Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

[ricky2tricky4city]

The physical attributes sure. But does he have the technical attributes to do that? I've always thought Demele is a fairly average passer, but in terms of close control and skill on the ball he's a very talented player. He combines that physique with technique in a way that very few players do. And in a way that very few 25 year olds learn to do.

Right now Wanyama should aim at getting up to doing what Dier does on the ball. That would be an improvement. The step up to Dembele is huge. The step up to someone that could actually be described as a deep playmaker almost makes me want to cry.

I've been spoiled a bit by Carrick and Modric. And I know I rate ball playing deep midfielders higher than most. But against Liverpool our starting duo in midfield were worse on the ball that all 3 of our opponent's central midfielders - and none of them are particularly good deep/central midfielders. fudgeing Milner would be a solid step up in terms of creativity and passing ability in our central midfield - James Milner! And I never wanted us to sign James Milner...

Both our central defenders are clearly superior to both our central midfielders on the ball. I've sometimes thought that they just switched places during a game whenever we have the ball we would look quite a bit better going forward (not actually suggesting that we do that). We have two excellent ball playing centre backs, but still... For me, as someone spoiled by Carrick and Modric, that's a bit of a sad state of affairs.

Right now I struggle to get my head around what the plan is. Is Pochettino happy with this selection of players as his plans are quite different to what I think would be good for us? Or is this to make room for another young player to emerge? Or have we ended up in a bit of a mess in terms of options in that position?

Links to Rabiot for example seemed to me to indicate a wish to bring in more ball playing ability to our central midfield options. The early trust showed to Bentaleb and Mason seemed to me to indicate the importance put in ball playing ability in those roles. But right now?

As you say yourself, Dembele does have a near unique skillset, so trying to find someone who is a direct replacement is a fruitless task.

Dembele is the master in games where we are under the cosh or are subject to 'the press' from other teams (we dont deal with this well), luckily we do not encounter this that often, so maybe it's a matter of puuting a replacement in for the Moose as and when the type of game allows. Such as home games where we are dominating. It will give Moose some time off as well.

We can see that the Dier/Wanyama pairing is a bit too defensive and lacking in carrick/modric style passing and tickover. Perhaps Poch was playing it safe and solid, it has backfired a little BUT 5 pts is ok with me. I think he may have given Winks some minutes as if anyone is a passer it's this lad. Hopefully there is a time this season (in the type of games i mention above )when he gets as many minutes as Carroll got a t times last year.

 

[Kenyan Spur]

And then go have a barbecue and beers on your terrace and make us all jealous about it

Edit: You have to do it at the top of Mount Kenya. Bottom doesn't work

Not making you jealous sir. That is just the way life is on the coast in the tropics.

And you can't take the goat to the top of Mount Kenya. Gods don"t like it. Plus it would take a good climber ( NOT ME ) about 3 to 4 days to do that.
And that is without a goat in tow. There is serious cliffs and rope climbing involved.

 

[Rorschach]

Not making you jealous sir. That is just the way life is on the coast in the tropics.

And you can't take the goat to the top of Mount Kenya. Gods don"t like it. Plus it would take a good climber ( NOT ME ) about 3 to 4 days to do that.
And that is without a goat in tow. There is serious cliffs and rope climbing involved.

The gods love it mate. Trust me. Send pictures and don't drop the goat on your way up .

 

[DubaiSpur]

I agree. There is no point in us having the academy if we are going to buy in first team squad players to play ahead of them.

There is no point having an academy if we have a first-team squad to play ahead of them.

Again, severely overestimating the capabilities of our youngsters won't help them, and this sort of thought process is what I've been warning about every time someone starts mentioning developing a greater reliance on the academy. In moderation, such a thing is fine. Selling the lot and filling the 25-man squad with Academy juniors is not going to help us progress, not by a long shot.

Yeah, I think you're right on where we are disagreeing on when it comes to squad balance. As I've said, I do agree that we need one more senior pro for the attacking 3 behind Kane/Janssen, so Onomah/NKoudou wouldn't need to be pressed into full-time starting duty if two of Lamela, Alli, Son, and Eriksen were injured longterm. I frankly wish we would have kept Clinton another season to see if he could have filled that role when healthy, but that ship seems to have sailed.

