Robbo
Paul Walsh
Yeah, but it would surprise me. If Lloris was our first choice goalie (which I'm sure he will be sooner rather than later), surely that would mean Friedel would start tonight.
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Hugo Lloris
- Thread starter charlietheyid
- Start date
Yeah, but it would surprise me. If Lloris was our first choice goalie (which I'm sure he will be sooner rather than later), surely that would mean Friedel would start tonight.
I am french and don't know who is Jean Daurat, but for me both Friedel and Lloris will get a 6 for their last game.
Again I think we are seeing it wrong, it is quiet simple, they train all week, best in training play. If Friedel is better then be it.
We, as fan and spectator, do not have to judge the choice of the coach, because appart from unsettling everybody and giving the press some ammo I really don't know what we are trying to do, we should stick behind our team.
What is your overall opinion of Lloris? Many of our fans seem to think he's world class, but to be honest I find it difficult to believe they've watched that much of France/Lyon and kept a particularly close on Lloris. So it would be interesting to hear from someone who has seen alot of him. His stats suggest he's just an average standard Premier League GK and certainly not among the very best in the world and not even Friedal. But obviously stats don't tell the whole story. Though he does have a low save percentage compared to other top class keeper and his distribution stats seem very poor. He actually made less accurate passes per game last season than Brad and many of our fans criticize Brads passing.
The only French guy I've spoken to said Lloris was nowhere near the best GK in Ligue 1. He said Mandana should be the French number 1. He said there was a reason Wenger never went for Lloris and that Man Utd could have signed him last season, but weren't interested. He went as far as saying Lloris would be our 3rd best keeper!
It sounds pretty worrying, but on the other hand I've read people on here claiming he's world class and is an upgrade on Friedal. I know stats aren't the be all and end all, but I just can't understand how he's let in so many goals and got a low save percentage over 3 seasons and be as good as many are making out. Surely playing for Lyon he can't have been that exposed to the point he was facing so many shots that he stood little chance. Over the course of one season, I could see an anomaly occurring in which he just has bad luck, but he hasn't reached the 75% save percentage in 3 years. Yet all the top GK's are usually over that mark.
Interesting stats, thanks.
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
100% agreed with this.
To be fair to those calling world class , what they are using is his CV as oppsed to what the have seen. its not hard to for someone to be wrongly judged based on an impressive CV.
But i agree with what you're saying 100%. in general most people calling him world class havent seen nearly enough of him and had a good look as to what he is all about
i could half imagine that if he was to have a bad game now that they vblame would fall squarely on AVB's shoulders
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
LOL LOL LOL LOL......denial and back tracking in its finest
africanspurs
Justin Edinburgh
Of course not , but it isnt like there havent been many calling him that..and by many i mean quite a few vocal people.
I'd seen a fair bit a Friedal and the odd game of Gomes before they signed, but to be honest it was only when they were playing for us week in week out that I was really aware of the standard. The only keeper outside of Spurs I've ever kept a close eye on is Pepe Reina and that was because his stats suggested he was nowhere near as good as was being made out and on close inspection the stats were right and his reputation was false. This season even Liverpool fans are admitting he isn't what he once was, rather than making excuses as they had for the 2 previous seasons.
I don't know anything about Lloris other than casual watching of France in tournaments and the CL game of Lyon. I can't see why many of our fans would be any different. I'm not saying he isn't a great GK, but I'm not at all convinced that he is simply because some message board posters say so. The stats do worry me though as with GK's that particular save % stats tends to give a great indication of their standard. It's not 100% reliable of course, but it would be very odd for an truly exceptional keeper not to have a high save percentage.
For example, for all the shots Brad faced last season, even those from when he didn't come for crosses, he saved 75%. Any GK who saves over 80% of shots has usually had an exceptional season (Gomes 2009/10). It's usually only 1 or 2 per season who achieve this. Sometimes none achieve it.
I don't know anything about Lloris other than casual watching of France in tournaments and the CL game of Lyon. I can't see why many of our fans would be any different. I'm not saying he isn't a great GK, but I'm not at all convinced that he is simply because some message board posters say so. The stats do worry me though as with GK's that particular save % stats tends to give a great indication of their standard. It's not 100% reliable of course, but it would be very odd for an truly exceptional keeper not to have a high save percentage.
For example, for all the shots Brad faced last season, even those from when he didn't come for crosses, he saved 75%. Any GK who saves over 80% of shots has usually had an exceptional season (Gomes 2009/10). It's usually only 1 or 2 per season who achieve this. Sometimes none achieve it.
I'm really not going to go through all the Spurs message boards, but I was reading this article 5 minutes ago and again he was described as world class:
http://hereisthecity.com/2012/09/14/take-note-avbfans-give-their-verdict-on-lloris-v-friedel/
I'm not saying he isn't as I haven't seen much of him. But at the same time I don't understand how people can state he is an improvement on Brad, unless they've been really following him closely. Did you honestly believe that many if any Spurs fans have watched Lloris and scrutinized his game in the same way we do with Brad each week? If so how come his stats are so out of kilter with an improvement on Brad? Is he just unlucky with his passing? Is he been insanely unlucky with the shots he's faced? Has brad only faced easy shots? What is going on? I don't know, as I've only seen Brad closely, so won't judge Lloris.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
Very interesting stats. Top read.
