Politics, politics, politics (so long and thanks for all the fish)

[P.D.]

As I said, if it's done right, coming up with a bunch of hypotheticals and assumptions isn't proof that it's unworkable.

It's not hypotheticals though, people have money in assets - not many have tens of millions sitting in cash so in my view these are basic questions that need answers before you could put this tax in.

 

[Glenda's Legs]

So he’s gone (going). Good resignation speech I thought.

 

[Robspur12]

The treatment of Starmer by the press, the Labour Party and the public has been nothing short of appalling. Yeah for sure he has been an underwhelming PM. But the visceral hated of the man in many quarters is completely disproportionate to the reality. When you have chancers like Boris and Farage held up as heros, even a Liz Truss budget hailed in the right wing press, it is clear that there is one rule for right wing politicians even those on the hard right and another for left wing ones even centre left.

People may choose to forget that Starmer has had to navigate some difficult political waters both at home and internationally. He's endured personal abuse, had his car firebombed and what it must be like for his kids, one can only imagine. Those circumstances would have broken a lot of people. However criticize him all you like but it's hard to say the man hasn't shown tremendous resolve, dignity and calmness. He has been much classier than what preceded him. Burnham will face the same challenges and I'm sure won't have a magic wand to wave to make it all better.

One thing's for sure though, if Badenoch and Davy push for a General election the country will get Farage as a PM. Then, as we saw with his appalling defense of race riots in Northern Ireland, his closeness to Trump, and his mysterious donors who want him to deregulate cryptocurrency and certain parts of the internet, the country will be in serious trouble.

I hope this gamble by the Labour party pays off. But I won't thank them for it.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Irony is, that was one of his best speeches

 

[Gutter Boy]

The treatment of Starmer by the press, the Labour Party and the public has been nothing short of appalling. Yeah for sure he has been an underwhelming PM. But the visceral hated of the man in many quarters is completely disproportionate to the reality. When you have chancers like Boris and Farage held up as heros, even a Liz Truss budget hailed in the right wing press, it is clear that there is one rule for right wing politicians even those on the hard right and another for left wing ones even centre left.

People may choose to forget that Starmer has had to navigate some difficult political waters both at home and internationally. He's endured personal abuse, had his car firebombed and what it must be like for his kids, one can only imagine. Those circumstances would have broken a lot of people. However criticize him all you like but it's hard to say the man hasn't shown tremendous resolve, dignity and calmness. He has been much classier than what preceded him. Burnham will face the same challenges and I'm sure won't have a magic wand to wave to make it all better.

One thing's for sure though, if Badenoch and Davy push for a General election the country will get Farage as a PM. Then, as we saw with his appalling defense of race riots in Northern Ireland, his closeness to Trump, and his mysterious donors who want him to deregulate cryptocurrency and certain parts of the internet, the country will be in serious trouble.

I hope this gamble by the Labour party pays off. But I won't thank them for it.

It happened a bit with Michael Foot in the early 80s. He got ridiculed and hounded mostly out for having a brick car and being a bit scruffy

The Starmer hated has mostly been stirred by the tabloids and GBBies, which stayed on war footing after the election. But he has been a bit crap and just a continuation Sunak, which isn't what anyone wanted

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

It's not hypotheticals though, people have money in assets - not many have tens of millions sitting in cash so in my view these are basic questions that need answers before you could put this tax in.

Assets that rake massive amounts in passive income.....wealth gain from doing literally nothing. At bare minimum no labour input.

Obviously we all have a bit of this to some level....so we are talking about people in the highest echelons.

Each year their wealth grows via income, capital gain or dividends....so it's not 'tied up' at that point, so that's the opportunity to tax.

Yes yes, they'll all run off to other countries (they won't) and we'll lose their input into trickle down economics (the loss not being that great as we are essentially talking about a relatively small amount of people)

 

[ricky2tricky4city]

It's not hypotheticals though, people have money in assets - not many have tens of millions sitting in cash so in my view these are basic questions that need answers before you could put this tax in.

Assets that rake massive amounts in passive income.....wealth gain from doing literally nothing. At bare minimum no labour input.

Obviously we all have a bit of this to some level....so we are talking about people in the highest echelons.

Each year their wealth grows via income, capital gain or dividends....so it's not 'tied up' at that point, so that's the opportunity to tax.

Yes yes, they'll all run off to other countries (they won't) and we'll lose their input into trickle down economics (the loss not being that great as we are essentially talking about a relatively small amount of people)

 

[P.D.]

Assets that rake massive amounts in passive income.....wealth gain from doing literally nothing. At bare minimum no labour input.

Obviously we all have a bit of this to some level....so we are talking about people in the highest echelons.

Each year their wealth grows via income, capital gain or dividends....so it's not 'tied up' at that point, so that's the opportunity to tax.

