parklane1
Tony Galvin
I have no sympathy for the idiots who actually voted them in as they knew exactly what the Torys would do, screw the less well of and help those who are not. One nation one dream my arse.
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Politics, politics, politics
- Thread starter markysimmo
- Start date
I have no sympathy for the idiots who actually voted them in as they knew exactly what the Torys would do, screw the less well of and help those who are not. One nation one dream my arse.
Gilzeantoscore
Justin Edinburgh
What passes for the mainstream media, are part of the economic elite that the Tories represent. They have always let them get away with murder. Have to agree with Parklane, in that you get the government you deserve.
Corbyn is doing pretty well in this leadership race, so far. When you actually listen to the other three, it's not surprising really. He has actual, guiding principles that lead to potential policies, he says what he thinks and answers questions put to him. I've paid my £3 to vote for him (got my wife, my parents and a couple of people from work to do the same) and if he wins, I would join the Labour Party.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
The problem is he tells the honest truth and sticks to his principles unlike most Politicians, unfortunately most of the public will only vote on what they think is best for them not what is best for all.
But it's not what is best for all. The majority do not want the country to be run the way he wants it to be run. And guess what, if people vote for what's best for them and the majority vote for a particular party/set of policies, then surely that set of policies are best for all.
And what is the honest truth? Do you know why politicians are cagey about answering questions? It's because if you want to be a true representative of your constituency, or your country, you have to cater for a huge range of different people. What is the truth for one person, might not be for someone else. What's the right opinion for one, might be the wrong one for someone else.
Corbyn is probably the most unelectable person the Labour party could find.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
That is the only bit I agree with I have said earlier in the thread it was very unlikely he would be elected, the truth is he has principles ( if you believe that or not) and the average voter in this country would not know principles if they fell over them. They prefer the sound bites that they get from the likes of Cameron, Blair, etc deep down they know they are being lied too but its a case of " I'm all right jack" and if its good for me that's all I care about principle.
Which is why they got £3 out of me.
#toriesforcorbyn
parklane1
Tony Galvin
So every time a party who promises to do something and does the opposite you think they are not lying to you? that explains a lot.
When has anyone promised to do something and then done the opposite? Give me an example.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
Not much point really, if you do not already know what has been changed from the promises made I would be wasting my breath. Especially if you are one of those who believe they have never been lied to by a party.
Try me.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
Especially if you are one of those who believe they have never been lied to by a party.
Well maybe you can make me unbelieve? Not that I ever said never. But you seem either very reluctant, or just unable to provide me with at least one example.
Yep:
http://www.politics.co.uk/blogs/2015/07/16/belief-in-homeopathy-is-a-moral-test
Although quite why a mental socialist believing in other mental, entirely ineffective ideals is surprising is beyond me.
His world view and reality are so far apart that I wouldn't be surprised if he claimed to have a pet unicorn in his garden.
Maybe. But let's try and get him in as leader of Labour and then go from there. I think the public will like some of his policies and the fact that he is an honest, conviction politician.
Public ownership of railways - polls well with the public.
Public ownership of utilities - polls well.
Higher taxes for the wealthy - polls well.
Not wanting to go to war in Syria - polls well.
His views on immigration and the Royal Family don't poll so well. His stance on benefit cuts will probably win him friends as those who claim in-work benefits and voted Tory find themselves to be out of pocket over the next couple of years. There's a large pool of voters who don't vote, many of them young. His policies are pro young people and perhaps he can make gains from those who don't vote due to the "they are all the same" attitudes.
Apparently, the SNP put on a million more votes in the election just gone -- 500k from other parties (mainly Labour) and 500k from the 'don't vote' pool of voters. Scotland voted to remain part of the UK, but the Scots still went to the SNP for their anti-austerity policies. Things can change.
Also, whilst Corbyn's views on immigration won't play well with a lot of UKIP voters, the fact that he is willing to entertain leaving the EU might well do.
He's not a messiah, he's not got 100% perfect policies, but I agree with a lot of what he says and the positions he sets out. Galvanise the youth vote and who knows?
He's got to win the leadership first though
Maybe. But let's try and get him in as leader of Labour and then go from there. I think the public will like some of his policies and the fact that he is an honest, conviction politician.
Public ownership of railways - polls well with the public.
Public ownership of utilities - polls well.
Higher taxes for the wealthy - polls well.
Not wanting to go to war in Syria - polls well.
His views on immigration and the Royal Family don't poll so well. His stance on benefit cuts will probably win him friends as those who claim in-work benefits and voted Tory find themselves to be out of pocket over the next couple of years. There's a large pool of voters who don't vote, many of them young. His policies are pro young people and perhaps he can make gains from those who don't vote due to the "they are all the same" attitudes.
Apparently, the SNP put on a million more votes in the election just gone -- 500k from other parties (mainly Labour) and 500k from the 'don't vote' pool of voters. Scotland voted to remain part of the UK, but the Scots still went to the SNP for their anti-austerity policies. Things can change.
Also, whilst Corbyn's views on immigration won't play well with a lot of UKIP voters, the fact that he is willing to entertain leaving the EU might well do.
He's not a messiah, he's not got 100% perfect policies, but I agree with a lot of what he says and the positions he sets out. Galvanise the youth vote and who knows?
He's got to win the leadership first though
All of Ed Millibands policies polled well. Its very different being asked who you like the sound of by a polling company and being in a polling booth thinking about who you'd want running the show.
The polls were way out at the last election for that reason.
Of course, you can't fully trust polls anymore, but -- for example -- if they show a number like 66% support for re-nationalising the railways, then you can assume it is a popular policy amongst the public. They won't be THAT far out, surely?
Miliband had no really bold policies either. Labour, under him, voted through the austerity measures of the Tories. Nothing as bold (or popular) as public ownership of rail and utilities. They were looking to fall over the line with a 35% strategy, placing too much faith in polling. Some people, like me, voted for him because they thought he was the least worst, not because he inspired them to vote. And then many of the other 'undecideds' made the choice of the devil they know. Many millions of others were thoroughly turned off by the whole process and voted for nobody.
Clearer choices are better for democracy. The Tories exist already, so that ground is covered. If you agree with their way, you can vote for them. The Lib Dems have painted themselves as the party of the centre (something the electorate didn't respect too much at the last election). So if you want that, you can vote for them. Labour could then offer a proper choice to the left.
Corbyn might be more 'hard left' but his policies are really centre left (evidenced by their popularity in opinion polls). He's not asking for control of every corner shop. Publicly owned rail and utility companies and free university tuition is something that is done in other nations such as Germany, they aren't ideas from the USSR. A politician that wants to make the debate about policy rather than personality is refreshing, part of the reason for his popularity in this leadership race.
Anyway, he's got to win the leadership first, else it's all moot.