Pre Season 2017

[DubaiSpur]

City' obvious advantage was the size of their senior squad (their 2nd half subs were Aquero, Toure, Nasri, etc.)

This is an advantage Chelsea used to brutal effect against us last season, too. Cup semi-final - we managed to pull it back to 2-2 after recovering from multiple self-inflicted injuries (Son at left-back, general lethargy, rudimentary errors), and actually looked like we had the momentum heading into the middle of the second half.

Then, they coolly, calmly slaughtered us by sending on both Hazard *and* Costa on the hour-mark. And followed it up by bringing on Fabregas in the 75th minute.

And all we could reply with was bringing N'Koudou on in the 80th minute. We conceded one, then another, never got our foothold back, and the game was over. Just like that.

This squad is now *weaker* than that squad was. And the same thing *will* happen again, if we let it stay that way. No Onomah, no Edwards, no Oakley-Boothe and no Georgiou will prevent that sort of thing happening again, at the hands of not just Chelsea but also possibly City and United.

Thankfully, Poch realises that too, if his post-match comments are any indicator.

 

[parklane1]

Did you watch the naffing game?
Bleeding site is full of happy-clappers.

Well you could say there are many of these as well, and it looks like you are one of them.

As for the game well it was not a good result, however friendly's mean little its all about gaining fitness and making money for some clubs. Anyone who thinks its the end of the world need to have a word with themselves.

 

[Sandman]

We cannot afford to fill out our squad like the Oil teams and United. More to do with the wages than the transfer fees I would say. But we do need to have some effective players coming off the bench. Yes we have a coup[le of players that are injured and may well be sitting on the sidelines. But not of them can be game changers or super subs. I would have said that for Son but he is playing well and deserves to probably be in the team when fit. Whilst I like Lamela he does not scare anyone.

But at the point we are with out side we do need to be able to show the youngsters they have a way into the side. It will mean we can pick up the best youth, keep them and get them through into the side. But that being said and I am happy to go with Trippier and KWP this season to show that. I do think we need a tricky wide player and player with direct pace. These can then be in the side or on the bench to give us some flexibility when its not going right or energy levels have dropped.

Ill get shot down for this. But I still would have taken Defoe. He can make a change off the bench. Mahrez is the type of player we need as well. Seeing as we have lost Walker and have some understudies i see no justification for not getting in a top level forward player.

 

[Bedfordspurs]

This is an advantage Chelsea used to brutal effect against us last season, too. Cup semi-final - we managed to pull it back to 2-2 after recovering from multiple self-inflicted injuries (Son at left-back, general lethargy, rudimentary errors), and actually looked like we had the momentum heading into the middle of the second half.

Then, they coolly, calmly slaughtered us by sending on both Hazard *and* Costa on the hour-mark. And followed it up by bringing on Fabregas in the 75th minute.

And all we could reply with was bringing N'Koudou on in the 80th minute. We conceded one, then another, never got our foothold back, and the game was over. Just like that.

This squad is now *weaker* than that squad was. And the same thing *will* happen again, if we let it stay that way. No Onomah, no Edwards, no Oakley-Boothe and no Georgiou will prevent that sort of thing happening again, at the hands of not just Chelsea but also possibly City and United.

Thankfully, Poch realises that too, if his post-match comments are any indicator.

But Chelsea had NO injuries to any key players last season that lasted more than couple of weeks which will not happen again unless they do some voodoo magic hence why they had a small squad and played the same 14 players

We played more games and had a lot of injuries (still have) which left our bench worse than it could have been. Imagine if we had Lamella on the bench as a game changer instead.

 

[DubaiSpur]

But Chelsea had NO injuries to any key players last season that lasted more than couple of weeks which will not happen again unless they do some voodoo magic hence why they had a small squad and played the same 14 players

We played more games and had a lot of injuries (still have) which left our bench worse than it could have been. Imagine if we had Lamella on the bench as a game changer instead.

Right, but there's no indication that it will be any different this season. We will have injuries again - quite a few small ones, and probably at least one or more lengthy ones, if the average over previous seasons is anything to go by.

The argument that we'd be more competitive if we didn't have injuries is technically true, but practically pretty pointless - because we're never going to be injury-free to the extent that we can go a season relying on absolutely no one getting injured.

A deep squad is the best defense against injury-hit seasons, imo. And our rivals all realize that, whatever their advantages and disadvantages relative to us in terms of their pulling power in the market and their team-building approach. Even Chelsea. I'm not particularly worried by the players any of them have brought in, but I don't think we can expect to do any better than we did last season if we stay the same ourselves.

