed off that we didn't hammer a side playing in a cup semi-final...

 

[the dza]

Also, I honestly think we need to play more direct sometimes -- look where the goal came from tonight. I'm not saying hoof it all game, but if a team sits really deep then they invite some balls into the box. We have a good target to hit (Kane) and if teams come under pressure from direct passes, then they may step out and leave spaces elsewhere. Same goes for getting down the outside and crossing, something Chadli and Rose are both pretty good at to be fair. Variety in our attack makes a difference.

 

[Jurgen the German]

Why the center back panicked I don't know. There was no need to as Soldado would never have got to the ball. It was a good pass by Vertonghen and a good run by Soldado, though. But you would expect us to threaten their goal a few times during the game.

Honestly, are you happy with the way we have performed in the majority of our games this season? Have you watched us play and thought: "we are really onto something here"? Do you see any improvement in our performances compared to last season, bar perhaps in games against the top teams?

Our results haven't been awful, but we've been lucky in a lot of games. We have put in mediocre/poor performances and been rewarded with more than we deserved.

West Brom at home
Saudi Sportswashing Machine at home
Palace at home
Villa away
Hull away
Leicester away
Palace away

All games where we have been very poor indeed. We hardly ever look like we are a better team than our opponents, no matter who we play.

I think we played well against a very poor QPR side.
We were good away to Sunderland.
We were good in end-to-end matches against Everton and Chelsea.
We weren't spectacular against Southampton, but they are a good team, so that was a good result.
Arsenal away was a professional and solid performance.
Swansea away was a great result, but I am not sure we can say we deserved it.

The trend seems to be that we are poor in games where you'd expect us to have a bit more quality than our opponents, and that comes down to what I said in my original past. We seem to lack a collective plan in our attacking play.

Very much agree, especially the bolded part.

 

[Mumorn]

When you lose Luka Modric and Gareth Bale, and when your previous side was built around such players (not to mention Ledders) then yes, there is rebuilding to be done. I think the 'realism' should come when people get ****ed off that we didn't hammer a side playing in a cup semi-final...

Amen brother.

People STILL have their high expectation hat on from when we had THAT team. If people opened their eyes and saw the over achievement we are pulling off this season compared to our squad, theyd be happy.

 

[Jurgen the German]

When you lose Luka Modric and Gareth Bale, and when your previous side was built around such players (not to mention Ledders) then yes, there is rebuilding to be done. I think the 'realism' should come when people get ****ed off that we didn't hammer a side playing in a cup semi-final...

Expecting to hammer a team in a semi final is perhaps asking for too much, but just a more convincing win would be nice, you know where we create a meaningful chance and look threatening. Nothing wrong in dominating the game but not being able to break a team down, there's not much you can say if that happens, but tonight was just a typical powerpuff Spurs performance this season.

As I and a few others have said, we rarely look better than the teams we play against, even teams fighting relegation. Teams like Palace, Leicester, Stoke, WBA, Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Hull have had us on the ropes and looked better than us.

 

[thfcsteff]

Why the center back panicked I don't know. There was no need to as Soldado would never have got to the ball. It was a good pass by Vertonghen and a good run by Soldado, though. But you would expect us to threaten their goal a few times during the game.

Honestly, are you happy with the way we have performed in the majority of our games this season? Have you watched us play and thought: "we are really onto something here"? Do you see any improvement in our performances compared to last season, bar perhaps in games against the top teams?

Our results haven't been awful, but we've been lucky in a lot of games. We have put in mediocre/poor performances and been rewarded with more than we deserved.

West Brom at home
Saudi Sportswashing Machine at home
Palace at home
Villa away
Hull away
Leicester away
Palace away

All games where we have been very poor indeed. We hardly ever look like we are a better team than our opponents, no matter who we play.

I think we played well against a very poor QPR side.
We were good away to Sunderland.
We were good in end-to-end matches against Everton and Chelsea.
We weren't spectacular against Southampton, but they are a good team, so that was a good result.
Arsenal away was a professional and solid performance.
Swansea away was a great result, but I am not sure we can say we deserved it.

