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Saido Berahino

I thought Gazza was accusing me of making an unsubstantiated comment so I threw that one back. We have much more to go on this deal than on the financing of the stadium because peace has been shout ing his mouth off about it.
 
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DTA said:
Wait....... What?

Did we really just finish the transfer window with ONE striker......... Nah you fudging with me.
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With a neutral net spend, though (if the Lennon deal goes through). Outgoings and incomings in perfect harmony. A bonus compared to previous windows and their large profits.

Daniel Levy is brilliant at sadistically making you celebrate the smallest possible mercies, you know.
 
DubaiSpur said:
Just seen that Everton, the supposedly skint club also trying to fund a stadium expansion/new one...have spent 20 million net in this window. Boof.
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Everton has as far as I know abandonded building as Liverpool has gone for a redevelopment of part of Anfield.
 
spurs' magna carter said:
Just the one striker, unless of course Adebayor is given yet another chance, is utter madness.

Hate to say it but that is the case, that is our season gone. Gutted.

Our only hope is that Son can play up front, on his own....
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This season was "gone" anyway. It's called building a team for the future.
 
Jordinho said:
For all we know, Peace could be a lying, two-faced ****. Making promises in private, then reneging on them his public **** waving .
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I get the feeling that Peace has loved every minute of "out Levy-ing us" and this was more important to him than getting any kind of deal done.

He's seen how people view Levy when it comes to dealings and is trying to make a name for himself.

I bet SB is regretting that tweet about now though.
 
DubaiSpur said:
That's what our 60-70 million pound profits over the last five years are for, surely. And he could always just flog another player to pay it off, 'ring-fenced transfer funds' be damned, you know.
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Dubai - My post was in response to an ask for Levy to live dangerously and merely to illustrate that he is. I mentioned this in a post a long time ago, but EBITDA is probably as good as measure as any of profitability of a club. It strips out things like transfers etc.... This shows that we make around £20m each year in EBITDA. To therefore commit to spend £400-£500m is a huge statement of intent. Not only in absolute terms, but any adverse deviation from that cost of say 10% which has happened before, would wipe out at least 2 years of profit. It's that profit that will be used for transfers.

Rob - In terms of knowing how the stadium finance is structured, I don't. I know the estimated full build cost, I know our profit, I know our turnover and even an idiot like me can see that it is a huge project and risk for a business to make. I somewhat abruptly (and I apologise for that) responded to your comment saying that it was Levy offering an absurd up front payment that scuppered the deal. I was just saying that none of us will know that it was an absurd up front fee, and that as Levy has managed to get quite a few negotiations and transfers in his past, he would know just how these deals are normally structured. He is the one who has most to lose from not getting a signing done, so he will know at what point a deal is do-able or not do-able.

@Monkey boy - Call me a Levy-ite if you want, but all I am doing is being pragmatic and honest in my assessment of the situation. I do this, and I mean this respectfully, on the basis that most of the criticism is that Levy is penny-pinching, tight or that he needs to live dangerously, or speculate to accumulate or show some ambition. A lot of different phrases but all amounting to the same thing which is "spend more money". This is coming from people, who in the main, know nothing about finances as they assume that any profit that Spurs make goes straight into Levy's back pocket. Or they believe that Levy or Joe Lewis should spend even more of their own money to fund our transfers.

I have a list of things that I believe Levy should have done better and which I don't like. However, his approach to transfers is not one of them. We have consistently punched above our financial weight in this league and he deserves an enormous amount of credit for that rather than the abuse from people that say he should spend more.

To all you Levy-haters (because you can only be a Levy-ite or Levy-hater - there is no inbetween) I suggest the following. Put your money where your mouth is. Crowd fund, find yourself a billionaire or someone with the appropriate means and spend the fee required to buy him out. Can't do it? Then just accept that he has earned the right, by putting his own money where his mouth is, to run the club that he owns as he sees fit. And that is not ladening us with debt, not taking money out of this club to fund outside interests and actually taking us from a club consistently in the lower half of the table that flirted with relegation to a club that is in the top 6 consistently flirting with the occasional top 4. No facts presented by the Levy haters has made me feel that Levy is not doing a good job. Am happy to entertain any facts that you may have but will no doubt be left disappointed as conjecture from press instead will be used. Or even worse, ITK.
 
DTA said:
Wait....... What?

