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Bale. Could we? Would we? Should we?

Ade's folks are ok really said:
I'd love to see a Bale return, but the question I haven't seen answered yet is where people think he'll play?? For that kind of money / wage / stature, he's not going to be on the bench. So does that push Son back to a sub role (seems harsh)? Moura even further down the pecking order?

I guess at least he offers us a back up striker role!
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Left back :) I think he'd rotate with Kane and Son.

But lets face it, the most likely UK destination is united. Progba going the other way.
 
Ade's folks are ok really said:
I'd love to see a Bale return, but the question I haven't seen answered yet is where people think he'll play?? For that kind of money / wage / stature, he's not going to be on the bench. So does that push Son back to a sub role (seems harsh)? Moura even further down the pecking order?

I guess at least he offers us a back up striker role!
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I would assume off the right. Son plays best off the left. Kane through the middle.

Pushes Moura down the order, and raises questions for Alli and Eriksen.
 
billyiddo said:
Kane
Son Alli Bale
Ndombele Lo Celso​
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I've gone off the idea of Bale over the last 12 months, but I'd have to say that attack and midfield would put fear into any team. You'd have Winks, Moura, Dier, Lamela and Sissoko to supplement, maybe even Eriksen if he stays.

If we could defend better collectively this season you'd have to say that we'd have a great chance of winning a trophy.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Of course its dumb luck, but when a player is out for frequently long periods you stack the odds against you, dont you?

12/13 - Started 33 of 38 = 87%
13/14 - 24 of 38 = 63%
14/15 - 30 = 79%
15/16 - 21 = 55%
16/17 - 17 = 45%
17/18 - 20 = 53%
18/19 - 21 = 55%

So my memory does serve me well enough. I counted starts because sub appearances could be anything, a few seconds and no more. A start is when you are prime to play.
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We're talking fitness here and, if you're fit to be on the bench and come in as a sub, well... you're fit. Beginning to redefine what it means to be fit when you're starting vs when you're coming off the bench is just trying to twist yourself into a pretzel to make the facts fit your narrative.
 
alekaras said:
We're talking fitness here and, if you're fit to be on the bench and come in as a sub, well... you're fit. Beginning to redefine what it means to be fit when you're starting vs when you're coming off the bench is just trying to twist yourself into a pretzel to make the facts fit your narrative.
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Its not twisting things at all.

Being a sub is not necessarily the same as being fit at all, as well you should know.

We often here tales of a player only being good for X minutes while recovering fitness, for example. Where a sub appearance is then ideal but a start a step too far.

Hence I looked at when he was good to start.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Its not twisting things at all.

Being a sub is not necessarily the same as being fit at all, as well you should know.

We often here tales of a player only being good for X minutes while recovering fitness, for example. Where a sub appearance is then ideal but a start a step too far.

Hence I looked at when he was good to start.
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By your reckoning then Llorente must be one unfit player, he only featured as a starter in 15.8% of Spurs' league games (52.6% of overall) even though we had Kane and Son missing for large chunks of the season.
 
camspur said:
Not at all, just using your statistical idea to prove a point. Starting for a team or being on the bench is not in any way statistically linked to fitness.
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I dont think you have proven any point here.

When you are one of the best players in the world, you start when you are fit. Thats a pretty basic and fair assumption.

When you are at the end of your career and were brought in as a back up player, you dont start many games. Thats another basic and fair assumption.

This is really just common sense, something you would need to willfully ignore to try and justify your point.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
I dont think you have proven any point here.

When you are one of the best players in the world, you start when you are fit. Thats a pretty basic and fair assumption.

When you are at the end of your career and were bought in as a back up player, you dont start many games. Thats another basic and fair assumption.

This is really just common sense, something you would need to willfully ignore to try and justify your point.
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You do know only 5 players started more league games last season than Bale did for RM and the season before Ronaldo started one game more than Bale did. I'm still not convinced %age starts is a clear indication of your argument for fitness levels.
 
camspur said:
You do know only 5 players started more league games last season than Bale did for RM and the season before Ronaldo started one game more than Bale did. I'm still not convinced %age starts is a clear indication of your argument for fitness levels.
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I did not know that. Though, again, Im unsure what it proves. Does it prove Bale is actually really fit? Or that half the Real squad has injury problems?

The logic for me is simple. Bale is regarded as a world class player. As many a post in this very thread will attest, you dont leave talent like that on the bench. We know Bale has a history of injury problems. The number of games he starts correlate with this. Is it proof? For some, yes. For others, clearly, a more forensic investigation is required.

For me? Im past caring.

I believe Bale has injury problems, and I believe I have evidenced that (at least in part) and I believe thats something thats more than fair to take into consideration when there is talk of buying him (no doubt at extortionate cost).

You disagree? Absolutely fine with me. You agree? Fair enough. Either way Im pretty tired of going round in circles on what is really a small part of a bigger conversation.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
I did not know that. Though, again, Im unsure what it proves. Does it prove Bale is actually really fit? Or that half the Real squad has injury problems?

The logic for me is simple. Bale is regarded as a world class player. As many a post in this very thread will attest, you dont leave talent like that on the bench. We know Bale has a history of injury problems. The number of games he starts correlate with this. Is it proof? For some, yes. For others, clearly, a more forensic investigation is required.

For me? Im past caring.

I believe Bale has injury problems, and I believe I have evidenced that (at least in part) and I believe thats something thats more than fair to take into consideration when there is talk of buying him (no doubt at extortionate cost).

You disagree? Absolutely fine with me. You agree? Fair enough. Either way Im pretty tired of going round in circles on what is really a small part of a bigger conversation.
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The way to evidence if someone has injury problems is to list the injuries not dream up a statistic that may or may not correlate with your theory.

As for past caring you wouldn't have responded if you were. ;)
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
Of course its dumb luck, but when a player is out for frequently long periods you stack the odds against you, dont you?

12/13 - Started 33 of 38 = 87%
13/14 - 24 of 38 = 63%
14/15 - 30 = 79%
15/16 - 21 = 55%
16/17 - 17 = 45%
17/18 - 20 = 53%
18/19 - 21 = 55%

So my memory does serve me well enough. I counted starts because sub appearances could be anything, a few seconds and no more. A start is when you are prime to play.
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I think you have to count all appearances really. If a player is on the bench then they should be fit to play some portion of the game, especially if the manager then does indeed actually put them on the pitch).

Also is your list league games only? Wikipedia lists his total appearances as follows (admittedly this probably includes sub appearances as well as starts):
12/13 - 44
13/14 - 44
14/15 - 48
15/16 - 31
16/17 - 27
17/18 - 39
18/19 - 42

Looks like he certainly had injury prone seasons in 15/16 and 16/17. I would be more than happy for him to come to Spurs and make 40 appearances over a season.
 
nayimfromthehalfwayline said:
I would assume off the right. Son plays best off the left. Kane through the middle.

Pushes Moura down the order, and raises questions for Alli and Eriksen.
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It's about having a squad though. We should be expecting to play at least 55 games next season. If we're selecting any 3 or 4 from Kane, Bale, Son, Moura, Eriksen and Ali then we should always be able to pick a strong enough line-up to have a crack in every competition we play in, while also having enough options to keep those players fresh instead of overplaying some of them as happened last season.
 
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