Just Where Are The Club Going?

[Hully]

AVB learnt his trade analysing other teams play. Preparing Morino's scouting charts etc. His is someone who is good at analysing things. He's not a big talker. He's more contemplative. A tactician. Not that it shows currently.

There's no evidence of him being good at analysing at all, he lines up the team in the same regardless of who the opposition are, it was the biggest complaint about him last year by Chelsea fans and he's doing exactly the same thing his season.
You're right about him not being a good communicator, a failure which is totally incompatible with being a top class manager.

 

[milo]

Harry is a motivator. He gets his players believing in themselves and playing. He's probably not sure how it does it himself. He believes in them and asks them to do what they are good at. And it works. There is more to it of course. But in essence that;s HR's style.

AVB learnt his trade analysing other teams play. Preparing Morino's scouting charts etc. His is someone who is good at analysing things. He's not a big talker. He's more contemplative. A tactician. Not that it shows currently.

But surely being a good tactician would mean analysing the opposition and changing how you play to exploit weaknesses that you identify. This should also be evident in their use of substitutions.

Maybe AVB hasn't had enough time in his jobs other than Porto to do this but I see little evidence of him being a better tactician than Harry.

I sometimes think that when football fans talk about someone being good at tactics what they actually mean is that they do not play 4-4-2.

 

[The Moonlit Knight]

But surely being a good tactician would mean analysing the opposition and changing how you play to exploit weaknesses that you identify. This should also be evident in their use of substitutions.

Maybe AVB hasn't had enough time in his jobs other than Porto to do this but I see little evidence of him being a better tactician than Harry.

I sometimes think that when football fans talk about someone being good at tactics what they actually mean is that they do not play 4-4-2.

It baffles me the last two matches we've lined up 4-5-1 and looked tinkle poor. Switched to 4-4-2 and gone 1-0 up. Then switched back to 4-5-1, looked tinkle poor and conceded a late goal. AVB, a lesson to be learned there maybe?

 

[noddy1991]

sadly at the end of the day it seems it's more important for daniel levy to think he's in charge of running team affairs again than the club to be winning football matches

 

[Spursalot]

sadly at the end of the day it seems it's more important for daniel levy to think he's in charge of running team affairs again than the club to be winning football matches

Not sure how Levy is running team affairs more then he should, he's negotiating deals during transfer windows, yes. Which is his job..


You might think he's negotiating them badly, but that's still his job.

 

[BrainOfLevy]

It baffles me the last two matches we've lined up 4-5-1 and looked tinkle poor. Switched to 4-4-2 and gone 1-0 up. Then switched back to 4-5-1, looked tinkle poor and conceded a late goal. AVB, a lesson to be learned there maybe?

We looked even worse against WBA when we went 4-4-2, and were brick right the way through the game against Norwich. I don't think any particular lesson can be drawn from any of that, to be honest.

 

[Spursalot]

It baffles me the last two matches we've lined up 4-5-1 and looked tinkle poor. Switched to 4-4-2 and gone 1-0 up. Then switched back to 4-5-1, looked tinkle poor and conceded a late goal. AVB, a lesson to be learned there maybe?

Yes, we went 1 up against Norwich when we went 4-4-2, but we still looked tinkle poor.


Our goal was a piece of individual brilliance, not due to going 4-4-2.

 

[metalgear]

with respect to the number of english players - we're not far off:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...=/home/search.html?s=&authornamef=Matt+Barlow

[h=3]ENGLISH PLAYERS STARTING IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE LAST WEEKEND[/h]NORWICH 6: Ruddy, Barnett, Johnson, Howson, Pilkington*, Holt.

SOUTHAMPTON 6: Davis, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Puncheon, Lambert.

QPR 5: Green, Ferdinand, Wright-Phillips, Zamora, Johnson.

STOKE 5: Wilkinson, Shawcross, Whitehead, Kightly, Crouch.

EVERTON 4: Neville, Jagielka, Baines, Osman.

MAN UNITED 4: Ferdinand, Carrick, Cleverley, Welbeck.

SUNDERLAND 4: Gardner, Colback, A Johnson, Cattermole.

SWANSEA 4: Dyer, Britton, Routledge, Graham.

TOTTENHAM 4: Walker, Lennon, Livermore, Defoe.

WEST HAM 4: Nolan, Carroll, Taylor, Noble.

ARSENAL 3: Jenkinson, Gibbs, Oxlade-Chamberlain.

CHELSEA 3: Cole, Cahill, Lampard.

LIVERPOOL 3: G.Johnson, Gerrard, Sterling.

