Leeds Spur
Banned
The poll confirmed it.
The reason the old farts didn;t want Harry gone was he was old, so they think old = experienced and wise.
Conversely, young = don;t have a clue.
Patronising in the extreme
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Andre Villas-Boas - Head Coach
- Thread starter Bale
- Start date
The poll confirmed it.
The reason the old farts didn;t want Harry gone was he was old, so they think old = experienced and wise.
Conversely, young = don;t have a clue.
Patronising in the extreme
thfcsteff
Garth Crooks
So you would've given Harry 30 million quid in January to spend despite the fact he was basically halfway out the door at that point to a job he touted himself as nailed on for, and to a man who at that point stood a chance of being found guilty of tax fraud in a crown court and going down? Besides which, the man didn't even want to sign a contract extension, I'm guessing because he felt big bad Daniel would price him out of his dream job? Come on mate...please...he fudged Pav off and replaced him with Sahahahahahahaha. I was not Pav's greatest fan, but the bloke scored goals. BTW, think about how he was treated by Harry, for ages. As some 'geezer wot don't speak great English so I just tell 'im to do this an' that'...I'm hopeful that wasn't exactly how it played out, but for such a brilliant man manager, he certainly didn't manage to do much for Pav did he? Let's not go down this whole Harry road again, please!
He would have bought Phil Neville, Syilvain Distin, Carlton Cole and Youssi Benayoun anyway
Triffic lads
I was never in favour of AVB, but I don't think he's doing that badly. I really rated Harry as one of the best in the game, so felt who ever replaced him would look poor in comparison. I just felt Harry was the perfect fit for Spurs and our limitations were to do with finances and our biggest asset was the manager.
I actually thought AVB would possibly be gone by now, but he's done better than I expected and performed as well as many managers I would have deemed more suitable. But in contrast to my reasonable satisfaction with AVB, I don't understand why those who were so pro his appointment can't be more honest and admit they are shocked at how poor he's been compared to what they were expecting.
I refuse to believe that any of the pro AVB crowd would have in anyway anticipated such negative football, that is so poor to watch. I can't believe they had any clue he would struggle to such a large extent tactically. In terms of possession, it's again hard to believe that anyone would have thought we'd play in a way that was so unconcerned with keeping the ball. At the end of the day, the results have been alright, but the quality of football and the tactical approach has been average at best. Teams with far inferior players to us are playing much better stuff and we've played far better in previous seasons with worse teams. So forgetting the players not available, the AVB impact, or lack of it, must be a real eye opener for many of our fans.
I think the main issue is that AVB was judged on what our fans didn't witness. We have no clue of his real impact at Porto and very few would have even seen a handful of their games when he was in charge. Yet instead of judging him on what they have seen when he was at Chelsea and now on a weekly basis here, they still judge him on what they haven't witnessed, which seems a bit odd.
I actually thought AVB would possibly be gone by now, but he's done better than I expected and performed as well as many managers I would have deemed more suitable. But in contrast to my reasonable satisfaction with AVB, I don't understand why those who were so pro his appointment can't be more honest and admit they are shocked at how poor he's been compared to what they were expecting.
I refuse to believe that any of the pro AVB crowd would have in anyway anticipated such negative football, that is so poor to watch. I can't believe they had any clue he would struggle to such a large extent tactically. In terms of possession, it's again hard to believe that anyone would have thought we'd play in a way that was so unconcerned with keeping the ball. At the end of the day, the results have been alright, but the quality of football and the tactical approach has been average at best. Teams with far inferior players to us are playing much better stuff and we've played far better in previous seasons with worse teams. So forgetting the players not available, the AVB impact, or lack of it, must be a real eye opener for many of our fans.
I think the main issue is that AVB was judged on what our fans didn't witness. We have no clue of his real impact at Porto and very few would have even seen a handful of their games when he was in charge. Yet instead of judging him on what they have seen when he was at Chelsea and now on a weekly basis here, they still judge him on what they haven't witnessed, which seems a bit odd.
Jurgen the German
Willie Hall
Steff, at the start of 08/09, we had Darren Bent and Frazier Campbell. Last season, we get Saha in the window, what's the common denominator here? You realise we had different managers in the seasons I highlighted don't you?
And we were in the title race in January, but your happy we didn't spend? I for one was furious with everyone at the club who had the final say in this! Whether it was the manager or the chairman or the owner.
