I liked Erik Lamela before it was cool

[billyiddo]

No, it wasn't that he chose the wrong option, it's that he didn't have the ability to execute the cross. If I can spot this technical weakness, rest assured every scouting report on Lamela will pick it up and reference will be made to it in the opposition team talk: "Show him outside and he won't be able to do us any damage - just keep him away from the 6 yard box - it's only Walker we need to worry about delivering quality crosses from the right".

If Lamela ever whips in a quality cross with his right I will proved to have been wrong.

so now it has to be a cross on his weak foot for him to be any use - one could come to the conclusion you're just picking the things he hadn't shown himself to be great at and building them up as all important attributes or in other words having a unhealthy bias against the lad, ignoring positives and focusing on the negatives...

Scores a few good goals for us ; "pfft come back to me when he smashes in a thunderbolt"

Plays wide and has positive effect; "pfft come back when crosses the ball on his weaker foot"

Creates a variety of chances for his team mates; "pfft they were'nt as intelligent a pass as two of the best ones we've seen from our in form tailisman"


I look forward to hearing about how he can't rifle in a header, hold off 6 defenders whilst doing keepy uppies or recite ancient latin text whilst riding a unicycle in the coming weeks.

 

[mjc23]

Excellent, this is kind of thing we like, top lad:

http://instagram.com/p/xU0X71rgEy/

I like this a lot!

 

[Yiddo]

Excellent, this is kind of thing we like, top lad:

http://instagram.com/p/xU0X71rgEy/

Who is he?

 

[Bullet]

Who is he?

Watch again, Lamela is sitting behind him, disguised as a female Michael Jackson impersonator

 

[braineclipse]

I respectfully disagree, he cut inside virtually every time, sometimes to good effect and did some good work, but some times the better option was out wide but he clearly avoids putting himself in that situation. The trouble is that managers and defenders will become increasingly wise to this.

As you can see at 1:04, he had the option to whip it in with his right foot to Chadli on the back post to lay on a goal, but he simply didn't trust his ability, so does what he always tends to do, try to get closer to around the six yard box for a stab with either the outside of his left or a toe poke with his right - he can only seem deliver from the right from that sort of range - and as tends to happen the chance was lost and Chadli was left feeling exasperated.

He did manage to get inside the six yard box for the chance to Kane but more often than not that won't come off. This video actually shows the good and bad of Lamela - cuts inside, can do good work. Wide, generally useless.

[video=youtube;3_YceSfNssw]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_YceSfNssw[/video]

Wow. I wonder what your reaction would be if someone posted a video like that about Townsend or some other player you rate. Playing that well, scoring, setting up chances, linking up. Only for the poster to pick apart one specific moment like that.

Your body language analysis of how Chadli felt based on that one second of not even showing his face would be comparable to what people were claiming to know about Vertonghen last season, if not for being even more baseless.

No, it wasn't that he chose the wrong option, it's that he didn't have the ability to execute the cross. If I can spot this technical weakness, rest assured every scouting report on Lamela will pick it up and reference will be made to it in the opposition team talk: "Show him outside and he won't be able to do us any damage - just keep him away from the 6 yard box - it's only Walker we need to worry about delivering quality crosses from the right".

If Lamela ever whips in a quality cross with his right I will proved to have been wrong.

The specific situation was not some obvious choice to make the way you make it seem. Not that dissimilar to the situation where he also goes down the outside (thought he couldn't do that) and sets up the massive chance for Kane and Eriksen. Choosing to get to the byline is a fine choice. Even if it wasn't nitpicking over it is ridiculous when these players are making these snap decisions in game.

You go on and on like a child missing his toy about Lamela's weaker foot. Have you noticed that no one is claiming that he can put in a quality cross with his right. I don't know if he can, I don't know if he will ever be able to. If that was your only claim then yes, you would be proven wrong if he whips in a quality cross with his right. It's not though, is it?

 

[NWND]

Who is he?

Lamela's cousin

 

[africanspurs]

I think it was a very unfortunate injury. AVB gave him two league starts iirc, one of them away to Emirates Marketing Project. After Lamela had done well in the EL he was dropped again in the league. Made no sense. Even when

The pressure didn't lessen. The critics were just the same. Those that didn't like what they had seen in the first half of that season didn't all of a sudden become more patient. Quite the opposite, they now had a season to judge him by. Despite him only starting 3 league games. There was no added patience about Lamela this summer, if you don't believe me try to think back to the transfer window. Quite a few people wanted him gone.

Sherwood seemed to rate him much higher than AVB. I think that second half of last season could have been very important for Lamela. And I think he would have been better this season if he had gotten 15-20 games in that second half to continue adjusting rather than spending that most likely not even kicking a football.