The trend seems to be that we are poor in games where you'd expect us to have a bit more quality than our opponents, and that comes down to what I said in my original past. We seem to lack a collective plan in our attacking play.

The manager is 'working' with Ade and trying to squeeze something out of Soldado, a player who is great but sadly won't ever be for us (he will go elsewhere and find his mojo again).
He has been given a remit to work with Lamela (not his signing) and he has not been given any of the players he asked for in the summer (example, he wanted Schneiderlein and got Stambouli)...
He needs more quality upfront.
Kane cannot do it alone, and frankly, I think our current position is a miracle/testimony to smart management and improved focus, attention and attitude.

By the way (and I have stated this opinion before but here it is again) half of the games you list above as being poor involved the whole Kabou/Capoue/Ade axis and all the various issues there were to deal with around that. Seniors used to rule the roost. That is no longer the case. That is a very, very hard thing to do in football in such short amount of time whilst keeping the dressing room onside.

If you wanted to win the league with flowing football in his first season, then I understand your disappointment.
I want a manager with a plan and a long-term vision for our club.
I believe we have one.

 

[thfcsteff]

Reading that, I thought I was in the Ade thread for a moment there...

I support his efforts whenever he wears out shirt.

 

[thfcsteff]

Jurgen/Norway...I have offered a 9 point breakdown plus a further chunk of counter-opinion topped off with the icing that yes, correct, this side no longer has Gareth Bale, Luka Modric, Ledley King or Rafa VdV...

If people want to take the dark route, go ahead.
But when I read people moaning because we were basically never better than the side we are playing, well, that's a bridge too far for me.

We all have our expectations I suppose, but at a certain point, those expectations become a matter of context too I think.

COYS

 

[sc25]

Here you are then.

1) The manager came in asking for specific players. He got none of them.
2) The manager has had to deal with a long-standing issue of dressing room hierarchy and a 'relaxed' mentality, neither of which are what he is about. That has taken the better part of 6 months to correct.
3) He would happily move on at least 7 of the current first-team squad, but due to previous 'high-wages' we are finding it hard to get people to buy these players. it isn't just the fee you ask, it's the wages they are on. This bottles up the squad in terms of what he really wants versus who he has.
4) He is determined to build a young side. It is why you have seen Mason and Bentaleb as the central midfield, and it is why Kane has been chosen above all upfront. It is why you saw Onuha make his debut last week and why a couple more will be seen in the first team squad before the season is done.
5) He has several players out right now for a variety of reasons.
6) Given that he is trying to work on systems and trying to put into place a lot of preparation, three games a week for X amount of weeks/months does not give him or the squad an ideal amount of time to work on things.
7) If you cannot see that he has absolutely tightened us up at the back, improved our focus over 95 minutes and instilled a late winning mentality in our play, then I would suggest you are extremely biased. It is undeniable.
8) Where he, and we, are suffering right now, is with lack of pace. We need more of it. He knows it and wants it.
9) Pochettino joined us in June. 8 months ago. As of now, despite having to go through all the work described above, we are still in three cup competitions and within touching distance of the top 4 (I don't think we will get it BTW).
I think when you balance the facts and put things into context (who, exactly, has he bought for any REAL money that he actually wanted?) it is hard to criticize him.

I would mostly concurr. However, I would add that some of those handicaps (and in some cases most of them) have applied to some of our previous managers...and it didn't stop them being criticized. Good post, though.

 

[chicken_badge]

Why would you drop Worm who has conceded one goal in this cup?

Poch won't do that anyway, if we get to the final maybe but even then I'd be surprised....


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

Lloris is the better keeper. By a million miles. That's why.

 

[glasgowspur]

Also, I honestly think we need to play more direct sometimes -- look where the goal came from tonight. I'm not saying hoof it all game, but if a team sits really deep then they invite some balls into the box. We have a good target to hit (Kane) and if teams come under pressure from direct passes, then they may step out and leave spaces elsewhere. Same goes for getting down the outside and crossing, something Chadli and Rose are both pretty good at to be fair. Variety in our attack makes a difference.

