The double DM pivot - is it working for us?

[Pirate55]

in terms of those two points...without wanting to get in to a terminology debate we have Capoue as the defense minded CM and Mason as the attack minded CM - their roles seem clearly defined and i certainly don't see them playing as a pivot with them both alternating between defensive duties and attacking duties (in tandem with the other), which is my understanding of that term.

pressing? no we don't press or look to press in the way you would expect a team described in that way to do - certainly not in any consistent manner.

But we have played with a variety of DMs. It makes no sense to me. We don't have a designated DM in the way you describe, if we do, Capoue is absolute sh1t at playing that role. He offers zero protection and doesn't track runners. We are a complete mess in the middle and back lines.

I do agree that we don't press but I can't for the life of me think why not. It just gives the opposition so much time on the ball to pick the right pass. This allows the diagonal ball over the top to exacerbate our weak and slow centre backs.

 

[milo]

But we have played with a variety of DMs. It makes no sense to me. We don't have a designated DM in the way you describe, if we do, Capoue is absolute sh1t at playing that role. He offers zero protection and doesn't track runners. We are a complete mess in the middle and back lines.

I do agree that we don't press but I can't for the life of me think why not. It just gives the opposition so much time on the ball to pick the right pass. This allows the diagonal ball over the top to exacerbate our weak and slow centre backs.

I think that you are exaggerating a little for effect there. Capoue has undoubtedly been off form in recent games but he was playing well earlier in the season. Mason has done well since he has broken into the first team but it is unrealistic to expect him to do it all at this stage in his career.

We're a team in transition mainly composed of players singed for the previous manager. Most people thought in pre-season that it would take a while for us to settle down. I know that people are impatient to see signs of progress but I think that impatience is ultimately counter-productive because it results in us putting extra pressure on ourselves.

 

[Pirate55]

I think that you are exaggerating a little for effect there. Capoue has undoubtedly been off form in recent games but he was playing well earlier in the season. Mason has done well since he has broken into the first team but it is unrealistic to expect him to do it all at this stage in his career.

We're a team in transition mainly composed of players singed for the previous manager. Most people thought in pre-season that it would take a while for us to settle down. I know that people are impatient to see signs of progress but I think that impatience is ultimately counter-productive because it results in us putting extra pressure on ourselves.

I hold my hands up to impatience and you make some good points. However, I would like to see some progress that we are moving in the right direction and at the moment I just don't see it.

 

[Kingdawson]

I think it's a myth that Capoue was playing well earlier this season (well except maybe against QPR who provided zero attacking threat). He played v.well against Gooner scum and well vs Southampton but other then that? his positioning has been turbo ****. I said earlier this season that i thought our good results was masking how bad he's been positionally (when he was getting praise galore).

 

[metalgear]

Similarly our defenders will never be confident unless they can trust what's happening in front of them.

Defending very much starts from the front and currently it's lacking for us imo. We could perhaps go to a more defensive midfield duo to counter some of that, but not without losing a lot of attacking power imo.

I'm sure you know that defending from the front implies that you've got a sound defence to begin with. If not we might as well stick Ade and Kaboul at the back and have Kane take his place up front.

We can have Toure and Fabregas as the double pivot, and we will still leak goals with our two CBs behind them.

On the other hand imagine its not difficult to see that Capoue and Mason would do miles better with folks like Kompany and Cahill in defence.

Poch is clearly struggling with goals, and in the absence of quality in attack he is taking up numbers from our defence which is of poorer quality. Bad call by poch IMO, a gamble that will never pay off with Kaboul as the key defensive guy, Verts whose head he's not managed to turn, and Fazio who has had a nightmare of a start in both league and cup.

 

[spasm]

every ****er on this board confused by the system & tactics and having their own interpretation, what needs to be done, what is going wrong etc, not surprised at how the players are coping..not the brightest lot..

 

[milo]

I think it's a myth that Capoue was playing well earlier this season (well except maybe against QPR who provided zero attacking threat). He played v.well against Gooner scum and well vs Southampton but other then that? his positioning has been turbo ****. I said earlier this season that i thought our good results was masking how bad he's been positionally (when he was getting praise galore).

So other than the games where he was good, he hasn't been very good. At last something that we can all agree on.