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OMT Badgers vs Eagles

I just feel numb really...I ended up laughing at several things. My son and I were almost in awe of how comprehensively we shot ourselves in both feet after the goal, as I had said 'it's vital we get to HT without conceding'...

...but yes.
Numb.
It's been getting this way for some time.
The negativity, the anger, the lack of patience, the lesser camaraderie...

I will continue to hope and believe we can pull clear, but that's because I am a supporter.
We need to find qualities we don't appear to have to survive this.
As for that nonsense Igor was spouting post-match, let's just say I don't want him driving my P&O Ferry FFS!!!
 
SpurMeUp said:
This is a bit like ‘the players aren’t committed’ type of argument, when we lose. The players and fans don’t like losing, but it was due to injuries not a lack of buy in from players. Where is the uplift from the new manager if you argument is correct?
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They don't seem to be interested in playing for him either—his remarks in a recent presser seem to my ears to indicate he also thinks that application, effort and 'personality' are lacking. I did think, actually, post-Frank, that they'd be more likely to respond to an avuncular, hand-round-the-shoulder type who would massage their egos, rather than the disciplinarian Tudor comes across as (he says he can be both things, but I get the impression he models himself a bit on his mate Conte.)
 
mudshark said:
They don't seem to be interested in playing for him either—his remarks in a recent presser seem to my ears to indicate he also thinks that application, effort and 'personality' are lacking. I did think, actually, post-Frank, that they'd be more likely to respond to an avuncular, hand-round-the-shoulder type who would massage their egos, rather than the disciplinarian Tudor comes across as (he says he can be both things, but I get the impression he models himself a bit on his mate Conte.)
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Agreed , Jonathon pierce was saying on 5live before the game the players were laboured in their warm. Not even close to the intensity of palace. It showed. We were a yard or two off all over the pitch.

That’s an attitude / Ego problem. These lot think they are better than they are.
 
djp82 said:
Agreed , Jonathon pierce was saying on 5live before the game the players were laboured in their warm. Not even close to the intensity of palace. It showed. We were a yard or two off all over the pitch.

That’s an attitude / Ego problem. These lot think they are better than they are.
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I've just heard Solanke's post-match interview from last night:

"We had a chat in the dressing room afterwards and we all now realise the situation we are in."

They're not the sharpest tools this lot, are they?
 
thfcsteff said:
I just feel numb really...I ended up laughing at several things. My son and I were almost in awe of how comprehensively we shot ourselves in both feet after the goal, as I had said 'it's vital we get to HT without conceding'...

...but yes.
Numb.
It's been getting this way for some time.
The negativity, the anger, the lack of patience, the lesser camaraderie...

I will continue to hope and believe we can pull clear, but that's because I am a supporter.
We need to find qualities we don't appear to have to survive this.
As for that nonsense Igor was spouting post-match, let's just say I don't want him driving my P&O Ferry FFS!!!
Click to expand...
I could see logic in appointing Tudor and said it at the time. His win % in every job, his ability to firefight etc. So I won't be Captain Hindsight and hammer the board for appointing him. Of all the fudging stupid things they've done, that's near the bottom.

Keeping him now would be crazy though. The players are neither playing for him or look like they believe we can win. He's talking the club and the players down in public. He hasn't given us any bounce at all - we've looked worse since he's come in. I said it against Woolwich, you could literally see the players didn't know who should be pressing at times. We've gotten worse from there. There is absolutely nothing, nothing to hang your hat on with Tudor.

I'm sure he has his qualities as a manager. He has the record to prove that. But it hasn't worked here and we don't have the time or games to give it the sort of chance any normal club would be giving a manager. We'll look clueless and panicked if we do it but we are clueless and panicked. The board has to act today IMO or we are in more danger of relegation and they are in more danger of seeing billions wiped off the value of the club.

They run this club like a business. If this was happening in a business, you'd give the guy a few quid and wish him well on his way.
 
