parklane1
Tony Galvin
They are finished as a major party, they made their bed ( saving camerons job) and lost whatever credibility they had.
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Politics, politics, politics
- Thread starter markysimmo
- Start date
They are finished as a major party, they made their bed ( saving camerons job) and lost whatever credibility they had.
Exactly, nothing to lose.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
Our faith went first, after 25 years of failing to get it to reform.
Personally I can't see it surviving 5 years for there to be anything to rejoin - the nexit will see it crumble as quickly as the Soviet Union 30 years before
SpurMeUp
Les Howe
A bit like a hard tackle in the box, if its your side that clears the ball you'll let it pass...or scream blue murder if you're denied the result you want because of it
UKIP very very purposefully ensured the last few weeks of the campaign were not about the economy. They knew a year before, that if the last weeks arguments were about the economy, they would lose the vote. They got in US polling consultants and their plan was to make brexit about immigration and the NHS, just so long as it wasn't about the economy. Banks, UKIPs funder, is on record openly explaining all this post referendum.
The NHS money, the posters on immigration, the claim that it would be "madness" to leave the single market and we'd exit the EU but stay in the single market somehow, are all false promises. None of them deliverable. We have rules on commercial advertising. You can't sell something and claim it will do something it won't. The reality of Brexit are promises made by a bunch of rich folks who were desperate to get their own way. Banks, Farrage, millionaires with off shore tax free facilities, they are not affected by government spending cuts! Government cuts, not the EU, negatively effect people on the ground. In fact the EU protects a lot of working class people with enhanced rights. Working time directive. The Equalities Act. Both had input from the UK and became EU law. The Disability Discrimination Act was a UK act, that was improved upon and added to by the EU. The working time directive we had an opt out for but only if employees sign to agree to. In essence isn't it a good thing to ensure people have a quality of life? Or is this not something you approve of? Of course UKIP wouldn't refer to this. The British rich don't like these laws at all. Laws that protect working people, so they call it 'a loss of sovereignty'! Genius.
Instead of a fair debate, looking at the economy, and what laws the EU actually imposes on us, we had 3 key promises from Leave:
1. ‘Let’s give our NHS the £350m the EU takes every week’
2. ‘A vote for leave will be a vote to cut immigration’
3. ‘Five million more migrants could enter Britain by 2030 if Turkey and four other applicant countries join the EU’
Two about immigration, one about giving the money we spend on the EU to the NHS. All credit to UKIP strategists, they spent Arron Banks millions well. They laid down 3 excellent, powerful and persuasive reasons to vote out. If they were true I would have voted out too. But they weren't true. And the price we will pay to stop immigration may be extremely high.
I want to get away from any kind of blame game though. A vote to leave wasn't stupid, most people were not duped, but I do think remain didn't get their arguments across, and there should be some kind of false advertising fines or comeuppance in politics - maybe a rerun when the truth is out? Had those 3 core campaign statements not been on the table, would there have been a 2% or more swing the other way in your opinion? In other words they were crucial imo.
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Gilzeantoscore
Justin Edinburgh
Yeah, they're hypocritical fudgesticks too!
johnola
Jermaine Jenas
Just a reminder that the referendum question was very very simple.
The disadvantage remain had was two decades of out of control bureaucratic heavy handedness and pursuit of a radical philosophy.
The question only asked if I wanted to leave that.
fudge yes.
We have the rest of eternity to get the economy right and extend our nations remarkable record of fighting against tyranny and for humanity.
We should all be looking forward not backward.
The disadvantage remain had was two decades of out of control bureaucratic heavy handedness and pursuit of a radical philosophy.
The question only asked if I wanted to leave that.
fudge yes.
We have the rest of eternity to get the economy right and extend our nations remarkable record of fighting against tyranny and for humanity.
We should all be looking forward not backward.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
Two good outcomes then
Now McGuiness and the blood on their hands IRA generation are largely out of frontline politics, I'd be happy for their cause to triump
SteveAWOL
Chris Jones
Rorschach
Sonny Walters
It may start the ball rolling but unification is a long way off. I imagine there will be some sort of transitional state created where the north are viewed as a separate political entity to Britain as a stepping stone on path to reunification. If Scotland opt out too that will likely accelerate everything.
The return of a hard border will be an unmitigated disaster though, and hopefully not a catalyst for a return to past tensions.
Does that mean we get to stop paying for them?
Pretty much everyone Irish that I know is perfectly happy with the level of integration they currently have, as any more would be ruinously expensive.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
The two barriers are:
i) In the last census (2011) the population split was 48% protestant, 45% catholic. Catholic birthrate is higher and they have a majority in under 16s. But it will be a few more years until there's an overall Catholic majority (when the border poll gets triggered)
ii) There's some doubt as to whether Ireland actually wants it back. Although it has got a lot better in the last 15 years, it is still the poorest part of the UK and poorer than Ireland. In some ways Ireland will need to brace itself for a big economic drain, like West Germany did and South Korea has long been planning for
But yes, the Scotland issue is important too, as the cultural links with protestant NI are with Scotland, not England and Wales.
