I suspect most football fans and pundits would suggest that the two are on a par - with Messi maybe shaving it.
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Suarez - Serial Biter
- Thread starter Mulletperm
- Start date
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
That's why Messi is in the World Cup semi final and Ronaldo is on his holidays because he couldn't get past USA
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
If Argentina win the World Cup then the debate should be ended IMO
I think that would be more than a little ridiculous.
Players can't choose their country. What on earth makes you think the quality of their national team has any relevance to their standings as a top player?
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Surely you accept Portugal should have at least qualified from the group with the team they have. Argentina have been rubbish for the most part but Messi has still carried them to the semis whereas Ronaldo is probably on some beach getting sun tan lotion rubbed into his neck by Gareth bale. It's hardly like Argentina are a world class side and Portugal are **** is it?
I think Argentina without Messi are still a potent attacking force.
Portugal without Ronaldo are an under-performing Moutinho.
Gazza Dazzla
Chris Perry
Weren't you saying that you can't penalize Suarez because he plays in a worse team than bale? Ronaldo quite clearly plays in a worse team than messi at international level so isn't it exactly the same thing? Or are you doing the reverse thing here to try and prove your Suarez point?
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Come on, there's a massive difference between Real Madrid and Liverpool compared to Argentina and Portugal. Argentina have been awful apart from Messi, it's been a million times but he's more of a team player as Ronaldo is just about himself hence that absurd celebration when he scored that penalty which he dived for in the CL final to make it 4-1, did he actually celebrate the other goals? Lol
Portugal are really **** though and it becomes very clear when Ronaldo is only playing for himself. Argentina are in the top 10 and Messi's occasional magic might take them all the way.
jts1882
Dean Richards
I agree with both of you.
It is ridiculous that ultimate success in a competition that some individuals don't have a real chance of winning is considered a major criteria for determining the best individual. The reality, however, is that it does. The problem is how can you not consider Pele's three world cups and Maradona's success a part of the equation.
Many people already consider Messi the best ever or put him on par with the best. A world cup win can only add to that. For many people the debate will be ended, although not for me.
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
I think it's been more than the occasional magic, yesterday was the first time one of their strikers had managed to score in the tournament. At the very least Portugal should have reached the last 16 ahead of USA, even if they are well drilled and well coached.
I don't believe there is. i cant be bothered to work it out, but it would not surprise me if the gap in wages between RM to liverpool (starting 11's), is similar to argentina - portugal.
And also re ronaldo thinking its "all about himself", i go along with rio ferdinand's line of thinking. rio ferdinand thinks that messi is just as self-serving in that he demands that the play goes through him all the time. which imo, is just as arrogant. if you look at his performances this season, barcelona's football has been less about him, and he has appeared to be having a strop half the time. both these players have massive ego's (and rightly so). they just manifest themselves in different ways. ronaldo is no more self serving than messi is.
Messi creates for others, Ronaldo prefers to create for himself. That's the main difference between them for me. Messi has the highest number of chances created at the World Cup, 19, but that probably pales in comparison to the number of sulks Ronaldo had when someone didn't pass him the ball.
messi sulks when players dont pass to him too.
also when ronaldo does his flapping arms routine when someone doesnt pass to him, i dont actually think its intended to be disrespectful. he does the same thing when he misses a chance too. its just his reaction to when something doesnt go well
also when ronaldo does his flapping arms routine when someone doesnt pass to him, i dont actually think its intended to be disrespectful. he does the same thing when he misses a chance too. its just his reaction to when something doesnt go well
I
indianspur
Guest
Both Ronnie and Messi are fantastic and its just a pleasure to witness both in our lifetime. 50 years on from now people won't fight over who was better, they will just marvel at what both produced on the pitch
Baleforce
Arthur Rowe
good point, don't remember anyone banging on like this when I was a kid
Gazza Dazzla
Chris Perry
I guess I don't rate Portugal anywhere near as highly as you do. Argentina minus messi still have aguero, higuain, di Maria, mascherano, Garay and zabaletta, that's excellent and a million times better than Portugal. The more I think of it the more I think Liverpool last year were closer to Madrid than Portugal to Argentina.
Gazza Dazzla
Chris Perry
Because it's difficult for some to appreciate two players at the same time, they have to be overly critical of the one they don't like for some reason. Both messi and Ronaldo are amazing, I think messi is slightly better but Ronaldo completely deserved his player of the year award last year.
Baleforce
Arthur Rowe
yeah, I think it's a modern thing to insist on an answer though
it doesn't really matter though, look at Ibra with Sweden, Ronaldo with Portugal, probably Bale (and definitely Giggs) with Wales, it doesn't matter how good you are, without a decent side around you you still won't win anything
it doesn't really matter though, look at Ibra with Sweden, Ronaldo with Portugal, probably Bale (and definitely Giggs) with Wales, it doesn't matter how good you are, without a decent side around you you still won't win anything
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
Well I think Liverpool had an unbelievable season and got the absolute most out of their abilities individually and collectively and also took advantage of only playing in one competition for the most part. Argentina are better than Portugal but I still think Portugal massively underperformed, a team with players like Ronaldo, Moutinho, Nani, Pepe and Coentrao shoulnd't be finished 3rd behind USA. If you were to ask me if Liverpool could finish 2nd again I would say no, 4th at best I think.
One thing that can't be disputed is Messi is having a much better World Cup than Ronaldo would everyone agree with that? I think Messi should get pretty much all of the credit if they continue playing like they are as a team and still go on to win it. As good as Argentina can be, most of them except Messi have been extremely poor see Di Maria with his 37 times he gave the ball away in the last 16, that's a ridiculous stat.
Anyway, both phenomal players but if Messi adds this to his CV coupled with his club form I for one will consider him the GOAT