 

[AdamB]

A deep squad is the best defense against injury-hit seasons, imo. And our rivals all realize that, whatever their advantages and disadvantages relative to us in terms of their pulling power in the market and their team-building approach. Even Chelsea. I'm not particularly worried by the players any of them have brought in, but I don't think we can expect to do any better than we did last season if we stay the same ourselves.

Well said

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Right, but there's no indication that it will be any different this season. We will have injuries again - quite a few small ones, and probably at least one or more lengthy ones, if the average over previous seasons is anything to go by.

The argument that we'd be more competitive if we didn't have injuries is technically true, but practically pretty pointless - because we're never going to be injury-free to the extent that we can go a season relying on absolutely no one getting injured.

A deep squad is the best defense against injury-hit seasons, imo. And our rivals all realize that, whatever their advantages and disadvantages relative to us in terms of their pulling power in the market and their team-building approach. Even Chelsea. I'm not particularly worried by the players any of them have brought in, but I don't think we can expect to do any better than we did last season if we stay the same ourselves.

I'm arguing that our peers won't have the luck they had last season which by default makes them less competitive

 

[DubaiSpur]

I'm arguing that our peers won't have the luck they had last season which by default makes them less competitive

Yes, but they are signing players to offset that. We aren't. Individually, none of their signings have really impressed me so far (except perhaps for Bernardo Silva), but they are all building deep squads. Whether or not they're doing it wisely is another matter, but they are addressing that particular deficiency.

We so far haven't done so. If anything, we've made it worse by selling a first-team player to a rival and subsequently sitting on our hands until the end of July. So I think that concern is still more valid for us than it is for our rivals.

 

[elltrev]

This is an advantage Chelsea used to brutal effect against us last season, too. Cup semi-final - we managed to pull it back to 2-2 after recovering from multiple self-inflicted injuries (Son at left-back, general lethargy, rudimentary errors), and actually looked like we had the momentum heading into the middle of the second half.

Then, they coolly, calmly slaughtered us by sending on both Hazard *and* Costa on the hour-mark. And followed it up by bringing on Fabregas in the 75th minute.

And all we could reply with was bringing N'Koudou on in the 80th minute. We conceded one, then another, never got our foothold back, and the game was over. Just like that.

This squad is now *weaker* than that squad was. And the same thing *will* happen again, if we let it stay that way. No Onomah, no Edwards, no Oakley-Boothe and no Georgiou will prevent that sort of thing happening again, at the hands of not just Chelsea but also possibly City and United.

Thankfully, Poch realises that too, if his post-match comments are any indicator.

I have to challenge the Chelsea point. The reason they could bring on Hazard and Costa was because they started with Batshuayi and Willian - same as us starting with Janssen and Son (or Lamela if fit), and bringing on Kane and Alli. I'll grant you Fabregas a little more, but even then it would be similar to us starting with Wanyama and Dier, and bringing Dembele on from the bench (if we were playing 4-3-2-1 so that Dier wasn't needed at CB).

I don't think Chelsea's squad was any better than ours last season - they were just luckier with injuries and had no European football to balance.

Agree with your more general point though about the need to bring in 2 or 3 players to strengthen our squad.

 

[DubaiSpur]

I have to challenge the Chelsea point. The reason they could bring on Hazard and Costa was because they started with Batshuayi and Willian - same as us starting with Janssen and Son (or Lamela if fit), and bringing on Kane and Alli. I'll grant you Fabregas a little more, but even then it would be similar to us starting with Wanyama and Dier, and bringing Dembele on from the bench (if we were playing 4-3-2-1 so that Dier wasn't needed at CB).

I don't think Chelsea's squad was any better than ours last season - they were just luckier with injuries and had no European football to balance.

Agree with your more general point though about the need to bring in 2 or 3 players to strengthen our squad.

Right, I'll grant you that - but Chelsea started Batshuayi and Willian and still held us to 2-2 before bringing on the big hitters to finish us off. Whereas we played all our best players (including inexplicably shoehorning Son in at left-back) and *still* couldn't manage to make the advantage count before the strength of their bench became decisive.

If we'd started with Janssen, would we even have gotten to 2-2 in the first place? Kane scored the first with an outrageously improvised back header across Courtois - would Janssen have done the same? Based on last season's form, probably not. And that in itself tells a story, imo - that their squad players could keep us contained before the big hitters finished us off, while ours likely wouldn't have been able to do the same at the time.