Who is that has rose tinted glasses? Which posters? Who is it that have been claiming that he has been delivering well enough and against strong opposition?

People are claiming that he has potential and that he's shown that potential in some games, and that if given time he's likely to do that much more consistently.

agree to disagree then

i think that injury was perfect.....a complete break from proceedings, nothing that happened was be down to him and a waste of money...he would have been excused from lynch mobs game after game

The pressure for me lessened. Where once everyone was nit picking on everything he did, no one was talking about him anymore....how could that be added pressure when you are no longer in the spotlight? people may still be impatient but i doubt they were impatient for him as much as when he was healthy, but rather something else or someone else....

I do agree that sherwood would have played him more and he might have blossomed some in a free flowing transition counter attacking team that sherwood was promoting ........but again for me personally i am glad he wrote off the season when he did. fresh start

Infact i found that with his injury, the perfect excuse as to why his season was bad came into play.....he was injured. You can hang your hat on that one and retire in the debate of his first season........i wouldnt cause i was scrutinising everything that the kid did and injury aside i was not impressed by what i was expecting from him at the time.

i'm good now that i have taken off the price tag and Gutter boys exaggerations off the table

 

[africanspurs]

Lamela has the classic school-boy mentality of wanting to be on the ball as much as possible. So rather than making runs off the ball - he's more likely to move towards the ball

amazing

thats actually the reason now that you mention it

these guys are larger than life figures sometimes you forget they are human beings

i think thats spot on personally.

 

[milo]

agree to disagree then

i think that injury was perfect.....a complete break from proceedings, nothing that happened was be down to him and a waste of money...he would have been excused from lynch mobs game after game

The pressure for me lessened. Where once everyone was nit picking on everything he did, no one was talking about him anymore....how could that be added pressure when you are no longer in the spotlight? people may still be impatient but i doubt they were impatient for him as much as when he was healthy, but rather something else or someone else....

I do agree that sherwood would have played him more and he might have blossomed some in a free flowing transition counter attacking team that sherwood was promoting ........but again for me personally i am glad he wrote off the season when he did. fresh start

Infact i found that with his injury, the perfect excuse as to why his season was bad came into play.....he was injured. You can hang your hat on that one and retire in the debate of his first season........i wouldnt cause i was scrutinising everything that the kid did and injury aside i was not impressed by what i was expecting from him at the time.

i'm good now that i have taken off the price tag and Gutter boys exaggerations off the table

I doubt that if you gave him his time again Lamela would choose to be injured last year.

 

[braineclipse]

I doubt that if you gave him his time again Lamela would choose to be injured last year.

Seems very strange to me at least. And to be injured for the half of the season where we were actually playing good attacking football and where our head coach at least claimed to like him. But be fit for the half of the season where our head coach seemingly didn't want to play him.

Can't see how that was beneficial.

 

[milo]

Seems very strange to me at least. And to be injured for the half of the season where we were actually playing good attacking football and where our head coach at least claimed to like him. But be fit for the half of the season where our head coach seemingly didn't want to play him.

Can't see how that was beneficial.

I think that it only works if you know that he would not have been successful during the time he was injured.

The impression that I get is that most sportsmen want the chance to prove themselves. I can think of very few who would choose to be injured over have a chance to show what they can do.

 

[Rossi22]

I can't beliece people are even trying to engage in a discussion with bonsaiboy....

Lamelas has 1 goal and 4 assists, not too bad, he's scored some absolute wordies too. He doesn't get everything right, but when he does he looks incredible. He did stunningly well to set up kane with an open goal which he fluffed. I wonder what bindaiboy would've been saying if that was the other way around... Hmmm....

It's pretty much his first season, how anyone can it ore the clear ability this guy has, coupled with how hard he works and tracks back, why wouldn't we all want to see him do well?

This is a bit rich given your views on the likes of Mason, Bentaleb, Kane, Rose, Townsed etc isn't it? Maybe BonsaiBoy just doesn't think that highly of Lamela the same way you don't of those mentioned.

 

[Bonsaiboy]

Wow. I wonder what your reaction would be if someone posted a video like that about Townsend or some other player you rate. Playing that well, scoring, setting up chances, linking up. Only for the poster to pick apart one specific moment like that.

Your body language analysis of how Chadli felt based on that one second of not even showing his face would be comparable to what people were claiming to know about Vertonghen last season, if not for being even more baseless.



The specific situation was not some obvious choice to make the way you make it seem. Not that dissimilar to the situation where he also goes down the outside (thought he couldn't do that) and sets up the massive chance for Kane and Eriksen. Choosing to get to the byline is a fine choice. Even if it wasn't nitpicking over it is ridiculous when these players are making these snap decisions in game.

