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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked

I knew someone would say that.

Outburst is to be taken as fact, backpeddling a bit cant be genuine, must be that he has been told off (conveniently perpetuating the ideas of unhappiness and division).

Couldnt be as simple as he was really grouchy the other day and cheered up the next.

It was tongue in cheek mainly in response to the "nothing to see here" line some people seem to want to take.

Levy hauling him over the coals is just as plausible as him just being grouchy for an evening. The truth, in all likelihood, is probably somewhere in between.
 
Big gold star for Poch for acting professionally in a press conference.
Well done on doing the minimum required there.
Next time you want to 'send a message' to Levy. Do it in private.

Some of you would be happy if he took a dump in the middle of a press conference as long as he was polite the next day.
"The evil journalists took his brick out of context."
 
It was tongue in cheek mainly in response to the "nothing to see here" line some people seem to want to take.

Levy hauling him over the coals is just as plausible as him just being grouchy for an evening. The truth, in all likelihood, is probably somewhere in between.

I tend to lean more to the "nothing to see here" because of the way he speaks. He is very ambiguous, and speaks often in themes or emotion than actual liner logic.

Most often, IMHO, these things are all much ado about nothing.

But, because he speaks the way he does, there is always a phalanx of fans rather eager to add a literal slant to his comments and claim the sky is falling in.

Baffles me why anyone would be so eager to be so upset/miserable/negative.
 
I tend to lean more to the "nothing to see here" because of the way he speaks. He is very ambiguous, and speaks often in themes or emotion than actual liner logic.

Most often, IMHO, these things are all much ado about nothing.

But, because he speaks the way he does, there is always a phalanx of fans rather eager to add a literal slant to his comments and claim the sky is falling in.

Baffles me why anyone would be so eager to be so upset/miserable/negative.

I actually think the opposite. He may be subtle at times but for the most part I thin he knows what he’s saying and more importantly he means what he says. I’m not worried about his recent comments, I think he’s probably frustrated by the lack of signings in recent weeks Ndombele aside although I accept this is just my interpretation. When he says things like we have to be brave and act differently/like a big club I personally think he’s saying we need to operate differently.

You’ll always get people who get worried and look for the worst with his comments but at the other end of the spectrum you will always get people excuse what he says regardless of what he says. If it’s irrefutably positive then people point to it like a moral passage in the bible and say look he’s being positive or look he’s having a go at you moany fans see. But when it’s in any way aggy or grumpy then people excuse it.

Like I said before, I think things may not be 100% rosy but you won’t find many clubs where that’s the case. Managers and chairmen will always have disagreements. I will only start to worry if it affects performances and results. I think that’s the most accurate barometer of measuring harmony or disharmony at a club. Tbh, it’s not about being eager to be negative, it’s just calling it for what it is.
 
I actually think the opposite. He may be subtle at times but for the most part I thin he knows what he’s saying and more importantly he means what he says. I’m not worried about his recent comments, I think he’s probably frustrated by the lack of signings in recent weeks Ndombele aside although I accept this is just my interpretation. When he says things like we have to be brave and act differently/like a big club I personally think he’s saying we need to operate differently.

You’ll always get people who get worried and look for the worst with his comments but at the other end of the spectrum you will always get people excuse what he says regardless of what he says. If it’s irrefutably positive then people point to it like a moral passage in the bible and say look he’s being positive or look he’s having a go at you moany fans see. But when it’s in any way aggy or grumpy then people excuse it.

Like I said before, I think things may not be 400% rosy but you won’t find many clubs where that’s the case. Managers and chairmen will always have disagreements. I will only start to worry if it affects performances and results. I think that’s the most accurate barometer of measuring harmony or disharmony at a club. Tbh, it’s not about being eager to be negative, it’s just calling it for what it is.

I think there are numerous examples of his comments being taken one way, and easily meaning several different things.

I think he knows what he means,but doesnt always communicate that in the most sucint way. That a black and white transcript reads very differently. And I think as is often stated - when you watch the conference and see it all in context it comes across entirely differently.