Did we really just finish the transfer window with ONE striker......... Nah you fudging with me.
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Or 3 depending if your glass is full or half full - I think we will fine. Pearce was in a cut nose off to spite face or prove a point.
 
alekaras said:
This season was "gone" anyway. It's called building a team for the future.
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stinkfoot said:
I get the feeling that Peace has loved every minute of "out Levy-ing us" and this was more important to him than getting any kind of deal done.

He's seen how people view Levy when it comes to dealings and is trying to make a name for himself.

I bet SB is regretting that tweet about now though.
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It's a trend, though. Schneiderlin hands in a transfer request, throws his dolls out of the pram and does everything to force a move through on his end....and we let him down by running away when faced with the prospect of bidding more than 10 million.

Wanyama hands in a transfer request, throws his dolls out of the pram and does everything to force a move through on his end...and we let him down.

Berahino hands in a transfer request, throws his dolls out of the pram and does everything to force a move through on his end...and we let him down.

In the future, who the hell will take our world and burn his bridges to force through a move if they know we'll never actually go through with it?
 
E3zzle said:
I'm just saying it's ridiculous to expect N'Jie to have a similar breakthrough to Kane last season. He's never played as a lone striker, only paired with one of the best strikers in europe.
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I agree with this . I feel we've put added pressure on our three young forwards, two of them untried in the PL.
I also think Austin would've come to us and would've been the ideal signing after the signings of Son and Njie.
 
Gazzasrightboot said:
Dubai - My post was in response to an ask for Levy to live dangerously and merely to illustrate that he is. I mentioned this in a post a long time ago, but EBITDA is probably as good as measure as any of profitability of a club. It strips out things like transfers etc.... This shows that we make around £20m each year in EBITDA. To therefore commit to spend £400-£500m is a huge statement of intent. Not only in absolute terms, but any adverse deviation from that cost of say 10% which has happened before, would wipe out at least 2 years of profit. It's that profit that will be used for transfers.

Rob - In terms of knowing how the stadium finance is structured, I don't. I know the estimated full build cost, I know our profit, I know our turnover and even an idiot like me can see that it is a huge project and risk for a business to make. I somewhat abruptly (and I apologise for that) responded to your comment saying that it was Levy offering an absurd up front payment that scuppered the deal. I was just saying that none of us will know that it was an absurd up front fee, and that as Levy has managed to get quite a few negotiations and transfers in his past, he would know just how these deals are normally structured. He is the one who has most to lose from not getting a signing done, so he will know at what point a deal is do-able or not do-able.

@Monkey boy - Call me a Levy-ite if you want, but all I am doing is being pragmatic and honest in my assessment of the situation. I do this, and I mean this respectfully, on the basis that most of the criticism is that Levy is penny-pinching, tight or that he needs to live dangerously, or speculate to accumulate or show some ambition. A lot of different phrases but all amounting to the same thing which is "spend more money". This is coming from people, who in the main, know nothing about finances as they assume that any profit that Spurs make goes straight into Levy's back pocket. Or they believe that Levy or Joe Lewis should spend even more of their own money to fund our transfers.

I have a list of things that I believe Levy should have done better and which I don't like. However, his approach to transfers is not one of them. We have consistently punched above our financial weight in this league and he deserves an enormous amount of credit for that rather than the abuse from people that say he should spend more.

To all you Levy-haters (because you can only be a Levy-ite or Levy-hater - there is no inbetween) I suggest the following. Put your money where your mouth is. Crowd fund, find yourself a billionaire or someone with the appropriate means and spend the fee required to buy him out. Can't do it? Then just accept that he has earned the right, by putting his own money where his mouth is, to run the club that he owns as he sees fit. And that is not ladening us with debt, not taking money out of this club to fund outside interests and actually taking us from a club consistently in the lower half of the table that flirted with relegation to a club that is in the top 6 consistently flirting with the occasional top 4. No facts presented by the Levy haters has made me feel that Levy is not doing a good job. Am happy to entertain any facts that you may have but will no doubt be left disappointed as conjecture from press instead will be used. Or even worse, ITK.
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I accept that he can run the club as he sees fit: I'm not calling for him to be arrested for mismanagement or fraud, am I? He is legally entitled to do whatever he wants with the club, including to blow up the stadium, sell all the players and build a Sainsbury's over the ashes if he so chooses.

However, we can call out his miserable failures when we want to as well. We can criticize him as we see fit. That is not in opposition to the above statement in any way.

