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Sick sick world what is wrong with people
- Thread starter Danishfurniturelover
- Start date
SpurMeUp
Les Howe
The phenomenon of the internet and echo chambers is interesting. Trying to get my head around it in a sociological sense.
Views are amplified by the net it seems. You find material to back up your views. Any position can be expanded upon with limitless material. You can find others - comrades - who back you up and eloquently or humorously articulate your view, helping to entrench your position. It’s a virtual reality. A place where everything makes sense and your sense is backed up. You also have the opposition views readily available to entrench you further still.
Historically, religion and empire would legitimise acts of mass violence with perpetrators sanctified and worshiped by their sect. Think Ottomans who stretched over 3 continents with fearless often suicidal warriors. Now, history might repeat, but with 4chan chat rooms the imams and belief systems that allow humans to throw themselves mindlessly into murder. Could Brexit on a more superficial level be fuelled in a similar way? With online confirmation bias creating echo chambers that amplify entrenched beliefs? Probably.
The other core variable to these tragedies is perpetrators training themselves using computer games. If you spend days, weeks, years immersed honing your skills in a war simulator, you are effectively training your mind for mass murder. Most don’t utilise games this way, but combined with hardcore views and a right wing fixation, there is a pattern emerging.
Sitting on my porcelain throne using glory-glory.co.uk mobile app
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
Could not agree more, the is that feeling that something under the surface is going very wrong.
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
Europe has been pushing people more and more in this way. Because of its intolerance of national governments the EU is going to push these sort of things to happen here, if you actually follow what goes on in the news in Poland and Hungry for example. The EU is actually making it worse by its dogmatic one size fits all approach to democracy.
If you love Europe and peace(as I do) you can not help but to be dismayed at what the politicians in the EU are fostering.
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
Woo there, so Farage and anyone to the right helped inspire these sort of attacks? does that mean when we see dingdongheads drive into people in the streets left wing politicians helped to inspire them?
The fella who killed these people in New Zealand was a sick fcuk, people like this deserve to be put in prison for life and we need more intelligence to try and stop these attacks in the future.
The reasons for terrorists attacking people are often very different, but one of the nice things to see on here after the summer when we had the attacks in Nice and London was how people did not go after Muslims or the left wing politicians but talked more of trying to integrate all parts of society.
What happened in New Zealand was just as wrong as what happens in London Bridge or Nice. But it is not the fault of someone like Farage.
StephenH
David Ginola
Sorry disagree.
Spain and Greece being in the EU has coincided with a long move away from fascist governments, may be a coincidence but I think not.
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
I think Europe has moved towards peace after the second world war, because it was such a devastating war people wanted peace. The reasons behind the Nazis rise to power are not around today. They was not the communication back then for the outside world to know what the Nazis were doing, they were able to control the press in ways that you could not today.
We can see in eastern europe the is a growing and in my opinion worrying trend of going towards far right movements(not something I would ever want) is in part to the EU and its mass immigration has swelled these movements. You also have the EU becoming ever more over controlling in different countries and this produces a back lash.
The is a very real case for saying the EU has had a rise in right wing extremism and the rise in popularity in right wing governments.
Danishfurniturelover
the prettiest spice girl
That is ok, we still for the time being have the freedom to disagree, for the time being anyway.
SpurMeUp
Les Howe
Agree. But the murder of Jo Cox is harder to disassociate from the UK right wing.
StephenH
David Ginola
He is opportunistic maggot feathering his own nest.
His fault? He is certainly not helping stop things like today from happening.
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
So, for the first part of your question, yes, absolutely. Farage and the new right - the type that uses unashamed dogwhistles for electoral purposes.
The type that puts up a bloody great billboard with 'Breaking Point and a picture of refugees on it, but goes 'not me guv'nor' when called out on it. The type that calls Muslims every name under the sun, shouts in support of a 'Muslim ban', angrily derides Sadiq Khan for letting Muslims into London somehow...and then turns around acts like they never said any of it, when called out on their rhetoric.
'Anyone to the right'? No, absolutely not. Farage, Tommy Robinson, UKIP, Trump, the GOP, AfD, Front National, Lega Nord and co.? Yes.
And the broader right-wing (from the Tories to the Christian Democrats) have never stopped to think if pandering to their newly divisive, increasingly bellicose ilk would result in days like today - at the very least, they need to stop and f*cking think, before more innocent people die. There was a Tory Party that once would have laughed people like Farage out of the building, to their credit. But, it seems, not anymore.
As for the second part, radical Islamist preachers did inspire the dingdongheads who drove vans into people in the streets. And I want them utterly fudged off to crack rocks and waste away somewhere as much as the rest of them. But it's harder to argue that a left-wing politician saying 'Muslims are okay' inspired a jihadi to commit violence. Whereas a Farage type saying 'Muslims are dangerous animals, wink wink, nudge nudge' might well have pushed a white nationalist spree killer over the line.
I see the same thing in Canada. The Conservative Party of old is dying, and the new right that is emerging is exactly the same - a wink, a dogwhistle and a nod to f*ckers like this, and then shock when they end up doing what they openly encouraged them to do. This is a global problem with the new right-wing, and it needs solving *now*.
Fully agreed. This was an intelligence failure, too - this f*ckwit was posting pictures to his Twitter for weeks before the massacre, and openly detailing his plans on 8chan. Nothing was done - somebody dropped the fudging ball.
I don't disagree - people need to come together, all of us. but why do you think this happened now? Why do you think it happened after the Finsbury Park attack, the Quebec City mosque attack, the American synagogue attack, the Charlottesville attack, the Charlottetown attack?
We are in a political environment where it's becoming increasingly normal to dehumanise minorities, dehumanize Muslims, paint them as threats, and flagellate them. We are in an environment where stupid nonsense like 'white genocide' and 'immigrants replacing whites' is actually growing in popularity. And before we come together, we need to understand that doing so is fudging *wrong* - more innocent people will die because of this horror we've created, by allowing the new right like Farage to poison our political discourse like this.
We are allowing ourselves to be led into a dangerous, racially-charged age by these demagogues. We need to stop.
StephenH
David Ginola
Your reply is very interesting!
We don’t need overthink these horrendous acts of barbarism. It’s mass murder. Islamaphobia is just a label of convenience given to this particular act of murder. Anti Jew was the last one, then anti gay and i don’t know what we call the one in Las Vegas?
Rorschach
Sonny Walters
I disagree with all that. Nationalism is the root cause.
Rorschach
Sonny Walters
This is my fear too and it is going to get much worse in my opinion. Something that I learned recently is how interconnected the temperature is to incidents of violence, domestic and between nations. Within a few years our climate problem will conflate with the immigration problem, and this will feed the facism sentiment like nothing before. I don't want to pull this into a Brexit debate but on this issue, my firm belief is that Europe is better equipped to meet this challenge as a bloc rather than as individual nations.
markysimmo
Johnny nice-tits
Its the Daily Mail what else did you expect ??