Brad will stay in goal till either he slacks off in training or makes mistakes consistently in games. AVB has to enable the lads to feel like they can earn themselves a place if they try hard enough, so there's no reason for him to drop Brad that quickly.
Where Lloris has the upper hand over him, though, is in his willingness to command his box. Brad stays rooted to his line more often than not, be it for corners, free-kicks or crosses. This does occasionally lead to unnecessary goals. From what I've seen of Lloris (not much, but still), he's much quicker at coming out for the ball and at rushing out to close down an attacker through on goal.
Lloris is rated very highly as a prospect. i think comparing him to brad at this stage isn't fair, simply because there is so much evidence that keepers peak in their mid to late 30s and perform consistently when they have played in the same place/with the same defense, for several years.
bottom line is brad friedel has been one of the best, most consistent and underrated keepers in the world over the past 10 years. when he still had youth on his side, he was also arguably the premier penalty stopper in the world (remember those WC saves anybody?)
i think there are two types of elite keepers that you could want at the club; the consistent ones that play within their limits, make the saves they should make and keep their defense focused (like friedel, shwartzer, reina) and the elite keepers that can control/win games (iker, czech in his prime, buffon) and the club see Lloris as having the athletic potential to become one of those elite goalkeepers. if you look at what happened to De Gea last season, he was clearly not physically/mentally ready for the league, and despite his obvious elite talent the errors he made during that first season might've affected his confidence and development over the long term. i think the club want to protect Lloris from that, in spite of himself, and when Friedel retires this will all be forgotten.
Interesting point, do you have a link for Lloris' stats from France?
Here is a table showing Premier League GK stats from last year for comparison: http://www.barriesview.com/2012/05/201112-premier-league-goalkeeper-stats
If we look at Sch%&()(#"ny, he's nowhere near the 75% mark, but on the other hand, only had 84 shots to deal with. The arse like to dominate possession so that makes sense. De Gea has the highest save percent average, but what really strikes me is that he played only 2610 minutes(29 games) but still had to make 102 saves!
For me, the whole Friedel vs. Lloris saga boils down to the fact that Friedel is obviously still a very good goalkeeper. However, there were instances last year when his lack of athleticism(age related I'm guessing) allowed goals. He simply can't reach some shots that a younger keeper would. His reactions are still tip-top, as witnessed during our first games this season, but my point still stands.
His distribution is obviously nowhere near good enough, and with the football we're trying to play, especially with Defoe up top, it won't do. Naturally the rest of the team comes into play, but against QPR there were numerous times when our center halves or Sandro made themselves available but Brad instead kicked it long.
Lastly, it's dealing with crosses. This also relates to his lack of athleticism and for me I always want a sure keeper who commands the area well and can come out to deal with crosses and corners.
That being said, Brad has his faults but is still a very good keeper. Lloris undoubtedly has his faults too(haven't watched him enough to make the judgment) but is also a very good keeper. They'll simply fight it out in training and may the better man win. For me, we're good either way, but the given Brad's age the change will come sooner rather than later.
I
indianspur
Guest
not a chance that Lloris wont be playing???
wrong
i admire your general optimism though.
I
indianspur
Guest
so its Friedel in the Prem, Lloris in Europe, Cudicini in the league cup, and probably Gomes in the FA cup
only Tottenham, only Tottenham8-[
only Tottenham, only Tottenham8-[
GrimsbyYid
Gus Poyet
This is absolute disaster in the making. There is no positive spin on this unless he is injured. If we're not playing him then its stupid were not giving him as much game time as possible. And could tinkle hi off even more. If he's refusing to play he's a **** and will tinkle the staff and fans before he's even started.
This is just a disaster waiting to happen.
And what's going on with ade?another fall out from a guy who's not happy playing second fiddle?
Just feel this new phase is fudging doomed from media, fans, and even potentially the players slowly but surely.
I wish people would stop being utter ****s.
This is just a disaster waiting to happen.
And what's going on with ade?another fall out from a guy who's not happy playing second fiddle?
Just feel this new phase is fudging doomed from media, fans, and even potentially the players slowly but surely.
I wish people would stop being utter ****s.
NaijaSpurs
Les Ferdinand
If I were Lloris and I am fit this evening I would be well hacked off. It is one thing to not being playing in the league because Friedel is playing well but to not play in all the Cup games, well I would be fudged. And yes I would rock the boat.
Leeds Spur
Banned
Lloris is in Paris.
He's probably not gutted not to be in Carlisle.
He's probably not gutted not to be in Carlisle.
Leeds Spur
Banned
Calm down dear
Kingdawson
Banned
You're my GG hero.