And Pav
thfcsteff
Garth Crooks
Good questions...Numbers 1 & 2 don't bother me personally right now, especially as 2 is not strictly accurate (we are, at least, scoring from corners and set-pieces these days as opposed to, say, last year). 3, yes, I think there are times when he could be more adventurous but again, his first priority given the calibre of squad he has versus injuries is to be secure, thus why he sets up that way. i think he could certainly do with being a bit braver (personally I'd have started Carroll yesterday, doesn't mean I don't see what he's doing). 5 is a concern, and one I believe he will resolve in the next month or so. With regards to yesterday, we had our fill-in left back (who despite what anyone says is a wonderful CB not LB) tiring visibly after weeks on end of football with rest, and we made a defensive shuffle that I would question, yes. Of course I could go into how I wished Daws was better and Brad had not let another one go through his hands, but that's not the point. 6 relates a lot to Walker, who is struggling without Kaboul and the higher line idea AVB is trying to bring in where he actually often ends up as more of a wing-back. 7, well, we can debate the Wigan sub all we want (JD wasn't doing anything) but yesterday two of his subs were enforced by injury. 8. this is something new he is facing, and I suspect he will have sorted out a solution soon. 9, so you want us to simply be a 4-4-2 side? With our current midfield? 10. Ade has given him no choice for a while, I agree re: Brad and Lloris, I wish he'd just go Hugo.
Where has he improved us...I believe he IS improvING our ability to be a side that can play without relying on just one or two players (we are having to learn to do that) I believe he is improving Bale and there's no argument on Lennon, and I believe he has improved the levels of structure of the club on and off the pitch. he is building a framework which I believe will see long-term success as opposed to short time flash bang for the back.
Harry_Perkins
Ben Thatcher
Never heard that one before? What exactly?
I agree that Levy made life difficult for Ramos. In fact, it has happened to an extent under every manager. But it is a question of degrees. I don't think AVB has, so far, suffered anything like the same fate as some of the others. Ramos was left with one senior forward for the first three games before we signed Pav, who'd just played the entire Russian league season. And frankly, the rot has already started to set in by game 4 and he'd lost the players. I don't think this can be compared with not signing Moutinho or Damiao. He's still got a squad that should be doing better than this, injuries considered too.
Look at who is directly above us. One guy not only in his first year at WBA but his first year as the top man at any club, one club just promoted and the perennial brilliant Moyes, who has a fraction of the quality and resources of AVB. And before it is pointed out he's had x years there, when he came in he hit the ground running. He saved them from the drop when it looked nailed on and then he finished 7th in his first full season with absolutely no money whatsoever. So this is nothing new. There are numerous examples of managers coming into far more difficult and challenging situations than AVB and doing 'as well' or better than he's done so far.
I'm not saying sack him but the results are so far are barely good enough and the performances are even worse. All excuses considered. Of course he gets time, by all means, but lets pretend that is based on anything other than he's the new man.
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DHSF
Les Ferdinand
I actually do not want to harp on about last season so I wont bring it up.
This season and summer though we had an opportunity to really make a statement not only in terms of our ambitions but also backing up AVB.
I feel sorry for AVB I really do because I seriously seriously believe there are players he didnt want to sign who we did sign who really are not producing anything - thats around 14-24m pounds worth of players he didnt really want - thats 24m that could have gone to one or two players HE DID WANT to make his favored formation and tactics work. This is now verging on Levy territory (another point entirely although it does have a real (negative?) impact on AVBs ability to do his job properly) but maybe that is the source of the issue (so when you bring up the whole he didnt want to support harry because if his 'impending' departure - well he hasnt really backed AVB either)
I agree about Pav but how many were a) pleased he had gone and b) thought with the funds we would be able to buy another striker? I bet Harry was selling players to raise funds to get in new ones but someone failed that (not the first time). So now with those funds that Harry did raise it allowed us to buy a couple of wastes of space and a keeper which AVB doesnt seem to favor.
