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So, what happened today?

Jurgen the German said:
They shouldn’t be targeted or discriminated against. That said, I think issues around bathrooms and the sporting arena are legitimate concerns. It’s really not helpful when people like John Oliver continually claim there’s no evidence that trans athletes have any advantage. Not sure why he’s willing to die on that hill. Let’s have a sensible debate about integrating them into sport, my solution would be to give them their own category. It might not be a great solution that pleases everyone but it’s arguably the fairest to include trans people but most importantly keeping women’s sport as fair as possible. Fairness has to trump inclusion IMO.



I assume you’re referring to Imani Khalif? I must admit I’m a little hazy on the details, but again I think many people raised legitimate questions about her eligibility given that she allegedly has a male chromosome.


I think the vast majority of the public think trans people should have the rights as anyone, but a line has to be drawn in bathrooms and sport.
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Imane is a woman.
 
Chrissivad said:
We do in some ports already, it's why boxing has weight divisions.

There is no one answer for this anyway.
Let each sport make the call. Some sports there won't be any advantage or risk of injury. Others will.
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yep, and they need to come up with a better way in those sports of pooling participants, limiting to two of the genders doesn't work anymore
 
Still haven't met a single person in my life who has been oppressed by a trans woman. Random anecdotes. Concern about sports and toilets backed up with no data. Lack of awareness that women use cubicles with doors on them in public toilets.

I think people are scared of the boogey monster.
 
LutonSpurs said:
Still haven't met a single person in my life who has been oppressed by a trans woman. Random anecdotes. Concern about sports and toilets backed up with no data. Lack of awareness that women use cubicles with doors on them in public toilets.

I think people are scared of the boogey monster.
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I guess the real fear isn't trans women, it's the notion that any man could decide to claim to be a woman and then use that opportunity to do nefarious things in the women's toilets. So it's pretty much hoping that a stick person with a skirt drawn on a door is going to be some kind of barrier which makes it impossible to do some heinous brick.

It also gives the stuffy partridge-esque right wing men a chance to feel righteous like they have always been at the vanguard of feminism, with papers like the Mail declaring it a victory for women everywhere..

Single space unisex toilets are the solution, hopefully men will be able to resist the sudden inevitable urge to sexually assault women if they encounter any women whilst washing their hands once they've done their business.

Like you say, most people kicking off just don't have real life experience. I have an aunt who works at a bar but is quite old fashioned, they have someone who is genetically a man but presents as female, and suddenly it's not just scoffing in a Ricky Gervais type "What if I identify as a toaster, what about if I identify as blah blah etc etc", it's an actual person who isn't being wierd for the sake of it.

If people were as disgusted by poverty, as they were about someone kindly asking to be addressed by different pronouns (or just simply by their name if that is too hard), the world would be quite a nice place.
 
LutonSpurs said:
Still haven't met a single person in my life who has been oppressed by a trans woman. Random anecdotes. Concern about sports and toilets backed up with no data. Lack of awareness that women use cubicles with doors on them in public toilets.

I think people are scared of the boogey monster.
Click to expand...

I have encountered trans people in my life but I don’t know any personally. They should have the same rights and respect that everyone else has. Concerns about toilets and sports are legitimate and not always coming from a place of bigotry, we had a discussion about toilets and how that could be solved see above/previous pages. It’s just common sense that women who used to be men still retain physical advantages over their biologically born female counterparts. To me it’s crazy that people like John Oliver continually says that trans people have no advantages when it’s fairly obvious to most that men are bigger and stronger than women. Even if they go through the transition to become females, they will retain the bone structure and strength of a man.
 
Well if you're hero says they are not, they are not
As we all know, everything he says is the absolute truth

Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer does not believe transgender women are women, his official spokesman has said.
It comes after the UK Supreme Court ruled last week that a woman is defined by biological sex under equalities law.
In March 2022, when he was leader of the opposition, Sir Keir told the Times, external that "a woman is a female adult, and in addition to that transwomen are women, and that is not just my view - that is actually the law".
Asked if Sir Keir still believed that a transgender woman was a woman, the PM's official spokesman said: "No, the Supreme Court judgment has made clear that when looking at the Equality Act, a woman is a biological woman."
The spokesman added: "That is set out clearly by the court judgment."
Pressed over when the PM had changed his mind, his spokesman insisted the Labour government had been consistent that single-sex spaces "are protected in law".
The ruling also makes it clear that a person who was born male but identifies as a woman does not have the right to use spaces or services designated as for women-only.
This means transgender women with a gender recognition certificate (GRC) can be excluded from single-sex spaces if "proportionate".
 
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