I'm admit that I probably am overrating Winks a bit, mostly due to just what little I've seen of him and what I've read from people who watch the youth teams consistently, but I am intrigued by the thought of him as our 4th choice central midfielder and would love to see him get a ton of minutes this season. I could def be wrong about him, but I really want to see him get a chance to start in more than just the odd League Cup game this season, and the same goes for CCV and Josh. It might be a gamble, but so is a big-money new signing like Wijnaldum. I just tend to prefer to gamble on our academy players. But of course, I understand that other side of the argument.

Which I respect. We also probably disagree substantially on the abilities of Winks and Josh in particular (as I mentioned, CCV is a bit of a special case because of Dier's flexibility) - I don't think they're quite good enough to come in and seamlessly replace a first-teamer yet, or even approximate such a change as a more experienced pro might. I think they might become good enough to do so in the future, but that it isn't wise to rely on them to this extent before they show that they're ready.

Personally, I don't see the need for Pau Lopez, but hey, if Poch wants him, get him. Beyond that, I think we need an AM and a CM, and that's in addition to Gorgeous (whenever we finally eke out the last euro or two and settle on a price).

He said 24-25 players in one interview, but my guess is that it includes the younger ones that don't have to be registered as well.

I listed 22 players and we still have Carroll, Njie, Mason with us.

From a total of 24 players last season we had 12 players making 28 appearances or more in the league. Below that there's Rose with 24, Mason with 22 (mostly subs), Carroll with 19 (mostly subs) and Davies with 17 (when Rose was out). That's 16 players.

The remaining 8 made 10 or less and, apart from Wimmer and Trippier, almost exclusively as subs.

We have lost Pritchard (5 mins), Chadli (938 mins) and Bentaleb (238 mins) and could see Mason (801 mins), Carroll (506 mins) and Njie (185 mins) leave. We've replaced those with the two signings we have made and we have Winks instead of Carroll.

With 7 places available on the bench I'd expect at least one or two to be youth in case there's an opportunity to play them and the rest to a standard one GK, one or two defenders, one midfielder and two attackers.

You mentioned 19 'senior' players plus CCV, Onomah and Winks. My point is that the difference between those two figures (22 vs 19) demands at least two first-team players to fill the gap, while your stance seems to be that the loss of players with low-minutes last season allows for Winks, Onomah and CCV to be relied upon to the extent that they become the direct replacements for Dembele, Eriksen and Toby respectively. Assuming the A.N.Other referred to in your post is N'Koudou, that still necessitates at least two more additions to cover for the CM and AM positions in my mind (while allowing for CCV to become the 4th choice CB on the understanding that Dier can do the job if circumstances demand), and fits with Poch's squad usage profile in both his time at Soton and here - especially given the number of competitions we're going to have to go full speed in this season (with a magnificently competitive CL group to overcome).

A squad of 21 players as 'pros' with CCV as the nominal cover for Toby (subject to his performances, which, if unsatisfactory, would simply allow for Dier to do that job instead) is closer to what I suspect Poch envisions, as evidenced by his Soton squad.Beyond that, an extra GK (Lopez, or McGee) and three young players for depth (Winks, Onomah, and A.N.Other if necessary) fills out the gaps. Usage is dictated by our circumstances, and our circumstances this season will demand constant rotation - I'd rather we don't have to watch Onomah get thrown on in a clutch situation to rescue us because we were far too tight to buy a senior pro who can handle such situations better.

 

[milo]

There is no point having an academy if we have a first-team squad to play ahead of them.

Again, severely overestimating the capabilities of our youngsters won't help them, and this sort of thought process is what I've been warning about every time someone starts mentioning developing a greater reliance on the academy. In moderation, such a thing is fine. Selling the lot and filling the 25-man squad with Academy juniors is not going to help us progress, not by a long shot.

We are a long way from doing that though. We have let some fringe players go and on the face of it, replaced them with three academy graduates. We have had no first choice players sold this summer and we have strengthened in the two areas where we most needed to.