Emirates Marketing Project 3: Hart, Lescott, Rodwell.

ASTON VILLA 2: Lowton, Bent.

FULHAM 2: Sidwell, Richardson.

Saudi Sportswashing Machine 2: Simpson, Taylor.

WEST BROM 2: Foster, Ridgewell.

WIGAN 0.

 

[Pandy]

There's no evidence of him being good at analysing at all, he lines up the team in the same regardless of who the opposition are, it was the biggest complaint about him last year by Chelsea fans and he's doing exactly the same thing his season.
You're right about him not being a good communicator, a failure which is totally incompatible with being a top class manager.

So to suggest he is good at analysis without evidence* isn't acceptable but you can say he has poor communication skills and will never be a top manager based on what exactly?

*which does actually exist online (Chelsea vs Saudi Sportswashing Machine scout report 2005)

 

[Pandy]

Can't believe so many fans have developed such blatantly staunch views against our new manager after just 3 games. It's truly pathetic, back your fvcking club...

 

[Jammy]

with respect to the number of english players - we're not far off:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...=/home/search.html?s=&authornamef=Matt+Barlow

[h=3]ENGLISH PLAYERS STARTING IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE LAST WEEKEND[/h]NORWICH 6: Ruddy, Barnett, Johnson, Howson, Pilkington*, Holt.

SOUTHAMPTON 6: Davis, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Puncheon, Lambert.

QPR 5: Green, Ferdinand, Wright-Phillips, Zamora, Johnson.

STOKE 5: Wilkinson, Shawcross, Whitehead, Kightly, Crouch.

EVERTON 4: Neville, Jagielka, Baines, Osman.

MAN UNITED 4: Ferdinand, Carrick, Cleverley, Welbeck.

SUNDERLAND 4: Gardner, Colback, A Johnson, Cattermole.

SWANSEA 4: Dyer, Britton, Routledge, Graham.

TOTTENHAM 4: Walker, Lennon, Livermore, Defoe.

WEST HAM 4: Nolan, Carroll, Taylor, Noble.

ARSENAL 3: Jenkinson, Gibbs, Oxlade-Chamberlain.

CHELSEA 3: Cole, Cahill, Lampard.

LIVERPOOL 3: G.Johnson, Gerrard, Sterling.

Emirates Marketing Project 3: Hart, Lescott, Rodwell.

ASTON VILLA 2: Lowton, Bent.

FULHAM 2: Sidwell, Richardson.

Saudi Sportswashing Machine 2: Simpson, Taylor.

WEST BROM 2: Foster, Ridgewell.

WIGAN 0.

We c

 

[Jammy]

with respect to the number of english players - we're not far off:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...=/home/search.html?s=&authornamef=Matt+Barlow

[h=3]ENGLISH PLAYERS STARTING IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE LAST WEEKEND[/h]NORWICH 6: Ruddy, Barnett, Johnson, Howson, Pilkington*, Holt.

SOUTHAMPTON 6: Davis, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Puncheon, Lambert.

QPR 5: Green, Ferdinand, Wright-Phillips, Zamora, Johnson.

STOKE 5: Wilkinson, Shawcross, Whitehead, Kightly, Crouch.

EVERTON 4: Neville, Jagielka, Baines, Osman.

MAN UNITED 4: Ferdinand, Carrick, Cleverley, Welbeck.

SUNDERLAND 4: Gardner, Colback, A Johnson, Cattermole.

SWANSEA 4: Dyer, Britton, Routledge, Graham.

TOTTENHAM 4: Walker, Lennon, Livermore, Defoe.

WEST HAM 4: Nolan, Carroll, Taylor, Noble.

ARSENAL 3: Jenkinson, Gibbs, Oxlade-Chamberlain.

CHELSEA 3: Cole, Cahill, Lampard.

LIVERPOOL 3: G.Johnson, Gerrard, Sterling.

Emirates Marketing Project 3: Hart, Lescott, Rodwell.

ASTON VILLA 2: Lowton, Bent.

FULHAM 2: Sidwell, Richardson.

Saudi Sportswashing Machine 2: Simpson, Taylor.

WEST BROM 2: Foster, Ridgewell.

WIGAN 0.

We could conceivably be down to just Walker at times this season.

 

[noddy1991]

Not sure how Levy is running team affairs more then he should, he's negotiating deals during transfer windows, yes. Which is his job..


You might think he's negotiating them badly, but that's still his job.

you've interpreted what i meant really. he wanted rid of redknapp at all costs even if that meant the club going nowhere for 3 years. i reckon he'd still be gone even if we'd have finished miles clear of arsenal

 

[noddy1991]

misinterpreted

 

[milo]

So to suggest he is good at analysis without evidence* isn't acceptable but you can say he has poor communication skills and will never be a top manager based on what exactly?