He said we need to be brave, that famous statement, and people immediately assumed it meant to spend big. But why?
It could very well have meant not spending unless there were players to make a difference (his words, actually), it could have meant gutting the squad and rebuilding, could have meant bringing through loads of youth - without specifics from him it could have meant many things. But people immediately just assumed "spend money = levy wont = poch unhappy = fallout" before ever considering alternatives.

I thought the other day he was clearly frustrated. Im not looking to white wash it as if he wasnt. What I am saying is Ive no idea WHY he was frustrated.

People immediately assume he is frustrated because we havent done deals (despite him saying, in the very same breath, he is very happy with the squad).

Seemed to me watching the conference he was frustrated with the questions. Could very well have been nothing to do with football though, for example, he came off the phone having had a barny with the Mrs and walked into inane questions he already said he wouldnt answer and lost his usual composure...

Its the constant conspiracy that tires me. It always has to be the ultimate drama, it always has to be assumed to mean the worst agenda, it always has to lead to a divide with Levy/Poch, and inevitably its always painted as Levy is the bad guy...

Poch has been our manager 5 years. The whole time he and Levy have been in sync. Poch has gone to lengths, many times, to explain his deep understanding (and acceptance) of our operations, and why they are what they are. He has always shared credit, spoken of the great working relationship with the board, and has recently signed a new 5 year deal (which he saw no need to involve agents with, he negotiated himself).

If people are so willing to over look all of this and immediately jump to "POCH IS FED UP WITH LEVY AND WANTS A DEMOTION BECAUSE HE IS HAVING A TANTRUM AND JUST SIGN THE fudging PLAYERS!!!" because he made statements that can be read a number of ways = I think they deserve to be pulled up on what is, frankly, a flimflam thing to do.
 
I think there are numerous examples of his comments being taken one way, and easily meaning several different things.

I think he knows what he means,but doesnt always communicate that in the most sucint way. That a black and white transcript reads very differently. And I think as is often stated - when you watch the conference and see it all in context it comes across entirely differently.

He said we need to be brave, that famous statement, and people immediately assumed it meant to spend big. But why?
It could very well have meant not spending unless there were players to make a difference (his words, actually), it could have meant gutting the squad and rebuilding, could have meant bringing through loads of youth - without specifics from him it could have meant many things. But people immediately just assumed "spend money = levy wont = poch unhappy = fallout" before ever considering alternatives.

I thought the other day he was clearly frustrated. Im not looking to white wash it as if he wasnt. What I am saying is Ive no idea WHY he was frustrated.

People immediately assume he is frustrated because we havent done deals (despite him saying, in the very same breath, he is very happy with the squad).

Seemed to me watching the conference he was frustrated with the questions. Could very well have been nothing to do with football though, for example, he came off the phone having had a barny with the Mrs and walked into inane questions he already said he wouldnt answer and lost his usual composure...

Its the constant conspiracy that tires me. It always has to be the ultimate drama, it always has to be assumed to mean the worst agenda, it always has to lead to a divide with Levy/Poch, and inevitably its always painted as Levy is the bad guy...

Poch has been our manager 5 years. The whole time he and Levy have been in sync. Poch has gone to lengths, many times, to explain his deep understanding (and acceptance) of our operations, and why they are what they are. He has always shared credit, spoken of the great working relationship with the board, and has recently signed a new 5 year deal (which he saw no need to involve agents with, he negotiated himself).

If people are so willing to over look all of this and immediately jump to "POCH IS FED UP WITH LEVY AND WANTS A DEMOTION BECAUSE HE IS HAVING A TANTRUM AND JUST SIGN THE fudging PLAYERS!!!" because he made statements that can be read a number of ways = I think they deserve to be pulled up on what is, frankly, a flimflam thing to do.

I’ll admit there are times where he says things that make little or no sense to me. He comes across as a thoughtful, philosophical type of person. That said, I think the majority of the time he’s clear in what he says even if it’s not worded in a way everyone would necessarily understand. Seem to recall around January time he called on the fans to pull together/unite/insert adjective here and said some fans were “unhappy”. Naturally, some that always excuse what he says or claim it’s lost in translation or not what he really meant to say fully understood him for the first time ever and used it as a stick to call our fans on here. It’s just a bit too convenient and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with analysing his comments for what they are and discussing them.
 