 

[the dza]

I'm not too worried -- City did a similar job on us in our last league game against them, we got a 2-2 but they should have won easily really. I do think Poch needs a tactical re-think for opponent like City and victims, how we play seems to suit them perfectly and they kill us. Though I don't think this friendly performance was totally down to tactics, we just have players who aren't yet at their full level.

We'll go away to Saudi Sportswashing Machine and crush them, then you will all forget about this

 

[DeleHarry]

I think we will have problems against sides like City and victims in the PL, and against most of our CL opponents.

Against every other team in the PL we will pick up plenty of points and good perfomances.

 

[DeleHarry]

Also we seem to be conceding goals at a worrying rate. 2 against PSG, 3 against Roma, 3 against City

Shows how important Wanyama is and has been in protecting that back 4

 

[AdamB]

I think we will have problems against sides like City and victims in the PL, and against most of our CL opponents.

Against every other team in the PL we will pick up plenty of points and good perfomances.

So we'll finish 5th or 6th then?!?

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Yes, but they are signing players to offset that. We aren't. Individually, none of their signings have really impressed me so far (except perhaps for Bernardo Silva), but they are all building deep squads. Whether or not they're doing it wisely is another matter, but they are addressing that particular deficiency.

We so far haven't done so. If anything, we've made it worse by selling a first-team player to a rival and subsequently sitting on our hands until the end of July. So I think that concern is still more valid for us than it is for our rivals.

Well Chelsea have signed like for like on players they have lost so IMO are no stronger and their new stellar striker has score less goals in his career for massively dominant side than Kane has since last Jan

United have too unless the new centre back turns out to be a worldie

Arse and pool have signed in areas they were string already and havent addressed their weaknesses

City have strengthened but are also gonna sell a lot of players now and their squad then looks weaker than it does now. Their clear favourites but when you see that their playing 3 centre backs and denayer is their next cover you can see the weakness there

 

[Bedfordspurs]

So we'll finish 5th or 6th then?!?

That's how arse maintained top 4 every season

 

[Bedfordspurs]

Right, I'll grant you that - but Chelsea started Batshuayi and Willian and still held us to 2-2 before bringing on the big hitters to finish us off. Whereas we played all our best players (including inexplicably shoehorning Son in at left-back) and *still* couldn't manage to make the advantage count before the strength of their bench became decisive.

If we'd started with Janssen, would we even have gotten to 2-2 in the first place? Kane scored the first with an outrageously improvised back header across Courtois - would Janssen have done the same? Based on last season's form, probably not. And that in itself tells a story, imo - that their squad players could keep us contained before the big hitters finished us off, while ours likely wouldn't have been able to do the same at the time.

Chelsea scored with every shot on target in that game IIRC

Would that happen normally or was that outrageous fortune and also a worldie goal from matic (plus Poch strange call on son playing WB)

 

[DeleHarry]

So we'll finish 5th or 6th then?!?

Well there are only 4 out of 38 games where we will struggle to get any points (City and victims), so from the other 34 games we could pick up enough to get in the top 4

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

Yes, but they are signing players to offset that. We aren't. Individually, none of their signings have really impressed me so far (except perhaps for Bernardo Silva), but they are all building deep squads. Whether or not they're doing it wisely is another matter, but they are addressing that particular deficiency.

We so far haven't done so. If anything, we've made it worse by selling a first-team player to a rival and subsequently sitting on our hands until the end of July. So I think that concern is still more valid for us than it is for our rivals.

But you have to accept the varying ability of each club to do what you suggest. City, Chelsea and Man U are in a completely different place than us.

We are a victim of our own rapid accent.

Levy and Poch have clearly indicated (verbally) our current direction during this US tour.

That Chelsea fa semi example you gave is nonsense. They left their star match winners on the bench to bring on, that well known 'how to win a game' masterclass tactic akin to us leaving Kane and Alli on the bench. All my Chelsea mates thought WTF was conte doing.

And stop saying ' if we want to improve on last season' . It's highly unlikely we will, even with two signings.

We are where we are.

In fact we are where Poch and Levy say we are. Over achieving while heading towards a new era.

The way they talk...........they don't want to jeopardise that.

 

[90291Spur]

Did you watch the naffing game?
Bleeding site is full of happy-clappers.

No. Because it's a naffing pres season friendly and the only important thing is no injuries. Remember the season we tonked EVERYONE pre season including 5-0 against Roma? That was a rubbish year and the great preseason meant NOTHING.