DeanoAustin said:
Keeping him now would be crazy though. The players are neither playing for him or look like they believe we can win. He's talking the club and the players down in public. He hasn't given us any bounce at all - we've looked worse since he's come in. I said it against Woolwich, you could literally see the players didn't know who should be pressing at times. We've gotten worse from there. There is absolutely nothing, nothing to hang your hat on with Tudor.
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It's more than that, I'm afraid: I think they've been instructed to swap positions in order to make it more difficult for the opposition to mark them, but they haven't taken that in at all. They move slowly and mechanically. At times, you'd think they were on the training pitch. If they're not actively trying to sabotage the club (and why would they?), it means they don't understand what they're supposed to do.

At this point, it's irrelevant whether that's on them or on the manager. They just can't play that system and they can't learn how to so late in the season and in these circumstances.

I said it before, but if I were calling the shots, I'd appoint Postecoglou back. Not because I think he's a good manager but because these players gave everything for him and that's all we have left now - the slight hope that someone could convince them to give more than they actually have.
 
mudshark said:
They don't seem to be interested in playing for him either—
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At what point do fans have a realisation that constantly changing manager isn't the solution?

mudshark said:
his remarks in a recent presser seem to my ears to indicate he also thinks that application, effort and 'personality' are lacking. I did think, actually, post-Frank, that they'd be more likely to respond to an avuncular, hand-round-the-shoulder type who would massage their egos, rather than the disciplinarian Tudor comes across as (he says he can be both things, but I get the impression he models himself a bit on his mate Conte.)
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That was the thing during Frank. For me, it was clear it wasn't a lack of application. It was a young second-string side that needed time. We had so much change - a completely new attack bar richie. Young players or players with promise but without much first team expereince like Spence. So consistency and keeping a steady side was maybe the most important.

Frank had lots of games in quick succession and players who needed some rotation so I can see why he changed the team up. But it is so hard to develop and finesse our play in these circumstances. A new manager comes in, and its snakes and ladders. First he needs to get to know the players. And figure out the first 11. We're constantly chopping and changing, and of course mistakes are going to increase when there isn't a stable side and system.
 
Mikey10 said:
I've just heard Solanke's post-match interview from last night:

"We had a chat in the dressing room afterwards and we all now realise the situation we are in."

They're not the sharpest tools this lot, are they?
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One of them closed his Insta for 2 minutes to check the league table
 
Mikey10 said:
I've just heard Solanke's post-match interview from last night:

"We had a chat in the dressing room afterwards and we all now realise the situation we are in."

They're not the sharpest tools this lot, are they?
Click to expand...
They're footballers. That is literally what I expect to hear from them
 
SpurMeUp said:
At what point do fans have a realisation that constantly changing manager isn't the solution?



That was the thing during Frank. For me, it was clear it wasn't a lack of application. It was a young second-string side that needed time. We had so much change - a completely new attack bar richie. Young players or players with promise but without much first team expereince like Spence. So consistency and keeping a steady side was maybe the most important.

Frank had lots of games in quick succession and players who needed some rotation so I can see why he changed the team up. But it is so hard to develop and finesse our play in these circumstances. A new manager comes in, and its snakes and ladders. First he needs to get to know the players. And figure out the first 11. We're constantly chopping and changing, and of course mistakes are going to increase when there isn't a stable side and system.
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It's difficult to say with real certainty without being directly involved. Just seeing things from the outside, you can only go on impressions, and my impression is that we don't have the characters to pull us out of the doom loop we're in. Maybe it was doomed from the start, though, given the injuries to key players, piled on top of the long-standing issues around our recruitment—as you say, there's a lot of inexperience there.
 
mudshark said:
It's difficult to say with real certainty without being directly involved. Just seeing things from the outside, you can only go on impressions, and my impression is that we don't have the characters to pull us out of the doom loop we're in. Maybe it was doomed from the start, though, given the injuries to key players, piled on top of the long-standing issues around our recruitment—as you say, there's a lot of inexperience there.
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I actually think we do have the characters to pull us out all things being equal. Porro, Romero, VdV, Pahlinha, Gallagher, Solanke, Gray, Maddison, Deki, Bergvall, Danso. These are all characters I'd want to help win us games. However, there are so many factors at play here that have mired us in this situation that go well beyond the squad. The dynamic around the club just seems wrong at the moment.