 

[NaijaSpurs]

The best way to spend deadline day

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...tml?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

 

[metalgear]

The best way to spend deadline day

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...tml?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490

is that holiday for real ?
i thought them young 'uns on the bench last week could do with some drills

 

[glorygloryeze]

This season will probably be the hardest ever for Pochettino;
He's been backed perhaps like no other manager in recent times by Levy in the transfer market overall.
The next two weeks will REALLY test him: squad conditioning, squad rotation, correct substitution and in-game management will now be under the microscope like never before.

Come on Poch: take things to the next level and show your full mettole please.
There are far less excuses now (and less leeway in terms of looking at fixtures as 'less important') compared to last season.

In Poch We Trust

 

[Norway Yid]

The gaffer should have a proper song. Wouldn't this sound pretty amazing? Sorry if thought of or tried before...

It's amazing how you
can speak right to our hearts
Without saying a word
you can light up the dark
Try as we may
we could never explain
What we hear
when you don't say a thing

The smile on your face
lets us know that you need us
There's a truth in your eyes
sayin' you'll never leave us
The touch of your hand
says you'll catch us
if we ever fall
Oh Pochettino
You're one of us all

 

[Lemonade Money]

The gaffer should have a proper song. Wouldn't this sound pretty amazing? Sorry if thought of or tried before...

It's amazing how you
can speak right to our hearts
Without saying a word
you can light up the dark
Try as we may
we could never explain
What we hear
when you don't say a thing

The smile on your face
lets us know that you need us
There's a truth in your eyes
sayin' you'll never leave us
The touch of your hand
says you'll catch us
if we ever fall
Oh Pochettino
You're one of us all

 

[Robspur12]

This season will probably be the hardest ever for Pochettino;
He's been backed perhaps like no other manager in recent times by Levy in the transfer market overall.
The next two weeks will REALLY test him: squad conditioning, squad rotation, correct substitution and in-game management will now be under the microscope like never before.

Come on Poch: take things to the next level and show your full mettole please.
There are far less excuses now (and less leeway in terms of looking at fixtures as 'less important') compared to last season.

In Poch We Trust

We need to reign in our expectations in a little and not make too much of the last transfer window. Pretty much every team in the PL has strengthened and the top clubs have very strong squads. We have already discussed that none of the players that were purchased, while strengthening the squad, are going to displace a first teamer from last season. We have seen Arsenal and Liverpool spend much more than we did in the last window just to stand still. Poch's achievement last season and would be difficult to repeat this season let alone surpass. Hopefully we can get around the 70 point mark in the league, a little more would be great as would winning a cup. But tbh I cannot see this season being much different to recent ones in terms of achievement.

 

[Pirate55]

This season will probably be the hardest ever for Pochettino;
He's been backed perhaps like no other manager in recent times by Levy in the transfer market overall.
The next two weeks will REALLY test him: squad conditioning, squad rotation, correct substitution and in-game management will now be under the microscope like never before.

Come on Poch: take things to the next level and show your full mettole please.
There are far less excuses now (and less leeway in terms of looking at fixtures as 'less important') compared to last season.

In Poch We Trust

I agree. Levy has backed Poch to the hilt - even breaking his cardinal rule with the signing of Sissoko at 27 for 30 big ones. It really is now down to Poch to deliver. I hope he has learned some lessons from last season - particularly on team selection, rotation and (especially) substitution. We now have the depth of squad to deliver and there is little excuse to be had that those outside the first team are simply "not up to it".

Lets go Poch, lets go!!!! (with apologies to Tampa Bay Lightnings!!!!)

 

[milo]

I agree. Levy has backed Poch to the hilt - even breaking his cardinal rule with the signing of Sissoko at 27 for 30 big ones. It really is now down to Poch to deliver. I hope he has learned some lessons from last season - particularly on team selection, rotation and (especially) substitution. We now have the depth of squad to deliver and there is little excuse to be had that those outside the first team are simply "not up to it".

Lets go Poch, lets go!!!! (with apologies to Tampa Bay Lightnings!!!!)

How do people feel about squad rotation this season? Last year many people complained on when he did not send out the first 11.

