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Coronavirus

glorygloryeze said:
Interesting. I'd love to see this person go up against some specialist Biologists, Cardiologists and Immunologists who seem to be speaking about the coronavirus spike proteins and the mechanism of infection (and vaccination) so there can be a proper scientific discussion/debate.

A media agency was caught out advertising to train non-doctors to actually post information on Social Media platforms such as TikTok as though they were actual doctors...i know there's an information war going on but that's quite scary...
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You can find out how credible she is within .5 seconds of a search. You can do the same with discrediting the tiny minority of anti-logic and vax individuals in the same field

I’m currently on a job for a very large search engine company, the subject matter is combating misinformation on the internet. It is very scary indeed.
 
AuroRaman said:
You can find out how credible she is within .5 seconds of a search. You can do the same with discrediting the tiny minority of anti-logic and vax individuals in the same field

I’m currently on a job for a very large search engine company, the subject matter is combating misinformation on the internet. It is very scary indeed.
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Misinformation is indeed very scary...especially if it eventually kills. That's why a bigger, broader and more open scientific debate is a must.
Lots of eminent doctors starting to warn about spike proteins...
 
glorygloryeze said:
Misinformation is indeed very scary...especially if it eventually kills. That's why a bigger, broader and more open scientific debate is a must.
Lots of eminent doctors starting to warn about spike proteins...
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What do you mean they are warning about spike proteins? The spike protein is just the part of the virus that attaches to the cell.
 
Lilbaz said:
What do you mean they are warning about spike proteins? The spike protein is just the part of the virus that attaches to the cell.
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They are saying that the spike proteins in the vaccine (and the mechanism that the vaccine has for making recipients create spike proteins in the body so that the body makes antibodies to the spike proteins) is causing problems...
 
glorygloryeze said:
They are saying that the spike proteins in the vaccine (and the mechanism that the vaccine has for making recipients create spike proteins in the body so that the body makes antibodies to the spike proteins) is causing problems...
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Are you talking about the waning efficacy of the vaccines? The mrha vaccines cause the body to recognise the spike protein. When the body does so, anti bodies attach to the spike preventing it from being able to attach to a cell and infect it.

Anti bodies are short lived. T cells give long term immunity (people infected with sars covid 1 still have immunity now, 18 years later). The mrna vaccines don't provoke as much a production of tcells as astra zeneca does. So although pfizer and moderna give better protection at the beginning az soon takes over. The Sputnik vaccine i believe is basically a dead virus so should make the body produce even more tcells. Oxford university is looking at combining az and sputnik. You also have the novavax which is a plant based vaccine which we'll have to see.

Basically if you have been vaccinated and been exposed to the virus you will have very good immunity that will last.

There is worry that the spike may mutate so that the bodies immunity given by the vaccines doesn't recognise it. Not happened so far though. Killer tcells destroy infected cells so are less reliant on recognising the spike protein.
 
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Lilbaz said:
Are you talking about the waning efficacy of the vaccines? The mrha vaccines cause the body to recognise the spike protein. When the body does so, anti bodies attach to the spike preventing it from being able to attach to a cell and infect it.

Anti bodies are short lived. T cells give long term immunity (people infected with sars covid 1 still have immunity now, 18 years later). The mrna vaccines don't provoke as much a production of tcells as astra zeneca does. So although pfizer and moderna give better protection at the beginning az soon takes over. The Sputnik vaccine i believe is basically a dead virus so should make the body produce even more tcells. Oxford university is looking at combining az and sputnik. You also have the novavax which is a plant based vaccine which we'll have to see.

Basically if you have been vaccinated and been exposed to the virus you will have very good immunity that will last.

There is worry that the spike may mutate so that the bodies immunity given by the vaccines doesn't recognise it. Not happened so far though. Killer tcells destroy infected cells so are less reliant on recognising the spike protein.
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Not neccesarily. I'm talking about how the body's 'factory' for producing the spike proteins and the resultant antibodies would be intended to stay in one site in the body, the arm. However, what seems to be the issue is that the spikes (and the spike 'factory') are instead travelling throughout the body causing spikes to be generated in various key organs, such as the kidneys, heart as well as the blood stream and the blood-brain barrier leading to such phenomena as cytokline storm, antibody dependent enhancement whereby the body attacks the actual body's cells as though they are themselves toxic (much in the same way that coronavirus spikes caught naturally would have). The spikes are apparently causing blood flow issues hence perhaps the reasons for the increase in strokes, blood clots, heart attacks etc.

I'm pretty sure there have been some issues in (relatively) young sports starts because of this too.