Gazzasrightboot said:
Dubai - My post was in response to an ask for Levy to live dangerously and merely to illustrate that he is. I mentioned this in a post a long time ago, but EBITDA is probably as good as measure as any of profitability of a club. It strips out things like transfers etc.... This shows that we make around £20m each year in EBITDA. To therefore commit to spend £400-£500m is a huge statement of intent. Not only in absolute terms, but any adverse deviation from that cost of say 10% which has happened before, would wipe out at least 2 years of profit. It's that profit that will be used for transfers.
Click to expand...

What profit that will be used for transfers? We don't use our profits on transfers! Forget spending earnings before interest, depreciation and tax on the transfer side of things, we siphon transfer profits away from the footballing side of things into the business side!

That 20 million will never be seen on the footballing side anyway, so what risks are there in an overshoot of the stadium costs?

And come on, mate, any measure of our earnings that doesn't take into account our transfer dealings (where we have made a 60 million pound profit over the last five years, or three years of EBITDA) is hardly a full accounting of the situation. Point being, we have the margins to spend a bit more and 'live dangerously' without the familiar 'doing a Leeds' refrain being hurled at us.
 
spurs' magna carter said:
Just the one striker, unless of course Adebayor is given yet another chance, is utter madness.

Hate to say it but that is the case, that is our season gone. Gutted.

Our only hope is that Son can play up front, on his own....
Click to expand...

I think that we will see Chadli, Lamela and/Dembele used as cover with the new pacey players playing off them.
 
DubaiSpur said:
It's a trend, though. Schneiderlin hands in a transfer request, throws his dolls out of the pram and does everything to force a move through on his end....and we let him down by running away when faced with the prospect of bidding more than 10 million.

Wanyama hands in a transfer request, throws his dolls out of the pram and does everything to force a move through on his end...and we let him down.

Berahino hands in a transfer request, throws his dolls out of the pram and does everything to force a move through on his end...and we let him down.

In the future, who the hell will take our world and burn his bridges to force through a move if they know we'll never actually go through with it?
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There is a massive assumption there that there was a set price. I'm going to make an assumption (perhaps equally as massive) and say Southampton don't want to deal with us, or take them at their word and they didn't want to sell Schneiderlin. When they did sell him, we were simply not the best club in for him. With Wanyama, they simply did not relent. With Berahino, they did not relent, except in this case Berahino is focusing his entire anger at Peace suggesting (and this is an assumption) that a previous agreement has been reneged on.
 
DubaiSpur said:
I accept that he can run the club as he sees fit: I'm not calling for him to be arrested for mismanagement or fraud, am I? He is legally entitled to do whatever he wants with the club, including to blow up the stadium, sell all the players and build a Sainsbury's over the ashes if he so chooses.

However, we can call out his miserable failures when we want to as well. We can criticize him as we see fit. That is not in opposition to the above statement in any way.

What profit that will be used for transfers? We don't use our profits on transfers! Forget spending earnings before interest, depreciation and tax on the transfer side of things, we siphon transfer profits away from the footballing side of things into the business side!

That 20 million will never be seen on the footballing side anyway, so what risks are there in an overshoot of the stadium costs?

And come on, mate, any measure of our earnings that doesn't take into account our transfer dealings (where we have made a 60 million pound profit over the last five years, or three years of EBITDA by ) is hardly a full accounting of the situation. Point being, we have the margins to spend a bit more and 'live dangerously' without the familiar 'doing a Leeds' refrain being hurled at us.
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I'm not saying don't criticise, I'm just saying at least use some fact in that criticism and not be so sensationalist about it. You've been one of the few that has actually tried to have some sort of constructive debate.

In terms of transfers - We regularly run net spend of nil. So there's no profit on transfers, as it is being spent on purchases. net net nil. If we are to spend more, then it will come out of other earnings so it will be using profits on transfers.

The risks on an overshoot of stadium costs is that that money has to come from somewhere. Where do you think that will be? In our recent history (last 50 years) we have been in a situation at least 3 times where a build of a stand has resulted in a forced sale of our players. Two of those situations required us to need new owners to sort out the mess. The risks are very real.

I'm not saying that we are going to do a Leeds, which again is sensationalist. But it is very simple. Every overspend in the stadium will result in an underspend in transfer kitty unless more debt, or higher prices. You cannot consistently spend beyond your means. No business can do that. And it is foolish to do that on a transfer of a player that may not work out (Soldado, Adebayor, Lamela, Capoue, Paulinho, Rebrov etc.....) because then even when you sell said player, you need to sell more in order to get that debt off your books.
 
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