For @nayimfromthehalfwayline and @Gazza Dazzla

https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/fo...=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1564642990

Asked if he was the manager or coach, Pochettino laughed and said: "We need to be relaxed and calm. I am so happy. I hope we have a very good season. The most important thing now is to show respect for the club. We are trying to bring the best team possible. We are going to work hard to make our fans happy and be competitive.

Yeah but that doesnt count, because he has been scolded and told to tow the party line or else, its not genuine ;)
 
I’ll admit there are times where he says things that make little or no sense to me. He comes across as a thoughtful, philosophical type of person. That said, I think the majority of the time he’s clear in what he says even if it’s not worded in a way everyone would necessarily understand. Seem to recall around January time he called on the fans to pull together/unite/insert adjective here and said some fans were “unhappy”. Naturally, some that always excuse what he says or claim it’s lost in translation or not what he really meant to say fully understand him for the first time ever and used it as a stick to call our fans on here. It’s just a bit too convenient and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with analysing his comments for what they are and discussing them.

Thats basically my point - the way he speaks is open to interpretation. Its not clear cut by any measure, really it never has been.

And yet people will take a decontextualised statement, decide what it means themselves, then use the quote as an absolute and irrefutable confirmation of their own inference.

I dont mind discussing what he has said, what it might mean, etc.

I do mind the practice of just twisting his words to facilitate a meltdown.

As I said, at the very least its just tiresome. At worst, from a Glory Glory point of view, it trashes the forum for days at a time and kills any chance of a decent conversation.
 
See Spooky's view as well (put it in Levy thread) https://www.dearmrlevy.com/dml/2019/7/31/curb-your-pessimism

So funny to see Spooky being the optimistic one .. our fans truely need a reality check some days ...

Been a long time since Spooky wrote anything worth reading, Id suggest this is his best effort in years.

Excellent piece.

Don’t confuse the true essence of identity with the politics of football. You are not defined by the success of your club. You can choose to be defined this way, I know some of you do, with your checklists and economics and five easy steps to winning stuff (spend, Spend, SpENd, SSSSpenD, SPEEEEEEND!!11). It will ruin your entire experience, but some of you love doing that. Projecting your misery, abusing Spurs as a conduit for your misgivings, exaggerating every little thing to appear tenfold in magnitude. You prefer to moan and complain because it helps to mask the good things. The very same things you’re too afraid to embrace because you think doing so is a weakness. So instead you point at those that synergise with the football team and call them weak for happy clapping and basking in the moments, limbs and all, even if there’s no open bus parade to enjoy at the end of it all.

Deep.

ouch, but probably an appropriate message for a few on here...
 
I’ll admit there are times where he says things that make little or no sense to me. He comes across as a thoughtful, philosophical type of person. That said, I think the majority of the time he’s clear in what he says even if it’s not worded in a way everyone would necessarily understand. Seem to recall around January time he called on the fans to pull together/unite/insert adjective here and said some fans were “unhappy”. Naturally, some that always excuse what he says or claim it’s lost in translation or not what he really meant to say fully understood him for the first time ever and used it as a stick to call our fans on here. It’s just a bit too convenient and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with analysing his comments for what they are and discussing them.

Discuss is fine, disagree is fine, but make no mistake discord sells and the media will use any excuse to create a Poch/Levy Poch problem where there is none, and other fans will love nothing better. Spurs fans are being played by this brick.

And just in case you think I make it up, how many years did british media harp on about how a DoF system would never work in the UK (when Spurs were first major club), and put every failing of the club on the supposed DoF/manager issue. I watched an analysis of United by Sky a few weeks ago and now it's "well if United want to help OGS, they really need to a get a DoF in soon" .. fudging hilarious

Poch is working in a second language, I do the same, sometimes nuance is almost impossible to clearly get across. Add to that, do I get all the investments I want from my boss to make my job successful (I work for a bigger company than Spurs)? = no, does it annoy me? = sure, does it mean I'm not continuing to work with the organization and my senior leadership in a productive way = no, I still do my job, and mostly happily.