You go on and on like a child missing his toy about Lamela's weaker foot. Have you noticed that no one is claiming that he can put in a quality cross with his right. I don't know if he can, I don't know if he will ever be able to. If that was your only claim then yes, you would be proven wrong if he whips in a quality cross with his right. It's not though, is it?

I'm not some Townsend fanboy and I probably think his future lies elsewhere as he's a little bit short of the quality we actually want. Like Lamela, if I wanted to show a video of his best moments I'd generally be showing a Europa league game, a lesser premier league team or a European national team of a country with a very low population.

As I said earlier I respect your opinions but, in my opinion, Lamela's complete inability to use his weaker foot makes him an unviable option as a wide player. If you analyse the problems Rose faced against Hazard the other night, it was the knowledge that Hazard could go both ways, most dangerous on his right of course but perfectly capable of finding a good pass or executing a good cross or shot with his left - take that danger away and he's half the player and much easier contain.

It's always one of the first things I look for in a player, particularly attacking ones, I noticed he never used his right foot in early games for us and went trawling through some his Roma videos and these confirmed he basically can't use it. I thought at first he used his right for the rabona goal and was disappointed when it turned out he hadn't. He should have taken the option to go to Barcelona as a kid as there's no way they'd have let him not develop his weaker foot to it's full potential.

Regarding Chadli's reaction, he could actually be just tying up his boot laces so fair enough on that point.

 

[braineclipse]

I'm not some Townsend fanboy and I probably think his future lies elsewhere as he's a little bit short of the quality we actually want. Like Lamela, if I wanted to show a video of his best moments I'd generally be showing a Europa league game, a lesser premier league team or a European national team of a country with a very low population.

As I said earlier I respect your opinions but, in my opinion, Lamela's complete inability to use his weaker foot makes him an unviable option as a wide player. If you analyse the problems Rose faced against Hazard the other night, it was the knowledge that Hazard could go both ways, most dangerous on his right of course but perfectly capable of finding a good pass or executing a good cross or shot with his left - take that danger away and he's half the player and much easier contain.

It's always one of the first things I look for in a player, particularly attacking ones, I noticed he never used his right foot in early games for us and went trawling through some his Roma videos and these confirmed he basically can't use it. I thought at first he used his right for the rabona goal and was disappointed when it turned out he hadn't. He should have taken the option to go to Barcelona as a kid as there's no way they'd have let him not develop his weaker foot to it's full potential.

Regarding Chadli's reaction, he could actually be just tying up his boot laces so fair enough on that point.

So comparing Lamela to world class players is fair when it's your standard of measurement? Yes. Most likely he will never be Hazard class. Really, is that the standard for our players to be good enough?

How often have you seen players like Silva and Mata swing in excellent crosses with their weaker foot? How about Bale? How about Bale at 21-22?

It's not like Lamela is useless with his right, put some perfectly adequate passes in with his right even in the video you posted. I just don't agree that being one footed is as limiting as you're saying. As has been pointed out repeatedly. At which point you claim that he's not intelligent enough as a footballer to do it. Then rinse and repeat you're back to ranting about his weaker foot a couple of days later as if the previous discussion never happened.

 

[africanspurs]

I doubt that if you gave him his time again Lamela would choose to be injured last year.

And?

if you gave him his chance again at the first half of the season i doubt he would choose to play as badly as he did.

either way it happened and IMO it was good for him to get a break from the scrutiny.

If we offered him a break from the constant pressure when things were not going well and his confidence was in the dumps then he would probably welcome the time to re-coup, re-group and re-focus his energies

 

[Bonsaiboy]

So comparing Lamela to world class players is fair when it's your standard of measurement? Yes. Most likely he will never be Hazard class. Really, is that the standard for our players to be good enough?

How often have you seen players like Silva and Mata swing in excellent crosses with their weaker foot? How about Bale? How about Bale at 21-22?

It's not like Lamela is useless with his right, put some perfectly adequate passes in with his right even in the video you posted. I just don't agree that being one footed is as limiting as you're saying. As has been pointed out repeatedly. At which point you claim that he's not intelligent enough as a footballer to do it. Then rinse and repeat you're back to ranting about his weaker foot a couple of days later as if the previous discussion never happened.

The Bale right foot discussion was had earlier, he scored plenty for us with his right. With regards Silva and Mata, it didn't take me long to find plenty of examples of them using their weaker foot to good effect, less so Mata and he's aware of this as a weakness, stating in an interview a year ago: "I've trained a lot on my right foot, to make it better. I've tried to improve – defending, attacking, pressing, trying to think before a game, to be more clever, do something before the defender can think of it, to become a better player. That makes me feel good, that hunger to improve in every way." Full interview here.

