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Our fans

thfcsteff said:
It's actually a great comparison.
Having a 20 year old and a 7 year old, trust me, I've let loose a few times, but generally-speaking, no. I always look for other approaches. And in fairness, when i see that, say, my daughter is tired, or hungry and being a pain in the arse, I try to put to her WHY she might be acting up, and if I don't go that route, I try to see that she's doing her best but the circumstances are simply not there for her to keep it in the pocket.

Again, I would not want to be a liar, there are CERTAINLY times when I simply lay down the law, but screaming at them is very much a last resort. Even then, I sometimes feel I have been wrong to scream and find myself apologising to them for unreasonable behaviour! Funnily enough, the time most recently I remember screaming OH FOR fudge'S SAKE YOU clown shoe! at a match, was Villa away. At Harry. I immediately felt like a taco, and followed that up with a loud COYS and "Harry Redknapp's B&W Army" because frankly, it wasn't ever going to be helpful slagging him, I'm sure he wanted the win too! So I've certainly been there mate, but have to say, I don't like myself at those moments and immediately try to negate it!

I think the crux of it is that we all get frustrated and we all show it differently, i just wish that sometimes, we showed it in a more positive way. Imagine putting all that frustration into some singing? fudge me it'd be loud!!!!!!
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I've said it before and I'll say it again, even my kids don't get unconditional support and I think a lot more of them than THFC, which is why I reserve the right to voice disapproval (even though I don't actually boo). In fact I'll be writing to the club tonight to voice it.

92 minutes in when Gareth Bale was tinkling about in the North East corner with the ball would, if he'd looked up, seen on a hoarding right opposite him the Danny Blanchflower quote "the game is about glory", well glory does not extend to running the clock down with the ball in the corner quadrant instead of attempting to score, we gave away possession anyway. Never mind booing, I'd have rung his fakking neck if I could have got hold of him. Glory my arse.

So while we're talking about the fans responsibility to the team let's not forget the teams responsibility to the fans.
 
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Gordinho said:
I've said it before and I'll say it again, even my kids don't get unconditional support and I think a lot more of them than THFC, which is why I reserve the right to voice disapproval (even though I don't actually boo). In fact I'll be writing to the club tonight to voice it.

92 minutes in when Gareth Bale was tinkling about in the North East corner with the ball would, if he'd looked up, seen on a hoarding right opposite him the Danny Blanchflower quote "the game is about glory", well glory does not extend to running the clock down with the ball in the corner quadrant instead of attempting to score, we gave away possession anyway. Never mind booing, I'd have rung his fakking neck if I could have got hold of him. Glory my arse.

So while we're talking about the fans responsibility to the team let's not forget the teams responsibility to the fans.
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There's no glory in conceding a last minute equaliser. I'd rather a little bit of time wasting. Definitely not a big deal in my book either way.
 
japenesegardenlover said:
worse thing you can do is scream at a kid there like dogs. If you scream at them they pick up on that behaviour and it makes things worse.

That said if i had been in the ground today i would not have booed as i tend to not make any noise anymore at games but i would have been disgusted by what i saw first half. I lay the blame for that at avb's door but he turned it round so hats off to him he is learning.

My biggest problem with our club is levy and i do not think i will feel secure aas long as that taco is in control. He needs to move over to protect his investment in the club because he is the biggest thing stopping us going the next level.
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Not sure how you can afford the luxury of wanting Levy out. I know where you're coming from, his decisions are infuriating at times, even so most would accept the club has made steady progress since Enic took over more than a decade ago. From about the mid-noughties we've been capable of challenging for a CL spot annually and now we have the realistic ambition of maybe winning the League sometime in the foreseeable. On top of that we have stout plans for a new stadium commensurate with our status.

So let's be careful what we wish for. New owners can take a club down as well as up.
 
spitshine said:
Its still about social class as previously mentioned. The most vociferous of supporters tend to be the ones who spend a higher proportion of their disposable income on football. When Roy Keane had a go at the prawn sandwich phalanx who were silent during games, clearly they were more interested in discussing their bonus and private healthcare allowances, than sing their hearts out at football ground.
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More unsubstantiated gonads.
 
Gordinho said:
So while we're talking about the fans responsibility to the team let's not forget the teams responsibility to the fans.
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AS far as I'm aware, the team are trying their hardest. It's just not working very well at the moment. Lots of tweaking to do before it all starts running smoothly.

The fans, on the other hand, can't claim to be trying at all hard to create a decent atmosphere. As small time as the QPR fans were (I mean, seriously, more than half their songs were about how quiet we were instead of about their own team), they were right that our support in the first half was practically non existent for long periods.
 
tommysvr said:
There's no glory in conceding a last minute equaliser. I'd rather a little bit of time wasting. Definitely not a big deal in my book either way.
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That's exactly what we did when we used the same tactic against West Ham in 2005, ran the clock down then gave away possession and they equalised, we gave ourselves no time to score a winner. It still hurts to this day.

What's to say we wouldn't have scored a third? Not to even attempt to is unforgivable. More to the point, we squandered possession anyway, so had QPR got an equaliser we'd have lost possession without even putting their goal under pressure.

Failling that, if we're to use this dreadful tactic why not take the hoarding down? Not a lot of point in motivational words if we don't try to live by them.

Re the underline bit, contrast it with this "The great fallacy is that the game is first and last about winning. It is nothing of the kind. The game is about glory, it is about doing things in style and with a flourish, about going out and beating the other lot, not waiting for them to die of boredom."
 
jimmyb said:
AS far as I'm aware, the team are trying their hardest.
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Not in the particular instance I mentioned, they weren't, that's unforgivable for me. No lack of application throughout the rest of the match even if not everything was coming off.
 