Agreed, we create next to nothing in the box. Not sure why there are calls for quick wingers to get behind, if you get behind most of the teams we struggle against your out of play or crossing into a box with six defenders and at most two attackers. Quick passes into the box from angles.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

 

[Jurgen the German]

Jurgen/Norway...I have offered a 9 point breakdown plus a further chunk of counter-opinion topped off with the icing that yes, correct, this side no longer has Gareth Bale, Luka Modric, Ledley King or Rafa VdV...

If people want to take the dark route, go ahead.
But when I read people moaning because we were basically never better than the side we are playing, well, that's a bridge too far for me.

We all have our expectations I suppose, but at a certain point, those expectations become a matter of context too I think.

COYS

I don't see it as 'dark'.

I also don't see how it's a bridge too far to say we never look like the better team. I fully accept we have lost players, but we still have enough quality relatively speaking to be at least looking better than we are at the moment.

My biggest worries are that we don't create chances, we rely on Kane or Eriksen to score with a speculative strike from outside the box, defensively we take too many risks as look too vulnerable and there doesn't seem to be a plan of how to attack, especially against the lower teams.

Again, I accept Poch needs A LOT of new players, but I still think we should be seeing better than what is on display at the moment.

EDIT: Just seen your post. Agreed on winning mentality and ability to win late.

Don't agree about him making us more solid, we still look shaky at the back.

We've not been that hurt by injuries compared to Liverpool or Arsenal for example.

Oh, and every Spurs manager in the last 10 years has had to deal with not getting their first choices in transfer windows to be fair.

 

[markysimmo]

Just got home, too many of our players were off form tonight, too many hollywood balls, too slow in our build up play

Still we scraped a one goal advantage which is better than 0-0, if we concede early next week it will be tough

 

[diego_maradona]

The thing is Pochettino sees the same issues as the rest of us which is encouraging. He can try and work with them still but these players need to sort out their touch. It is so poor sometimes hence the multiple touches

“We played a very slow tempo,” Pochettino said. “When every player in front of you takes three or four touches and doesn’t pass the ball this makes it difficult to make chances.”

 

[Jurgen the German]

Agreed, we create next to nothing in the box. Not sure why there are calls for quick wingers to get behind, if you get behind most of the teams we struggle against your out of play or crossing into a box with six defenders and at most two attackers. Quick passes into the box from angles.


Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk

Agree with you and dza. Nothing wrong with a bit of variety in our attacking play.

 

[diego_maradona]

Just got home, too many of our players were off form tonight, too many hollywood balls, too slow in our build up play

Still we scraped a one goal advantage which is better than 0-0, if we concede early next week it will be tough

I think we will. It will go to extra time, we'll go 2 down and Eriksen will score in the 119th minute and we'll get to the final

 

[Jurgen the German]

The thing is Pochettino sees the same issues as the rest of us which is encouraging. He can try and work with them still but these players need to sort out their touch. It is so poor sometimes hence the multiple touches

“We played a very slow tempo,” Pochettino said. “When every player in front of you takes three or four touches and doesn’t pass the ball this makes it difficult to make chances.”

Encouraging that he sees it at least.

Besides some selection mistakes earlier in the season, persisting with Ade, subbing Eriksen, he's got the team selections right for the most part.

I don't know what's more concerning, our attacking play or defence.

 

[metalgear]

amazing to see how sheffield utd matched us for fitness and in the pressing style. i'd say their defence was more hardworking throwing more bodies in front of goal than ours, and their attacks were speedier and had more aggression.

i wonder if we're sacrificing too much chasing a physical pressing game with little finesses or sweeping movement. i hate to say it but we are starting to resemble a championship team ... lots of running but little creativity an hard to get inspired.

maybe we need better players....maybe we need to see more variations in our playbook for skills and vision to step back into the game in a big way.

 

[Baleforce]

1-0 is always a good result, the perfect score, celebrate the clean sheet

 

[Spur of the moment]

Amen brother.

Amen brother for the post count!

:ross: