Daniel Levy - Chairman

[Spur of the moment]

Why would it be a disaster ?
Our model is TV money driven with the stadium the icing on the cake and a differentiator
As long as TV money is incoming we’re fine

TV money is dependent on games being played. Games being played is dependent on the virus being under control. My point was none of us knows when that will be.

For sure everyone's hoping that football will be back to normal by say, August / September at the latest, but what we're now hearing is that even by then a contact sport like football could yet be deemed too risky.

Following the resumption it could take just one successful court case where a family claims the life of a loved one was lost as a result of playing to bring the whole of football to a halt once again. Never mind the fear of £ms in compensation, the PR fall-out alone would probably prove too much for the sport to carry on regardless.

So I repeat, it's way too soon to count any chickens.

 

[Baleforce]

that they have gone for Saudi Sportswashing Machine intrigues me, if they have that much cash why not go for a more storied club in a better area?

part of the attraction of City to Mansour was that United were already there, a rivalry with one of the biggest clubs in the world could be played up to instantly, Abramovich chose Chelsea because of the postcode

there are loads of clubs closer to London with the stature of Saudi Sportswashing Machine which could also have been purchased, Forest, Derby, Ipswich for example

 

[Bedfordspurs]

that they have gone for Saudi Sportswashing Machine intrigues me, if they have that much cash why not go for a more storied club in a better area?

part of the attraction of City to Mansour was that United were already there, a rivalry with one of the biggest clubs in the world could be played up to instantly, Abramovich chose Chelsea because of the postcode

there are loads of clubs closer to London with the stature of Saudi Sportswashing Machine which could also have been purchased, Forest, Derby, Ipswich for example

Availability
And access to fans who are desperate for a change so would accept their money

lots of other clubs may have said no

 

[Bedfordspurs]

That is quite interesting. Something to consider though is that our figure is inflated due to the record income last year (from reaching CL final. Remove the £90 million difference between that and (probably) no European football next year and the valuation number is likely fluctuate quite a bit (especially as the wage to turnover ratio 'W' value at the end would also rise. Arsenal would lose their Europa revenue of £30 million and see the W value worsen. Chelsea would gain probably 40 to 50 million of CL revenue compared to their Europa win and improve the 'W' ratio. It would be good to see the actual figures numbers behind each letter.

It still could be a disaster with us now having £650 million of stadium debt. Of course with interest rates at a record low this isn't of great concern. I do have a fear that the only way countries around the world will be able to pay the huge amount of debt that is taken on as a result of covid will be to inflate it away and that would mean some serious interest rate rises - but that's for another discussion (probably on a non football forum). Another potential issue that could be on the horizon (irrespective of interest rates) is the potential for our corporate revenue to fall quite significantly due to the forthcoming pretty deep recession.

Companies will still spend on entertainment
More so than ever IMO to try to maintain the status quo
I’ve worked in procurement and commercial for 25 years and I’ve never ever seen companies that are successful cut back on anything like that as it’s an ego trip for them
Advertising may get cut as theirs always a debate on its effectiveness and there’s so many mediums now but it’s not the case with entertainment

And I’m sure our debt is fixed and secured long term at agreed rates which may benefit us if things change as it’s international sourced so not linked to a UK rate for example

 

[Bedfordspurs]

That is quite interesting. Something to consider though is that our figure is inflated due to the record income last year (from reaching CL final. Remove the £90 million difference between that and (probably) no European football next year and the valuation number is likely fluctuate quite a bit (especially as the wage to turnover ratio 'W' value at the end would also rise. Arsenal would lose their Europa revenue of £30 million and see the W value worsen. Chelsea would gain probably 40 to 50 million of CL revenue compared to their Europa win and improve the 'W' ratio. It would be good to see the actual figures numbers behind each letter.

It still could be a disaster with us now having £650 million of stadium debt. Of course with interest rates at a record low this isn't of great concern. I do have a fear that the only way countries around the world will be able to pay the huge amount of debt that is taken on as a result of covid will be to inflate it away and that would mean some serious interest rate rises - but that's for another discussion (probably on a non football forum). Another potential issue that could be on the horizon (irrespective of interest rates) is the potential for our corporate revenue to fall quite significantly due to the forthcoming pretty deep recession.

The league will find a way to play as it’s the only way for them to get £££ and that’s all that matters to most clubs
They will not wait for tried and tested methods they will push on

 

[Baleforce]

Availability
And access to fans who are desperate for a change so would accept their money

lots of other clubs may have said no

yeah I'm sure availability is a part of it, I wonder who has said no already

 

[Bedfordspurs]

yeah I'm sure availability is a part of it, I wonder who has said no already

Well it’s all being led by Stavely so pass
Problem is any club worth buying is too expensive for them to Chuck money at or too low down for them to hide the money
You buy a Sheffield Wednesday for example it’s a longer term thing to get them up
Saudi Sportswashing Machine are in the prem and in some people’s eyes only need a couple of hundred £M to improve a lot

 

[Finney Is Back]

Companies will still spend on entertainment
More so than ever IMO to try to maintain the status quo
I’ve worked in procurement and commercial for 25 years and I’ve never ever seen companies that are successful cut back on anything like that as it’s an ego trip for them
Advertising may get cut as theirs always a debate on its effectiveness and there’s so many mediums now but it’s not the case with entertainment

And I’m sure our debt is fixed and secured long term at agreed rates which may benefit us if things change as it’s international sourced so not linked to a UK rate for example

First things to go in a recession are the entertainment budgets. Next thing is usually the advertising and sponsorship budgets.

Our debt is set over a mixture of terms apparently. It won't just be the UK that are in financial trouble as a result of covid. The US could be in even more trouble than the European countries. As I said before, it wouldn't surprise me to see countries in general choose to inflate away their debt and that would mean significantly increased interest rates.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

First things to go in a recession are the entertainment budgets. Next thing is usually the advertising and sponsorship budgets.

Our debt is set over a mixture of terms apparently. It won't just be the UK that are in financial trouble as a result of covid. The US could be in even more trouble than the European countries. As I said before, it wouldn't surprise me to see countries in general choose to inflate away their debt and that would mean significantly increased interest rates.

I’ve seen the exact opposite on the spending front
It’s just what gets talked about by industry but most companies use it as an opportunity to grow
Yeah can see interest rates going up but that won’t affect our debt which is good

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

First things to go in a recession are the entertainment budgets. Next thing is usually the advertising and sponsorship budgets.

Our debt is set over a mixture of terms apparently. It won't just be the UK that are in financial trouble as a result of covid. The US could be in even more trouble than the European countries. As I said before, it wouldn't surprise me to see countries in general choose to inflate away their debt and that would mean significantly increased interest rates.

Due to the all encompassing nature of this issue and the mind blowing monetary numbers most countries are facing, a debt jubilee would not surprise me.

 

[Finney Is Back]

I’ve seen the exact opposite on the spending front
It’s just what gets talked about by industry but most companies use it as an opportunity to grow
Yeah can see interest rates going up but that won’t affect our debt which is good

Sorry but that is rubbish.... 'Most' companies cannot grow in a deep recession. The few that can realise that they don't have anywhere near as much competition and can therefore get way more bang for their buck in terms of entertainment and sponsorship so will squeeze deals far harder in that buyers market. Sit with any CFO at pretty much any large company who is about to see it's revenue and profit tank and an incredibly uncertain long term future and you'll always get the same answer as for what budget can be slashed immediately (unless contractual terms do not allow that).

You make an assumption there that Levy's plan is/was to pay off capital and interest. Many business models involve just restructuring the debt. Obviously I have no idea what the plans are but if the latter than it would absolutely affect our debt.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Sorry but that is rubbish.... 'Most' companies cannot grow in a deep recession. The few that can realise that they don't have anywhere near as much competition and can therefore get way more bang for their buck in terms of entertainment and sponsorship so will squeeze deals far harder in that buyers market. Sit with any CFO at pretty much any large company who is about to see it's revenue and profit tank and an incredibly uncertain long term future and you'll always get the same answer as for what budget can be slashed immediately (unless contractual terms do not allow that).

You make an assumption there that Levy's plan is/was to pay off capital and interest. Many business models involve just restructuring the debt. Obviously I have no idea what the plans are but if the latter than it would absolutely affect our debt.

I do meet many CFOs and CEOs
It’s my job
I work in procurement and commercial as I’ve said many time for big companies so I do check on companies
I don’t typically work for companies that turn over less than a £B but I meet many that do .. it’s nearly always at corporate events and I’ve done it for 25 years
I’m actually very good at it which is why I get approached by so many customer and o work for myself ... the only caveat I’d say is I’ve never lived through a potential recession on the scale we will see
But I do know that it’s also the time when companies and people innovate the most so things may not be as bad as some people expect

 

[scaramanga]

That is quite interesting. Something to consider though is that our figure is inflated due to the record income last year (from reaching CL final. Remove the £90 million difference between that and (probably) no European football next year and the valuation number is likely fluctuate quite a bit (especially as the wage to turnover ratio 'W' value at the end would also rise. Arsenal would lose their Europa revenue of £30 million and see the W value worsen. Chelsea would gain probably 40 to 50 million of CL revenue compared to their Europa win and improve the 'W' ratio. It would be good to see the actual figures numbers behind each letter.

It still could be a disaster with us now having £650 million of stadium debt. Of course with interest rates at a record low this isn't of great concern. I do have a fear that the only way countries around the world will be able to pay the huge amount of debt that is taken on as a result of covid will be to inflate it away and that would mean some serious interest rate rises - but that's for another discussion (probably on a non football forum). Another potential issue that could be on the horizon (irrespective of interest rates) is the potential for our corporate revenue to fall quite significantly due to the forthcoming pretty deep recession.

You're certainly right now your last paragraph. First thing we cut when one of our branches was struggling was corporate tickets.

 

[Diamond Lights]

Just wanted to bump this back again rather than starting a new thread.

That CL run was the greatest thing to happen in many of our lifetimes, and likely ever will be. Levy's priority is, and always will be ENIC.

Yes we have a shiny new stadium, that wasn't built for the fans, it was built for ENIC.

It was built for AJ to box there, the NFL to play there, it was not built to fund THFC.

We have the lowest (by a substantial way) wage to turnover ratio. We are not run to be successful, we are run to extrapolate the most amount of money feasible.

 

[parklane1]

Just wanted to bump this back again rather than starting a new thread.

That CL run was the greatest thing to happen in many of our lifetimes, and likely ever will be. Levy's priority is, and always will be ENIC.

Yes we have a shiny new stadium, that wasn't built for the fans, it was built for ENIC.

It was built for AJ to box there, the NFL to play there, it was not built to fund THFC.

We have the lowest (by a substantial way) wage to turnover ratio. We are not run to be successful, we are run to extrapolate the most amount of money feasible.

ZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[StephenH]

Just wanted to bump this back again rather than starting a new thread.

That CL run was the greatest thing to happen in many of our lifetimes, and likely ever will be. Levy's priority is, and always will be ENIC.

Yes we have a shiny new stadium, that wasn't built for the fans, it was built for ENIC.

It was built for AJ to box there, the NFL to play there, it was not built to fund THFC.

We have the lowest (by a substantial way) wage to turnover ratio. We are not run to be successful, we are run to extrapolate the most amount of money feasible.

Sorry, Mr your so wrong. ENIC want success. No exclusions they are all revenue streams.
AJ, NFL and all the other stuff = income which builds profit for all concerned, most definitely not at the expense of Tottenham Hotspurs FC.

 

[Diamond Lights]

Sorry, Mr your so wrong. ENIC want success. No exclusions they are all revenue streams.
AJ, NFL and all the other stuff = income which builds profit for all concerned, most definitely not at the expense of Tottenham Hotspurs FC.

How do you build success with the lowest wage to turnover ratio in the league by an incredibly susbstantial margin?

Every PL club runs on a minimum of nearly 50% wages to turnover, Tottenham's is 39%? So how's all this funding we receive improving THFC?

We were running such low expenditure years before the stadium build, during the build, and now after. Even Arsenal still managed transfers during this time. Why can't we?

 

[Lemonade Money]

Just wanted to bump this back again rather than starting a new thread.

That CL run was the greatest thing to happen in many of our lifetimes, and likely ever will be. Levy's priority is, and always will be ENIC.

Yes we have a shiny new stadium, that wasn't built for the fans, it was built for ENIC.

It was built for AJ to box there, the NFL to play there, it was not built to fund THFC.

We have the lowest (by a substantial way) wage to turnover ratio. We are not run to be successful, we are run to extrapolate the most amount of money feasible.

Bore off

 

[Baleforce]

How do you build success with the lowest wage to turnover ratio in the league by an incredibly susbstantial margin?

Every PL club runs on a minimum of nearly 50% wages to turnover, Tottenham's is 39%? So how's all this funding we receive improving THFC?

We were running such low expenditure years before the stadium build, during the build, and now after. Even Arsenal still managed transfers during this time. Why can't we?

Better ROI

 

[milo]

How do you build success with the lowest wage to turnover ratio in the league by an incredibly susbstantial margin?

Every PL club runs on a minimum of nearly 50% wages to turnover, Tottenham's is 39%? So how's all this funding we receive improving THFC?

We were running such low expenditure years before the stadium build, during the build, and now after. Even Arsenal still managed transfers during this time. Why can't we?

If the club was less well run, the debt that we've taken on to pay for the stadium would be costing us a lot more. ENIC's payday comes when they sell the club, the way that they maximise their return there is to leave us in a healthy position both on the pitch and off it.