*which does actually exist online (Chelsea vs Saudi Sportswashing Machine scout report 2005)

It's a spoof, isn't it?

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

I dont believe so. Saw a press conference on youtube of AVB at Porto (shortly before going to Chelsea) where he gets asked about what his analysis work was like and be basically says "There is a copy of it on the internet" and smiles.

 

[Hully]

So to suggest he is good at analysis without evidence* isn't acceptable but you can say he has poor communication skills and will never be a top manager based on what exactly?

*which does actually exist online (Chelsea vs Saudi Sportswashing Machine scout report 2005)

It's one thing to be able to analyse how an opposition team lines up and a completely another to be able to line up your team to counter them.

It's all very well being able to write a scouting report but that doesn't qualify someone to manage.

I haven't made my mind up about AVB on the basis of three games, that would be stupid, I made my mind up about him during his time at Chelsea, for me he fell a lot way short of the mark.

I'm not saying he'll never be a good manager, 10 years experience might improve him. Might.

 

[Modric THFC]

with respect to the number of english players - we're not far off:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...=/home/search.html?s=&authornamef=Matt+Barlow

[h=3]ENGLISH PLAYERS STARTING IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE LAST WEEKEND[/h]NORWICH 6: Ruddy, Barnett, Johnson, Howson, Pilkington*, Holt.

SOUTHAMPTON 6: Davis, Clyne, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Puncheon, Lambert.

QPR 5: Green, Ferdinand, Wright-Phillips, Zamora, Johnson.

STOKE 5: Wilkinson, Shawcross, Whitehead, Kightly, Crouch.

EVERTON 4: Neville, Jagielka, Baines, Osman.

MAN UNITED 4: Ferdinand, Carrick, Cleverley, Welbeck.

SUNDERLAND 4: Gardner, Colback, A Johnson, Cattermole.

SWANSEA 4: Dyer, Britton, Routledge, Graham.

TOTTENHAM 4: Walker, Lennon, Livermore, Defoe.

WEST HAM 4: Nolan, Carroll, Taylor, Noble.

ARSENAL 3: Jenkinson, Gibbs, Oxlade-Chamberlain.

CHELSEA 3: Cole, Cahill, Lampard.

LIVERPOOL 3: G.Johnson, Gerrard, Sterling.

Emirates Marketing Project 3: Hart, Lescott, Rodwell.

ASTON VILLA 2: Lowton, Bent.

FULHAM 2: Sidwell, Richardson.

Saudi Sportswashing Machine 2: Simpson, Taylor.

WEST BROM 2: Foster, Ridgewell.

WIGAN 0.

This isn't 100 percent accurate. The like of Jonathan Walters (born in England, lived in England his whole life, yet plays for Ireland) started for Stoke last weekend. I'm sure there's a load of similar players.

 

[joey55]

Harry is a motivator. He gets his players believing in themselves and playing. He's probably not sure how it does it himself. He believes in them and asks them to do what they are good at. And it works. There is more to it of course. But in essence that;s HR's style.

AVB learnt his trade analysing other teams play. Preparing Morino's scouting charts etc. His is someone who is good at analysing things. He's not a big talker. He's more contemplative. A tactician. Not that it shows currently.

Only if you assume he is a good tactician or that tacticians in general make good managers. Basically your statement makes it sound as if tacticians are good, when of course a tactical manager has every chance of being rubbish. Just because a manager prefers a more tactical approach, doesn't mean this will be a benefit. If his tactics stifle the players, then the tactical approach is detrimental. So far in his Prem career, I think it's very obvious AVB is a tactician as, but to date he's shown that his tactical interference, for want of a better word, has made teams worse.

At the end of the day the managers with the most Prem titles are Wenger and Fergie, both of who aren't known for their tactical approach. On Arsenalmania they talk about him as if he is tactically incompetent. I remember when Martin Keown was asked about Wengers tactics and he said that often he would draw to circles and put a line between them, say "pass the ball" and that was it. Yet he went the entire season undefeated and though many Spurs fans hate him, should be considered the bench mark for Prem managers.

 

[sp61urs]

you've interpreted what i meant really. he wanted rid of redknapp at all costs even if that meant the club going nowhere for 3 years. i reckon he'd still be gone even if we'd have finished miles clear of arsenal

Absolutely spot on...I believe the relationship somewhere along the way got personal...probably when Levy tried to force a player on him he didn't want and 'arry just told him to f**k off!