Regarding Hazard, he's an extremely right footed player and will often faint to use his left then use his right - he did this to Rose the other night and put him on the ground - but when absolutely forced to, he can come up with the goods and can shoot or cross with his left.

At 8.16 in the video below, you can see an example of this. He wants to go on his right, but the defender is clued up on him and forces him on to his left foot, effectively saying, "go on then, stick a cross in with your left if you can." and he does and it nearly leads to a goal. This is the exact way to defend against Lamela and I've seen no evidence that he would be able to come up with the goods. I live in hope though.

[video=youtube;ICehnzox39o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICehnzox39o[/video]

 

[africanspurs]

Seems very strange to me at least. And to be injured for the half of the season where we were actually playing good attacking football and where our head coach at least claimed to like him. But be fit for the half of the season where our head coach seemingly didn't want to play him.

Can't see how that was beneficial.

from what i am reading from your post above you have it the wrong way round and looking at it from the idea that he would have played well if he was fit. you dont know that at all, there isnt even the slightest inclination that this would have happened outside of the HOPE that sherwood's style would have helped him significantly

like i said, if you cant understand how a confidence ridden kid might not need an extended period off the spotlight after the first part of lamela's stay and the level of scrutiny and divisive polarised opinion then that's fair enough. Not that he is a young teen or nothing but i have assisted in coaching in teams where this was pretty much something that could happen. we never wanted to completely break someone as their form / confidence at the time could endure .... even a bad one

infact its so not strange to me that i find it strange that its really strange to other people...is that strange?

 

[braineclipse]

from what i am reading from your post above you have it the wrong way round and looking at it from the idea that he would have played well if he was fit. you dont know that at all, there isnt even the slightest inclination that this would have happened outside of the HOPE that sherwood's style would have helped him significantly

like i said, if you cant understand how a confidence ridden kid might not need an extended period off the spotlight after the first part of lamela's stay and the level of scrutiny and divisive polarised opinion then that's fair enough. Not that he is a young teen or nothing but i have assisted in coaching in teams where this was pretty much something that could happen. we never wanted to completely break someone as their form / confidence at the time could endure .... even a bad one

infact its so not strange to me that i find it strange that its really strange to other people...is that strange?

You seriously underestimate the kid I think.

He's faced some problems during his time here. Has he at any point this season looked like he's ready to give up, looked like his head has dropped and this is it? Or has he just kept working away, kept asking for the ball, kept trying to make stuff happen and kept his place under a manager that's very clearly demanding 100% in training and matches from his player?

He's better off now than he was half a year ago, because he's been getting games, he's adjusting, he's learning, he's settling in. I think he would have been better prepared for this season if those games had come in the second half of last season instead. I don't think he magically would have been much better, it's not just hope, I just think he would have done about as well as he has so far this season and been stronger for it. And thus better for us this season.

Not the slightest inclination that he would have played well? Nothing? Not his talent, not his good performances this season. Not the reasons Pochettino has kept him in the team for...

You were right. Agree to disagree...

 

[The egyptian]

Is he injured or just is been prepared for some thing?

 

[africanspurs]

You seriously underestimate the kid I think.

He's faced some problems during his time here. Has he at any point this season looked like he's ready to give up, looked like his head has dropped and this is it? Or has he just kept working away, kept asking for the ball, kept trying to make stuff happen and kept his place under a manager that's very clearly demanding 100% in training and matches from his player?

He's better off now than he was half a year ago, because he's been getting games, he's adjusting, he's learning, he's settling in. I think he would have been better prepared for this season if those games had come in the second half of last season instead. I don't think he magically would have been much better, it's not just hope, I just think he would have done about as well as he has so far this season and been stronger for it. And thus better for us this season.

Not the slightest inclination that he would have played well? Nothing? Not his talent, not his good performances this season. Not the reasons Pochettino has kept him in the team for...

You were right. Agree to disagree...

complete conjecture as to what he offers in training. assumptions based on stuff i have previously argued doesnt mean much as far as selection goes when chatting on a message board.

anything that has happened this season has happened after his time off ........ that is fact not hearsay. As far as he is concerned i am not into making as much assumptions and hopes etc. I have called many things wrong with regards to how i see a player coming along but i wouldnt change the methodology and training i have been given in that department...and from what i could see there was no clear indication at all that he was in a strong and visible upward curve that meant a simple change in coach would transform him...infact he did play under sherwood and his performance was either flat or flat with odd bits of positive to takie home or just bad as far as i remember

i dont have a time machine so no there isnt any evidence that he would turned a pretty poor all round season around if he didnt have the break he got , which he did and came back stronger this year incidentally.

i may underestimate him but there are reasons i am happy applying when doing so, i dont think he is mentally as tough as you do

Agree to disagree? definitely