What would your response be if someone who occasionally shops at one of those businesses told you to invest large chunks of your other capital so that they could buy your widgets cheaper?
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Daniel Levy - Chairman
- Thread starter Howard Webb
- Start date
ricky2tricky4city
Steffen Freund
It depends whether you're suggesting that spending on other areas of the business are without the goal of helping the club and team in the long run? Spending on the team has suffered (probably more correctly called, managed) because of these long term goals.
The debate generally revolves around fans thinking that we are not spending 'on purpose' and 'not backing the manager' as though funds are not an issue, while having zero awareness, detail or understanding of the limit of those funds. It's never enough, for some.
Granted within the deployment of said limited funds, there are valid arguments we could scout better, spend better, sell better, for sure.
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
It wasn't the most pleasant place to be back then either, ignoring the fact that I can't stand them as a club (though I literally didn't know a single Chelsea fan back then growing up in Walthamstow... It was probably 60% Spurs, 25% Arsenal 10% West Ham with the usual smattering of glory hunting Liverpool fans (typically the kids of Asian heritage who's Dad's weren't really interested in football).
Weirdly enough pretty much the only club in London who didn't come in for me at any stage was Spurs.... I never even had a trial at the club, which absolutely killed both my Dad and I as it was obviously the one that the two of us wanted me to play for the most. I would've even taken just one single reserve game so I had some pictures of me playing in a 'real' Spurs shirt. Perhaps it was lucky though as I would never have turned down a contract at Spurs and then would've likely have just shuffled down to whatever tier I'd found my level at playing football for (not really much of) a living.
I ended up playing semi-pro football to help pay my way through Uni but stopped when I couldn't combine such long hours at work with training for football.
Bedfordspurs
Vinnie Samways
Work getting in the way of football
The way of the real man
parklane1
Tony Galvin
Great post and sums up our situation at this time imo.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
I think we largely agree…to be discussed on Sunday! Where we might differ is in why we adopt the model we do team-wise, and if this model will shift post-covid income?
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
So, the impending Saudi Sportswashing Machine takeover is an interesting case-study of a broader general trend. Whether in the Prem or the Championship, ambitious owners generally picked cheaper sides to buy, with the understanding that the low purchase price affords them more space for on- field investments. In the PL, the Emiratis chose City over United for that reason, Moshiri and Usmanov chose Everton over Arsenal for that reason, and Leicester and Villa's owners chose those clubs in the Championship for that reason.
The murderous Saudis have picked Saudi Sportswashing Machine for that reason. 300m purchase price + 500m or 1bn in on-field investments is still cheaper than buying, say, Arsenal at 1.5b or Spurs at Levy's reported price of 3b.
Now, we'll get left further behind, again. But then, that is inevitable under the useless deadweight chancers with no connection to the club that we've had at the top for twenty grinding years. But that isn't the thing I'm interested in.
My hope, as ever, is that one day these people leave and we can dream. But the high purchase price quoted means that is less likely to happen. So is it thr case now that the richest owners skip the 'top six' clubs and try their hand at the cheaper ones outside that grouping first?
I doubt the train will end with the Saudis - PL sportswashing is too easy and too appealing. The question is, where will the next megabuyer emerge?
The murderous Saudis have picked Saudi Sportswashing Machine for that reason. 300m purchase price + 500m or 1bn in on-field investments is still cheaper than buying, say, Arsenal at 1.5b or Spurs at Levy's reported price of 3b.
Now, we'll get left further behind, again. But then, that is inevitable under the useless deadweight chancers with no connection to the club that we've had at the top for twenty grinding years. But that isn't the thing I'm interested in.
My hope, as ever, is that one day these people leave and we can dream. But the high purchase price quoted means that is less likely to happen. So is it thr case now that the richest owners skip the 'top six' clubs and try their hand at the cheaper ones outside that grouping first?
I doubt the train will end with the Saudis - PL sportswashing is too easy and too appealing. The question is, where will the next megabuyer emerge?