Gordinho said:
Not in the particular instance I mentioned, they weren't, that's unforgivable for me. No lack of application throughout the rest of the match even if not everything was coming off.
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It's fine to say that Bale's "tinkling about" in the corner in the dying minutes fails to live up to the ideals espoused by Danny Blanchflower, but you can't reasonably say that he wasn't trying.

He was trying........to run down the clock in order to secure a victory for Spurs. Securing victory is his first priority; his chief responsibility to the club and the fans.

You might not like such time wasting (I don't either). You might feel that it is often counter productive (I do too). But I don't think that you can claim that it displays a lack of effort.
 
jimmyb said:
It's fine to say that Bale's "tinkling about" in the corner in the dying minutes fails to live up to the ideals espoused by Danny Blanchflower, but you can't reasonably say that he wasn't trying.

He was trying........to run down the clock in order to secure a victory for Spurs. Securing victory is his first priority; his chief responsibility to the club and the fans.

You might not like such time wasting (I don't either). You might feel that it is often counter productive (I do too). But I don't think that you can claim that it displays a lack of effort.
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Of course I can, he was making no effort to take advantage of a goal scoring opportunity. My philosophy is that while their keeper is busy picking the ball out of the net they're not in a position to score against you.

Re the highlighted bit, if anyone's content to win ugly let them watch Stoke.
 
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Gordinho said:
Of course I can, he was making no effort to take advantage of a goal scoring opportunity. My philosophy is that while their keeper is busy picking the ball out of the net they're not in a position to score against you.
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But what you're complaining about still isn't a lack of effort.

It's just a different philosophy. Players have to make risk assessments. Sometimes, they judge that the team's interests are less likely to be imperiled by running down the clock in the corner than by having an attempt at goal.
 
Gordinho said:
What's to say we wouldn't have scored a third? Not to even attempt to is unforgivable.
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I'm not taking side in this particular matter, but this hunger (or lack thereof) is what I think differentiates winners from also-rans. Look at Manchester United at their peak, 5-0 up, trying to get a sixth. Then look at Spurs of same era, sitting back, trying to defend a 1-0 lead for 60 minutes. Invariably failing, of course.
 
In all honesty I can't think of one premier league ground that has a consistent tremendous atmosphere from the home fans. People bang on about the likes of Saudi Sportswashing Machine and Liverpool, who can make a lot of noise at the big games, but their place is never rocking for the likes of Wigan at home.

This isn't excusing our atmosphere, which has deteriorated massively even since when I started going in the early 00s. But I'd go as far as to say no premier league home fans are anything special any more, and that is due to modern football being what it is.
 
jimmyb said:
But what you're complaining about still isn't a lack of effort.

It's just a different philosophy. Players have to make risk assessments. Sometimes, they judge that the team's interests are less likely to be imperiled by running down the clock in the corner than by having an attempt at goal.
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Jimmy, I admire your unconditional love for Spurs, I just don't subscribe to it myself. What I saw today wasn't good enough. Bale failed at what he was trying to do. Failed to please this fan, failed to maintain possession. Like I've said, don't post motivational Danny Blanchflowers comments in 2ft high letters directly under the director's box and then ignore them. Makes a mockery of Audere Est Facere, running the clock down with the ball in the north east quadrant.

So fudging right I'll boo (in reality I won't) if the players don't strive for the standards of achievement set out by the club.

Dare To Lose To Win.
 
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Gordinho said:
Jimmy, I admire your unconditional love for Spurs, I just don't subscribe to it myself. What I saw today wasn't good enough. Bale failed at what he was trying to do. Failed to please this fan, failed to maintain possession. Like I've said, don't post motivational Danny Blanchflowers comments in 2ft high letters directly under the director's box and then ignore them. Makes a mockery of Audere Est Facere, running the clock down with the ball in the north east quadrant.

So fudging right I'll boo (in reality I won't) if the players don't strive for the standards of achievement set out by the club.

Dare To Lose To Win.
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Sorry, mate, but I have to repeat yet again that what you're complaining about is something other than a lack of effort.

A lack of courage, maybe. A lack of good judgement, even.

But not a lack of effort.
 
Gordinho said:
That's exactly what we did when we used the same tactic against West Ham in 2005, ran the clock down then gave away possession and they equalised, we gave ourselves no time to score a winner. It still hurts to this day.

What's to say we wouldn't have scored a third? Not to even attempt to is unforgivable. More to the point, we squandered possession anyway, so had QPR got an equaliser we'd have lost possession without even putting their goal under pressure.

Failling that, if we're to use this dreadful tactic why not take the hoarding down? Not a lot of point in motivational words if we don't try to live by them.

Re the underline bit, contrast it with this "The great fallacy is that the game is first and last about winning. It is nothing of the kind. The game is about glory, it is about doing things in style and with a flourish, about going out and beating the other lot, not waiting for them to die of boredom."
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Good lord you're making a huge deal out of absolutely nothing.
 
DHSF said:
fudge - I thought you were a young one - a 25 yr old or so... haha.

I doubt you just throwing an insult at a player when youre a hundred yards from the pitch will affect a players performance. I would agree about the singing though but its difficult to get going when fans start to sing "stand up if you hate Arse" or "There is only one X"

Today in the second half when the players showed a little bit of fight the fans got going.... this is what I meant earlier by giving and taking. The players have to give a bit too... and show some fight
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You're too kind, 45 mate. ;) Of course, I do behave like a youthful fool sometimes, so I understand that!
As for the second bit, you're right but I feel wrong after I've done it.
 
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