I can't see where the next win is coming from. I really can't. The only thing I'm looking towards is the law of averages. We really cannot be this brick for the next 9 games. That'd be 20 games on the bounce, that'd be January - May where we are absolute dogbrick and can't win. That's Derby 2007/2008 levels of brick. We are not that bad.

We just need to break the cycle. And soon. Sometimes, in these relegation battles, that little spark comes from the most unexpected place. Maybe that'll be Anfield...
 
DeanoAustin said:
I actually think we do have the characters to pull us out all things being equal. Porro, Romero, VdV, Pahlinha, Gallagher, Solanke, Gray, Maddison, Deki, Bergvall, Danso. These are all characters I'd want to help win us games. However, there are so many factors at play here that have mired us in this situation that go well beyond the squad. The dynamic around the club just seems wrong at the moment.

I can't see where the next win is coming from. I really can't. The only thing I'm looking towards is the law of averages. We really cannot be this brick for the next 9 games. That'd be 20 games on the bounce, that'd be January - May where we are absolute dogbrick and can't win. That's Derby 2007/2008 levels of brick. We are not that bad.

We just need to break the cycle. And soon. Sometimes, in these relegation battles, that little spark comes from the most unexpected place. Maybe that'll be Anfield...
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Great post. The current rhetoric is to slam these players left right and centre but in actual fact, they are top quality and you don't get to where they are as professionals without having some fight. Does this mean they are beyond criticism? Of course not and some of them more than others

None of them will want to be known as part of the team that got us relegated, even if some have already decided to move on in the summer. We have nine games left and we need to play our part in getting them over the line. Them we can start sorting out the fudging mess at this club once and for all

Edit: I'd include Tel in Deano's list too
 
treepits said:
Great post. The current rhetoric is to slam these players left right and centre but in actual fact, they are top quality and you don't get to where they are as professionals without having some fight. Does this mean they are beyond criticism? Of course not and some of them more than others

None of them will want to be known as part of the team that got us relegated, even if some have already decided to move on in the summer. We have nine games left and we need to play our part in getting them over the line. Them we can start sorting out the fudging mess at this club once and for all

Edit: I'd include Tel in Deano's list too
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Yeah....many of these won us the EL. So they can apply themselves, can succeed.

But I'd hope they haven't got above themselves with that success. And i would be disappointed if they can only succeed by leaning into a managers motivations.
They should personally be carrying a heap of experience/confidence from such outcomes.
 
treepits said:
Great post. The current rhetoric is to slam these players left right and centre but in actual fact, they are top quality and you don't get to where they are as professionals without having some fight. Does this mean they are beyond criticism? Of course not and some of them more than others

None of them will want to be known as part of the team that got us relegated, even if some have already decided to move on in the summer. We have nine games left and we need to play our part in getting them over the line. Them we can start sorting out the fudging mess at this club once and for all

Edit: I'd include Tel in Deano's list too
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Given the injuries our reliance is on Vicario, Porro, Romero and MVDV to lead this ship and between them one is regressing week by week as the keeper, Porro thinks and act like a leader without leading anything and I am sorry but between them, Romero and MVDV will have culminated a 4 games streak of missing games because of Red Cards. The proof is there, these players are not showing up. No one is making that rhetoric up, its there laid our for all to see.

The last two seasons have been littered with players making mistakes or falling asleep at crucial times, we pulled it together for the EL but for me that makes this situation all the more scandalous, they should be ashamed of themselves for this fall off.
 
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