Bedfordspurs
Vinnie Samways
Who realistically next needs sport watching
North Korea?
I agree with most of what your saying
We’re too expensive for anyone to invest in at the “value” out owners have put in the club
I’m amazed someone hasn’t brought Leeds for that reason
Bristol too as their catchments are massive
London in reality won’t have a super club very soon just super stadiums and mugged off fans
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
Lots of places. Fact is, basically anywhere that sees massive wealth growth over the next half-century will see the rise of unscrupulous billionaires who need reputation-laundering. In most of those places, the capitalism that will see that income growth will also be brutal, barely regulated, uneven and often violent - much like 19th-century European and American capitalism when our societies were at that stage. In some cases, that will mean the governments involved will seek to sportswash their image (Visit Rwanda, for instance), and in others, billionaires will escape their countries and become real estate hoarders in the UK while buying clubs to launder their image.
So, take your pick. African billionaires and regimes, would be my bet - along with Indian billionaires, since Venky's were utterly small fry in comparison to some of their billionaires now (Adani, Ambani et al). The demand won't end, imo. Possibly Chinese billionaires again, post-Xi if the next chairman reverses some of the domestic curbs and reforms he's made.
I agree with you that London clubs will miss the train, though - at least, us, Arsenal and probably Spam. Brentford, Palace and the like might still be bought out, but we're probably brick out of luck with this lot we have clinging on.
Still, even if they sell to another lot just like them, it will be change, at least - and maybe the next lot will hire a better chairman with more of an understanding of on-pitch footballing growth? Who knows.
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
West Ham would be the perfect club to buy in London for sportswashing.... Their owners would probably sell for <£500m, they have advantage of London location, big stadium already there and decent fan base.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
True, but only if their owners are willing to sell for <500m. And I get the feeling the dildo twins want more - otherwise surely they'd have sold already, to Moshiri or the Saudis.
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
There were penalties in place in the few several years after they moved to the Olympic stadium. I think those have now expired.
I get why the Saudi's were interested in Saudi Sportswashing Machine.... A team like them in a one club city is likely to be more attractive than the 4th most popular London club. Next on the list though could be West Ham who have a location advantage over many other clubs, while being a lot cheaper than Spurs, Arsenal or Chelsea.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
Fair enough! Re: Toon's catchment area, agreed - I think @Bedfordspurs is also spot on re: Leeds' catchment area, and I'd wager they're probably close to the top for the next buyout.
Finney Is Back
Luka Modric
Radizzani is worth about the same as Joe Lewis so may be another who doesn't want to sell for anything other than a big number.
mephitis
Niko Kranjcar
Apparently not....
https://www.leeds-live.co.uk/sport/...Saudi Sportswashing Machine-takeover-21708774
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
True in part, but I also think there's a real estate angle to it. Being the owners of the sole PL football club in a city probably affords them all sorts of local exposure that probably eases the wheels of a lot of real estate investment in the UK, and in those areas specifically. For that, local catchment matters. the Abu Dhabi Investment Group put aside 1bn for real estate development in Manchester a while ago, nearly as much as they've put into City since 2008 - I have no doubt the Saudis will follow that model for Saudi Sportswashing Machine.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
Is he? I thought he wasn't even a billionaire - his net worth including Leeds was something like 500m/600m, wasn't it?
Bedfordspurs
Vinnie Samways
100%
They will now attempt to finish the stadium at Saudi Sportswashing Machine and probably build a hospital to do it (the ground is half high, half low because of the hospital)
Then they can claim new £££ and as a one club city people will go
Bedfordspurs
Vinnie Samways
Spam would be a great buy for someone
Renting the stadium is no different to city
I wonder if the London thing actually puts people off
London as a place I’d loved and hated in equal measure and is almost a country in its own rights
but as we have discussed before no one is buying us For the silly money we value ourselves at
and without investment fans won’t go as much as the team will become inferior (seen that already this season)
So the income drops and the club then has less to spend but ultimately becomes less valuable