Rodrigo Bentancur

[Bedfordspurs]

I would accept but I don't think I keep myself from pointing out the fudging hypocrisy of the Chelsea players singing racist songs.

Two wrongs don't make a right I know.

They did
And in theory they will get punished
It’s possible some of our players were there too don’t forget

 

[thfcsteff]

I don't think we should do anything other than graciously accept whatever punishment is given for one of our players behaving in a racist manner.

That is doubtless the course of action to take in the circumstances, but again, what a missed opportunity if actually educating people is the aim here versus being seen to 'tick a box and do the right thing'.

 

[Gutter Boy]

That is doubtless the course of action to take in the circumstances, but again, what a missed opportunity if actually educating people is the aim here versus being seen to 'tick a box and do the right thing'.

We did this with Aurier didn't we? Didn't he do some work with Proud Lilywhites after his homophobic slur?

 

[thfcsteff]

We did this with Aurier didn't we? Didn't he do some work with Proud Lilywhites after his homophobic slur?

I don't remember, but you raise a very interesting point. I'll do some looking back through the years.

EDIT: I went back and what I found was how excellent Proud Lillywhites were in taking the educational approach rather than the punitive one. It ended well for all. A great lesson all round, and well called gboy.

https://proudlilywhites.wordpress.com/2017/08/31/serge-aurier/

https://www.football365.com/news/proud-of-spurs-proud-of-gayness-proud-of-progress

 

[Muttley]

I despise racial abuse.
I despise racists.
I never miss an opportunity to speak out against them in person, and have never shied away from a racist, or someone making a racist remark.

I wish we could differentiate between RACISTS and idiotic mistakes. This was a stupid mistake, misplaced and something Bentancur (IMO anyway) showed both understanding of having done and contrition for.

I understand that there is an important need to underscore the fight against racism, especially now as the world is seemingly slowly descending into fascism. But (IMO) this punishment will NOT offer itself as a deterrent in the sense it needs to. Instead, in the polarised atmosphere we live in, this will garner a similar reaction.

This is (again IMO) a body wishing to be seen to do the right thing optically, rather than actually trying to come up with something which will help.
Want to use Rodrigo Bentancur as an example? How about a 1 or 2 game ban, education program, and either a series of community service visits to discuss how even the most 'casual' of comments can cause distress in society OR how about placing him with a trusted journalist/reporter to do a 30 minute interview for/with Kick It Out, discussing the entire situation -how it happened, why he said it, the self-anger he doubtless felt when he said it, and what he learned- as a youtube/social media piece which can be used as proper education?

I used to say this when they caught scum hissing at us. Rather than just banning them and fudging them off into dark corners, arrange for them to visit Auschwitz. Arrange for them to sit and talk with survivors. Film it and make a program out of it. THAT'S powerful (of course it relies on them being idiots and not dyed-in-the-wool nazis).

What you write is exactly how I feel. One other perspective......

They reckon the average person has up to 60,000 thoughts per day. Because of our human history, even people who don't associate with being racists can and do have racist thoughts. They simply process them and throw them into the human trash can. If they don't and they end up turning into speech then that becomes a problem. It's only then that they are deemed a racist. In the pressure of a live TV interview, Rodrigo let that racist thought become speech and he should be punished.

These horrible thoughts will hopefully disappear as we move generationally. You'd like to think that a new born today would never need to have their head cluttered with racist thoughts in the future because they are exposed to societal racism. They will have anti racism thoughts when they do inevitably get exposed to the stupid minority.

I won't defend Rodrigo, but as you say the punishment should fit the crime better than what has been handed out. I will now be expecting a 50 match ban for Enzo Fernandez from the FA. I won't accept that it is not their jurisdiction after what has happened to our player.

 

[Muttley]

We did this with Aurier didn't we? Didn't he do some work with Proud Lilywhites after his homophobic slur?

Serge always had negative stuff going on around him, but only some of it was his own doing.

He was taken into custody for a disturbance in Herts in 2019. His girlfriend was also almost jailed for sextortion after a sex tape scandal. As you say, before that there was the homophobic slur at Blanc. Finally, his brother ended up being shot dead by gangsters in 2023.

 

[thfcsteff]

Serge always had negative stuff going on around him, but only some of it was his own doing.

He was taken into custody for a disturbance in Herts in 2019. His girlfriend was also almost jailed for sextortion after a sex tape scandal. As you say, before that there was the homophobic slur at Blanc. Finally, his brother ended up being shot dead by gangsters in 2023.

He lived in the eyes of storms for sure.

 

[braineclipse]

I despise racial abuse.
I despise racists.
I never miss an opportunity to speak out against them in person, and have never shied away from a racist, or someone making a racist remark.

I wish we could differentiate between RACISTS and idiotic mistakes. This was a stupid mistake, misplaced and something Bentancur (IMO anyway) showed both understanding of having done and contrition for.

I understand that there is an important need to underscore the fight against racism, especially now as the world is seemingly slowly descending into fascism. But (IMO) this punishment will NOT offer itself as a deterrent in the sense it needs to. Instead, in the polarised atmosphere we live in, this will garner a similar reaction.

This is (again IMO) a body wishing to be seen to do the right thing optically, rather than actually trying to come up with something which will help.
Want to use Rodrigo Bentancur as an example? How about a 1 or 2 game ban, education program, and either a series of community service visits to discuss how even the most 'casual' of comments can cause distress in society OR how about placing him with a trusted journalist/reporter to do a 30 minute interview for/with Kick It Out, discussing the entire situation -how it happened, why he said it, the self-anger he doubtless felt when he said it, and what he learned- as a youtube/social media piece which can be used as proper education?

I used to say this when they caught scum hissing at us. Rather than just banning them and fudging them off into dark corners, arrange for them to visit Auschwitz. Arrange for them to sit and talk with survivors. Film it and make a program out of it. THAT'S powerful (of course it relies on them being idiots and not dyed-in-the-wool nazis).

I too wish we could differentiate. We can't because the "it's just a joke" or "it was just a clumsy/cultural thing" defense is so often used to mask real racism and biggotry. I don't think we can trust football associations to make those distinctions.

I really like your alternative suggestions, I wish something like that was possible and done. I think it would be risky, for the club, for football associations. The punitive route is imo "safer" and that's what they'll do. Because actual public conversations, honesty and vulnerability about these things in public, in large scale is really difficult to get right.

 

[braineclipse]

Cheers gents.

The obvious comparison is the Saurez incident and you'd hope Bentancur would receive a lesser ban. One was a slur said in a malicious / spiteful manner whereas Bentancur's was a joke, albeit a very stupid one but seems to be from a place of ignorance rather than looking to cause hurt. There should be some allowance for that imo, it's easy to slip up but our Uruguayan should absolutely have known better. Not to doubt sauces / whatever posters may have heard but best wait until it's confirmed, we'll see how the club responds having done it's best to PR the fudge out of the situation.

Maybe if the ban is that long it could give Bissouma a platform to really show us the player we see flashes of here and there. Or Gray but it probably earlier than we'd want but maybe it's fair to have expectations for a 40m player to have an impact.

Fully agreed on that. Particularly the final paragraph. Time for Bissouma to step up and hopefully also Gray to make an impact there.