Maybe Poch is trying to subtly put pressure on the club, maybe he thinks it's his duty to do that, doesn't fudging mean the sky is falling and he and Levy aren't working together well the majority of the time.
 
because that's our comfort zone

all this being awesome and smashing everyone every week is discombobulating

I love your positivity and bravado and perhaps I’m utterly mistaken to have any concerns at all. We all need to question our thoughts and beliefs at the best of times.

Again I will try and state calmly that our form in the league since Burnley away towards the end of February has been very bad as were the performances to match them.

Of the last 36 points available last season we managed to accrue a total of 11, form wise this is just close to relegation fodder or little better.

It could be understandably argued that our champions league run whilst amazing, saved Poch from a bit of flack regarding our league form, it could also be argued we got so so lucky to get top 4 with a points total that doesn’t usually secure it, we really are indebted to Utd and Goons for bottling it to the extreme.

In terms of smashing teams I’ll give you we did Huddersfield by 4 near the end but the frequency of us smashing teams last season was very remote.

I don’t believe anybody on here personally wants to be deliberately, negative/miserable or averse to the fact that over his tenure Poch has done some very fine work.

Our fans can create as many stellar declarations as to why we shouldn’t mind winning any silverware as they like, it’s becoming such a fine art for us to create spin when deep down we know a lack of trophies is the real reason why we will never be classed among the elite, no matter how many times we finish top 4, it’s why we’re hated by our rivals but not truly hated. Our disdain to the main objectives of football is now just very predictable, our excuses for failing ever more elaborate...

Those of us desperate to see our club lift silverware, a burning passion for glory, should not be treated like spoilt brats, we enjoy the ride but eventually want to come to a satisfactory destination that will live long in the memory. Long years of hurt and disappointment has made me ache and burn with a desire to see us get over the line.

I think with the form as explained and recent media mess of Pochettino’s own making might mean some fans at least have the right to question.

We’re all spurs fans, with the same entwined desires etched into our hearts and souls.. we want glory.

I hope many on here are right and I’m worrying my little head over nothing, because if Poch was to leave abruptly or perhaps in six months time, I greatly fear that many of our fans are mentally unprepared for such a hypothetical outcome.
 
I love your positivity and bravado and perhaps I’m utterly mistaken to have any concerns at all. We all need to question our thoughts and beliefs at the best of times.

Again I will try and state calmly that our form in the league since Burnley away towards the end of February has been very bad as were the performances to match them.

Of the last 36 points available last season we managed to accrue a total of 11, form wise this is just close to relegation fodder or little better.

It could be understandably argued that our champions league run whilst amazing, saved Poch from a bit of flack regarding our league form, it could also be argued we got so so lucky to get top 4 with a points total that doesn’t usually secure it, we really are indebted to Utd and Goons for bottling it to the extreme.

In terms of smashing teams I’ll give you we did Huddersfield by 4 near the end but the frequency of us smashing teams last season was very remote.

I don’t believe anybody on here personally wants to be deliberately, negative/miserable or averse to the fact that over his tenure Poch has done some very fine work.

Our fans can create as many stellar declarations as to why we shouldn’t mind winning any silverware as they like, it’s becoming such a fine art for us to create spin when deep down we know a lack of trophies is the real reason why we will never be classed among the elite, no matter how many times we finish top 4, it’s why we’re hated by our rivals but not truly hated. Our disdain to the main objectives of football is now just very predictable, our excuses for failing ever more elaborate...

Those of us desperate to see our club lift silverware, a burning passion for glory, should not be treated like spoilt brats, we enjoy the ride but eventually want to come to a satisfactory destination that will live long in the memory. Long years of hurt and disappointment has made me ache and burn with a desire to see us get over the line.

I think with the form as explained and recent media mess of Pochettino’s own making might mean some fans at least have the right to question.

We’re all spurs fans, with the same entwined desires etched into our hearts and souls.. we want glory.