Arcey - you dont think Benayoun would have failed like Dempsey? actually benayoun would have been more suited to the role that AVB wants. Distin? for a back up yeah id take him. Neville? Right now he is looking quite good as a back up and someone who could lead a bit. CC is the only one i would object to.
thfcsteff
Garth Crooks
Where did I say I was 'happy we didn't spend'? What I said was that given how we're not Moneybags City or Cashski, handing a man 50 million or whatever when it is clear he is, in his own mind, halfway out the door, would've been a massive gamble. Imagine if Harry had gone and spunked it on (say) Andy Carroll. Would you have been happy? As for your 'you realize I had different managers...' what is your actual point given that it's CLEAR I understood that? If you're going Levy-bashing, save yourself. I've already commented that with regards to AVB I feel Daniel let him down this summer. So far as Harry is concerned, let's just say that our management's ability to identify a great player when we had the chance didn't always helps us.
Harry_Perkins
Ben Thatcher
No I didn't. I said they didn't have an axe to grind in particular. Which is why they'll happily boo AVB now.
ringo
Tim Sherwood
I notice AVB also said this about yesterday's game:
"We were more balanced in the second half and found some good gaps but it’s a pity that in the end we didn’t get what we deserved.”
More balanced? Not sure what he means by that. We certainly weren't balanced when we had 4 CBs and a RB at RM. But even before that I don't see how we were more balanced than in the first half. Seems an odd thing to say.
"We were more balanced in the second half and found some good gaps but it’s a pity that in the end we didn’t get what we deserved.”
More balanced? Not sure what he means by that. We certainly weren't balanced when we had 4 CBs and a RB at RM. But even before that I don't see how we were more balanced than in the first half. Seems an odd thing to say.
Jurgen the German
Willie Hall
My point was that Levy doesn't back his managers as much as he should do.
I didn't say we should spend £50m, but why didn't we go for someone like Huntelaar for example who would have cost around £20m-£25m? No guarantee he would have come to us obviously but you don't get if you don't ask. And why do you assume that the last manager would have wasted the money when he signed players like Gallas, Kranjcar, Sandro and Parker to name a few who would be unanimously described as good signings?
Spursalot
Jimmy McCormick
More balance between defense and offense.
We created more second half, but City were far far improved as well.
Let's be honest we've been poor this season. Not played well for a full 90 minutes once. We've been sloppy defensively, no imagination or creativity in the centre of midfield and struggle to keep possession against poor teams for long periods of time, the moments we have controlled we have created very few goalscoring chances, resorting to half chances or dangerous crosses with nobody in the middle to get on the end of. AVB's team selection & substitutions have been baffling and frustrating. And only picking up 2 points from the home games against West Brom, Norwich and Wigan is a disgrace.
If we can't judge AVB after his first few months in charge then how can we judge Harry for his last few months? I can only imagine what this place would be like if Harry was playing Defoe as a loan striker, persisting with Gallas and Friedel and producing performances/results like we have seen so far. Not to mention Dempsey, which has "Harry buy" written all over it.
Having said all that i quite like AVB, not sure why, I'll admit at the beginning of the season I said he was a clown and will be Ramos all over again, probably a bit much and I certainly don't want him replaced anytime soon. I guess I'm hoping Dembele will prove to be the player all my Fulham mates keep banging on about (they genuinely believe he is better than Modric) and improve the centre of our midfield upon his return, but then we shouldn't have to rely on one player in our whole squad to give us a spark in the centre of the pitch.
If we can't judge AVB after his first few months in charge then how can we judge Harry for his last few months? I can only imagine what this place would be like if Harry was playing Defoe as a loan striker, persisting with Gallas and Friedel and producing performances/results like we have seen so far. Not to mention Dempsey, which has "Harry buy" written all over it.
Having said all that i quite like AVB, not sure why, I'll admit at the beginning of the season I said he was a clown and will be Ramos all over again, probably a bit much and I certainly don't want him replaced anytime soon. I guess I'm hoping Dembele will prove to be the player all my Fulham mates keep banging on about (they genuinely believe he is better than Modric) and improve the centre of our midfield upon his return, but then we shouldn't have to rely on one player in our whole squad to give us a spark in the centre of the pitch.
Spursalot
Jimmy McCormick
Not that i agree with not judging him, but that is flawed.
You would be judging Harry with a team that Harry built.
You would be judging AVB on a team that mostly Harry built.
Kingdawson
Banned
Didn't have to be £30m but i would have certainly given him money to spend given the position we were in at the time. He wanted Samba which would have been an excellent signing imo and having him in the team would have given us at least the one extra point needed to finish third.