I'll try and find the relevant videos/interviews but the various doctors raising this alarm should be part of an open scientific debate given that these vaccines were initially touted as being 'just for the most vulnerable' and are now being effectively pushed on everyone. Risks need to be investigated and published fully
 
glorygloryeze said:
Not neccesarily. I'm talking about how the body's 'factory' for producing the spike proteins and the resultant antibodies would be intended to stay in one site in the body, the arm. However, what seems to be the issue is that the spikes (and the spike 'factory') are instead travelling throughout the body causing spikes to be generated in various key organs, such as the kidneys, heart as well as the blood stream and the blood-brain barrier leading to such phenomena as cytokline storm, antibody dependent enhancement whereby the body attacks the actual body's cells as though they are themselves toxic (much in the same way that coronavirus spikes caught naturally would have). The spikes are apparently causing blood flow issues hence perhaps the reasons for the increase in strokes, blood clots, heart attacks etc.

I'm pretty sure there have been some issues in (relatively) young sports starts because of this too.

I'll try and find the relevant videos/interviews but the various doctors raising this alarm should be part of an open scientific debate given that these vaccines were initially touted as being 'just for the most vulnerable' and are now being effectively pushed on everyone. Risks need to be investigated and published fully
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The body doesn't produce spike proteins. The vaccines introduce spike proteins or something resembling the protein so the bodys immune system recognises it. The body then produces tcells. One type of tcell produces antibodies another type attacks infected cells.

Again the spike protein is a part of the virus that attaches to a cell. It can't replicate on it's own. Consider it like the viruses arm.
 
Lilbaz said:
The body doesn't produce spike proteins. The vaccines introduce spike proteins or something resembling the protein so the bodys immune system recognises it. The body then produces tcells. One type of tcell produces antibodies another type attacks infected cells.

Again the spike protein is a part of the virus that attaches to a cell. It can't replicate on it's own. Consider it like the viruses arm.
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Yes, i know this. But the vaccine induces the body to produce these type spike proteins so as to 'trick' the body to create antibodies to it. That's the way it's intended to work.
However, these scientists are saying what is actually happening for many is more than that and ultimately there is no 'off switch' for the spike production process... i'll try and find the information later the scientists/doctors explain it more thoroughly
 
glorygloryeze said:
Yes, i know this. But the vaccine induces the body to produce these type spike proteins so as to 'trick' the body to create antibodies to it. That's the way it's intended to work.
However, these scientists are saying what is actually happening for many is more than that and ultimately there is no 'off switch' for the spike production process... i'll try and find the information later the scientists/doctors explain it more thoroughly
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Cheers.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Yes, i know this. But the vaccine induces the body to produce these type spike proteins so as to 'trick' the body to create antibodies to it. That's the way it's intended to work.
However, these scientists are saying what is actually happening for many is more than that and ultimately there is no 'off switch' for the spike production process... i'll try and find the information later the scientists/doctors explain it more thoroughly
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I smell internet flimflam.
 
glorygloryeze said:
Not neccesarily. I'm talking about how the body's 'factory' for producing the spike proteins and the resultant antibodies would be intended to stay in one site in the body, the arm. However, what seems to be the issue is that the spikes (and the spike 'factory') are instead travelling throughout the body causing spikes to be generated in various key organs, such as the kidneys, heart as well as the blood stream and the blood-brain barrier leading to such phenomena as cytokline storm, antibody dependent enhancement whereby the body attacks the actual body's cells as though they are themselves toxic (much in the same way that coronavirus spikes caught naturally would have). The spikes are apparently causing blood flow issues hence perhaps the reasons for the increase in strokes, blood clots, heart attacks etc.

I'm pretty sure there have been some issues in (relatively) young sports starts because of this too.

I'll try and find the relevant videos/interviews but the various doctors raising this alarm should be part of an open scientific debate given that these vaccines were initially touted as being 'just for the most vulnerable' and are now being effectively pushed on everyone. Risks need to be investigated and published fully
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You shouldn't post speculation* like this in a public forum without presenting the full information from the scientists** spreading this information***.





*lies
**liars
***fear
 
More to the point why bother trying to tell us vaccines are dangerous when we all had them months and months ago.

If you are scared to take it fine. Just stop winding everyone else up.
 
johnola said:
Isn’t the problem here that parliamentarians have access to information not available to the wider public?
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No. The problem is a fudging idiot mp who wants to bring back the death penalty and conscription, got elected.
 
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Lilbaz said:
No. The problem is a fudging idiot mp who wants to bring back the death penalty and conscription, got elected.
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Peddling falsehoods about a life saving vaccine I'd agree with the idiotic part, but for the death penalty and national conscription again I'd need a lot more convincing tbh. Technology puts us in a far far better place for the former and the latter might sort out some of the bloody problems with the youth these days, a bit of structure and discipline never hurts.
 
Trixster said:
Peddling falsehoods about a life saving vaccine I'd agree with the idiotic part, but for the death penalty and national conscription again I'd need a lot more convincing tbh. Technology puts us in a far far better place for the former and the latter might sort out some of the bloody problems with the youth these days, a bit of structure and discipline never hurts.
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I'd be ok with conscription if there were a benefit to society calculation involved.

Those that are likely to attend college and university (real courses, not Sports Science or Business Management) should be exempt - they're far more useful to society getting their education.

Conscript the manual labour types though.
 
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