Rorschach
Sonny Walters
Every Irish person would in principle love the reunification of the island but as you say the financial implications for the Irish state would be too much to handle at this point. I'm certain it will happen at some point though. I suspect it will be as a slow drawn out process over many years rather than severing of the umbilical cord to Britain overnight. This border issue certainly could be the jump off point and as gutterboy says the impetus for change will gather pace once there is a Catholic majority in the provence.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
I just watched PMQs on iplayer. May is phucking awful and makes Corbyn look like Martin Luther King.
So Tories bunged Surrey council to avoid them having a referendum on raising council tax to pay for social care. The guy in charge of Surrey council texted the wrong 'Nick' and this information was forwarded to Corbyn -- oops. What a shower of qunts.
So Tories bunged Surrey council to avoid them having a referendum on raising council tax to pay for social care. The guy in charge of Surrey council texted the wrong 'Nick' and this information was forwarded to Corbyn -- oops. What a shower of qunts.
Millsy_Yiddo
Naybet
Being from Northern Ireland myself I can tell you that the general consensus is that the people in the south don't really want us back due to factors you've already mentioned and there are also a fair number of Catholics who don't want to go back for fear of all business/commerce etc in Belfast relocating to Dublin and leaving the North essentially fudged. Loss of free healthcare and all that is also a factor.
You're right about the protestant link between us and Scotland which does mean Scotland may have a big part to play.
Glenda's Legs
Paul Walsh
A Conservative councillor has been suspended after retweeting a "completely unacceptable" message which portrayed Diane Abbott as an ape wearing lipstick.
Alan Pearmain, the deputy chairman of the South Ribble Conservative Association, shared a picture of an Orangutan which included the strapline "get the Diane Abbott look". He added a comment to the original post which said: "Nice lips kid. But a shade too much rouge."
A Conservative spokesman said: “His comments are completely unacceptable and he has been suspended from the party, pending an investigation.”
In his Twitter profile, Mr Pearmain describes himself as “positioned slightly to the right of Attila the Hun”. He denied that the tweet, first reported by the Lancashire Evening Post, was racist.
He told The Guardian: “I’m almost 70, I’ve been asked to apologise on many, many occasions. Sometimes it warrants apologising, sometimes it doesn’t. Sometimes you have to stand up for your principles.
“Can you tell me what’s wrong with the tweet? I thought it was her size and her appearance, nothing to do with colour.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ns-bar/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Just wow. That anyone in a position of some authority would think it is acceptable to tweet something like that is staggering. The reasoning as to why it was OK almost as much so.
There' may be many things Diane Abbott could be ridiculed for, politics-related, without having to resort to racism and misogyny.
And the Telegraph make their headline about a different, sub-story, which is really a nothing story.
Alan Pearmain, the deputy chairman of the South Ribble Conservative Association, shared a picture of an Orangutan which included the strapline "get the Diane Abbott look". He added a comment to the original post which said: "Nice lips kid. But a shade too much rouge."
A Conservative spokesman said: “His comments are completely unacceptable and he has been suspended from the party, pending an investigation.”
In his Twitter profile, Mr Pearmain describes himself as “positioned slightly to the right of Attila the Hun”. He denied that the tweet, first reported by the Lancashire Evening Post, was racist.
He told The Guardian: “I’m almost 70, I’ve been asked to apologise on many, many occasions. Sometimes it warrants apologising, sometimes it doesn’t. Sometimes you have to stand up for your principles.
“Can you tell me what’s wrong with the tweet? I thought it was her size and her appearance, nothing to do with colour.”
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ns-bar/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Just wow. That anyone in a position of some authority would think it is acceptable to tweet something like that is staggering. The reasoning as to why it was OK almost as much so.
There' may be many things Diane Abbott could be ridiculed for, politics-related, without having to resort to racism and misogyny.
And the Telegraph make their headline about a different, sub-story, which is really a nothing story.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
At last someone from the Torys has admitted the NHS is in a mess, most folks who has tried to use that service over the last few years could have told him that. But the NHS is in safe hands with the Torys or so they have been saying for years.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/jeremy-hunt-finally-admits-nhs-9794549
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/jeremy-hunt-finally-admits-nhs-9794549
Gilzeantoscore
Justin Edinburgh
Anyone noticed how the fascists have been coming out of the wood work and from under their rocks of late? I wonder what has boosted the self belief of these maggots?