 

[glorygloryeze]

We need to reign in our expectations in a little and not make too much of the last transfer window. Pretty much every team in the PL has strengthened and the top clubs have very strong squads. We have already discussed that none of the players that were purchased, while strengthening the squad, are going to displace a first teamer from last season. We have seen Arsenal and Liverpool spend much more than we did in the last window just to stand still. Poch's achievement last season and would be difficult to repeat this season let alone surpass. Hopefully we can get around the 70 point mark in the league, a little more would be great as would winning a cup. But tbh I cannot see this season being much different to recent ones in terms of achievement.

TBF, we've had other times when "pretty much every team in the PL has strengthened" so for me that's not so relevant. The key thing is that at most other times when that has happened, we couldn't say as much about our team/manager as we might now. As you say we have strengthened the squad and i actually think the whole point of being able to state that is that the signings are mostly viewed as those that very much could displace a first teamer from last season.

Achieving what we did last season would be great (although i think we actually need to win a cup now) and the context is so much different now in that:

- expectations are higher
- Poch (on the surface) has brought in the kinds of squad reinforcements that he wanted
- the ability to rotate/refresh the team for the long-haul of the season will be even more key and
- the ability to instil into the team a plan B (now that we will be targettted much more tactically) will be much more under scrutiny.

If Poch can especially show ability in the last two points then he will go up in most the estimations of most people in the football world (and not just us as fans).

Here's hoping.
Exciting times, regardless.
COYS

 

[glorygloryeze]

How do people feel about squad rotation this season? Last year many people complained on when he did not send out the first 11.

I think very smart and careful squad rotation for me will be one of the yardsticks i will judge Poch this year, given the high intensity of our training and gameplay.
There will be games where we should always send out our 'best 11', but the key trick will be expanding the number of players who could be given that 'best 11' type description.

In CL we will not have the luxury to rotate that we perhaps had at times in the EL (i think Poch ostly got this spot on last season; i actually think he was very pragmatic last season in his Dortmund line-ups given the way our form and energy had started to be effected once EL and FA Cup games came into the fixtures; i did, however, understand people's frustrations with the Dortmund away line-up) and those games will have to mostly have our 'best 11' playing, certainly the home ones anyway.
Our group is on one hand very good given what we could have drawn. But when you look at the group closely you'll see it is probably the closest to a 'Group of death' given the (on paper at least) similar levels between the sides; though it should be remembered that our squad and coach are probably the least experienced in the group and it's as feasible that we could narrowly finish bottom as much as it is that we finish top.

I would hope that the Gillingham league cup match is used to play at least 3 of the 'young/fringe' players, namely any of: CCV, Onomah, Winks and Edwards.
It might be the last chance they have for a while so i hope we surround them with a strong set-up of more experienced players who can guide them through the match (and others on the bench if the worst case scenario seems possible).

Lots of interesting things to look forward to.

 

[parklane1]

How do people feel about squad rotation this season? Last year many people complained on when he did not send out the first 11.

I think we have a much stronger bench this season ( on paper at least), so if it works out that is the case our teams should be stronger if one or two of the regulars takes a break.

 

[metalgear]

Poch got his men, and got them paid well.
Has Levy ever backed a coach so fully ?

 

[AdamB]

Poch got his men, and got them paid well.
Has Levy ever backed a coach so fully ?

He did. Just as the players didnt do well, I dont think Poch did that well last night either. Thought his change to drop Kane into the no 10 role and shift Alli out to the left wing was ridiculous - Kane was having a stinker and Alli was our most effective player after he shifted into the no 10 role. It came across as Kane being undroppable/unsubstitutable. Janssen coming on made sense but should have been for Kane.

 

[90291Spur]

He did. Just as the players didnt do well, I dont think Poch did that well last night either. Thought his change to drop Kane into the no 10 role and shift Alli out to the left wing was ridiculous - Kane was having a stinker and Alli was our most effective player after he shifted into the no 10 role. It came across as Kane being undroppable/unsubstitutable. Janssen coming on made sense but should have been for Kane.

Poch has a learning curve too and hopefully will be big enough to analyze his part in what happened against Monaco.

 

[Lemonade Money]

I think Poch made a mistake setting up too offensive against Monaco. I think he made the same mistake subbing our defensive midfielder against ten man Saudi Sportswashing Machine. You have to respect any team. I'd like to see us play at Wembley as if we're the away team, as after all we new to the ground too.