I hope many on here are right and I’m worrying my little head over nothing, because if Poch was to leave abruptly or perhaps in six months time, I greatly fear that many of our fans are mentally unprepared for such a hypothetical outcome.

I’m not saying we were not fudging brick for the last few months of the season, we were, but everyone else was worse.

It was far from perfect, but there were mitigating factors and we’ve hopefully righted a few of those for the next campaign, we’ve added strength in a position that was a problem last year, and whilst we are a body down at RB, it is the body that most would probably highlight as the weakest link in the team.

I expect a league title/European cup double next season.
 
I’m not saying we were not fudging brick for the last few months of the season, we were, but everyone else was worse.

It was far from perfect, but there were mitigating factors and we’ve hopefully righted a few of those for the next campaign, we’ve added strength in a position that was a problem last year, and whilst we are a body down at RB, it is the body that most would probably highlight as the weakest link in the team.

I expect a league title/European cup double next season.

Anything less and I want Poch horsewhipped, Levy burned at the stake and all the players sold. This is the minimum we should be expecting. It's all about winning mentality.
 
I love your positivity and bravado and perhaps I’m utterly mistaken to have any concerns at all. We all need to question our thoughts and beliefs at the best of times.

Again I will try and state calmly that our form in the league since Burnley away towards the end of February has been very bad as were the performances to match them.

Of the last 36 points available last season we managed to accrue a total of 11, form wise this is just close to relegation fodder or little better.

It could be understandably argued that our champions league run whilst amazing, saved Poch from a bit of flack regarding our league form, it could also be argued we got so so lucky to get top 4 with a points total that doesn’t usually secure it, we really are indebted to Utd and Goons for bottling it to the extreme.

In terms of smashing teams I’ll give you we did Huddersfield by 4 near the end but the frequency of us smashing teams last season was very remote.

I don’t believe anybody on here personally wants to be deliberately, negative/miserable or averse to the fact that over his tenure Poch has done some very fine work.

Our fans can create as many stellar declarations as to why we shouldn’t mind winning any silverware as they like, it’s becoming such a fine art for us to create spin when deep down we know a lack of trophies is the real reason why we will never be classed among the elite, no matter how many times we finish top 4, it’s why we’re hated by our rivals but not truly hated. Our disdain to the main objectives of football is now just very predictable, our excuses for failing ever more elaborate...

Those of us desperate to see our club lift silverware, a burning passion for glory, should not be treated like spoilt brats, we enjoy the ride but eventually want to come to a satisfactory destination that will live long in the memory. Long years of hurt and disappointment has made me ache and burn with a desire to see us get over the line.

I think with the form as explained and recent media mess of Pochettino’s own making might mean some fans at least have the right to question.

We’re all spurs fans, with the same entwined desires etched into our hearts and souls.. we want glory.

I hope many on here are right and I’m worrying my little head over nothing, because if Poch was to leave abruptly or perhaps in six months time, I greatly fear that many of our fans are mentally unprepared for such a hypothetical outcome.

Re the form of last season, we ran out of legs .. as did quite a few teams due to world cup summer. No surprise the teams with bigger depth (City) and less deep WC involvement (Pool) lasted the distance better.

We have just played Juve, Real, Bayern and United and won 3 out of the 4 with a fit Kane & Lamela, new signing looking good and Lucas seeming to continue his form from the back end of the season. Let the season start before we panic.

Re Poch, I have nothing for admiration for his achievements, but let me be clear -> Poch is not Spurs and he is not the architect of our success, one day he will leave. I have sat here and listed to people cry wolf when BMJ left, when Harry left, when AVB left, when Carrick, Berbatov, Modric, Bale left, the amount of "last or only chances" I've heard that we didn't take, yet somehow a squad with no investment, dead legs, injuries and suspensions managed to make it to CL again, and the CL final.

Next year may be a disaster .. Poch may leave, Eriksen, Toby and Jan may fudge off next summer, it doesn't matter in the long term because the club has secured it's financial future with training ground, stadium, corporate sponsorship, etc. And that is Levy not Poch.

Spurs will win trophies again because we are playing the long game better than anyone else in the world for the last 10+ years.
 
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