Yes yes, they'll all run off to other countries (they won't) and we'll lose their input into trickle down economics (the loss not being that great as we are essentially talking about a relatively small amount of people)

It's not wealth gain for nothing, we need people to invest and take risks knowing there's rewards for it. Ultimately it's detrimental to disincentive an entrepreneurial culture and is the reason why barely any places have a wealth tax. I believe they have it in Switzerland but then they don't have capital gains or inheritance tax which balances is out.

 

[Mikey10]

The treatment of Starmer by the press, the Labour Party and the public has been nothing short of appalling. Yeah for sure he has been an underwhelming PM. But the visceral hated of the man in many quarters is completely disproportionate to the reality. When you have chancers like Boris and Farage held up as heros, even a Liz Truss budget hailed in the right wing press, it is clear that there is one rule for right wing politicians even those on the hard right and another for left wing ones even centre left.

People may choose to forget that Starmer has had to navigate some difficult political waters both at home and internationally. He's endured personal abuse, had his car firebombed and what it must be like for his kids, one can only imagine. Those circumstances would have broken a lot of people. However criticize him all you like but it's hard to say the man hasn't shown tremendous resolve, dignity and calmness. He has been much classier than what preceded him. Burnham will face the same challenges and I'm sure won't have a magic wand to wave to make it all better.

One thing's for sure though, if Badenoch and Davy push for a General election the country will get Farage as a PM. Then, as we saw with his appalling defense of race riots in Northern Ireland, his closeness to Trump, and his mysterious donors who want him to deregulate cryptocurrency and certain parts of the internet, the country will be in serious trouble.

I hope this gamble by the Labour party pays off. But I won't thank them for it.

Most surprising to me is the way in which the progressive centre and left of centre have also been laying into him from a few weeks into his time in office. The Two Matts podcast, for example, which comes out of the New World Magazine, have been ripping him apart for 18+ months now.

Anyhow, it should be fine. Burnham dresses like he's off to see The La's, and he got the trams running on time, so what could possibly go wrong?

 

[Robspur12]

It's not wealth gain for nothing, we need people to invest and take risks knowing there's rewards for it. Ultimately it's detrimental to disincentive an entrepreneurial culture and is the reason why barely any places have a wealth tax. I believe they have it in Switzerland but then they don't have capital gains or inheritance tax which balances is out.

Also, if you have worked hard to build those assets and save, then to me, it doesn't seem fair to just tax those assets to death. It doesn't necessarily make you rich because you own assets. We seem to only think of asset wealth as being for the super wealthy or dodgy criminal types who collect assets or use them to launder their money.

 

[Rorschach]

The treatment of Starmer by the press, the Labour Party and the public has been nothing short of appalling. Yeah for sure he has been an underwhelming PM. But the visceral hated of the man in many quarters is completely disproportionate to the reality. When you have chancers like Boris and Farage held up as heros, even a Liz Truss budget hailed in the right wing press, it is clear that there is one rule for right wing politicians even those on the hard right and another for left wing ones even centre left.

People may choose to forget that Starmer has had to navigate some difficult political waters both at home and internationally. He's endured personal abuse, had his car firebombed and what it must be like for his kids, one can only imagine. Those circumstances would have broken a lot of people. However criticize him all you like but it's hard to say the man hasn't shown tremendous resolve, dignity and calmness. He has been much classier than what preceded him. Burnham will face the same challenges and I'm sure won't have a magic wand to wave to make it all better.

One thing's for sure though, if Badenoch and Davy push for a General election the country will get Farage as a PM. Then, as we saw with his appalling defense of race riots in Northern Ireland, his closeness to Trump, and his mysterious donors who want him to deregulate cryptocurrency and certain parts of the internet, the country will be in serious trouble.

I hope this gamble by the Labour party pays off. But I won't thank them for it.

One could argue that Starmers tenure played very much into Reform's hands. His courting of the right-wing vote, which frankly he was never going to win, effectively vindicated Reform's extreme position on immigration. This was a tactical mistake IMO, and one which Labour voters rightly saw as a betrayal.

There was good stuff in there too, but he managed to tinkle off a lot of his support through largely avoidable mistakes.

 

[Robspur12]

Most surprising to me is the way in which the progressive centre and left of centre have also been laying into him from a few weeks into his time in office. The Two Matts podcast, for example, which comes out of the New World Magazine, have been ripping him apart for 18+ months now.

Anyhow, it should be fine. Burnham dresses like he's off to see The La's, and he got the trams running on time, so what could possibly go wrong?

The Labour Party have been awful through this. As I say he hasn't been a great PM but fudge me he's had some challenges and he's kept us out of the brick show war in Iran. In that respect, he has shown better judgement than Tony Blair

 

[Robspur12]

One could argue that Starmers tenure played very much into Reform's hands. His courting of the right-wing vote, which frankly he was never going to win, effectively vindicated Reform's extreme position on immigration. This was a tactical mistake IMO, and one which Labour voters rightly saw as a betrayal.

There was good stuff in there too, but he managed to tinkle off a lot of his support through largely avoidable mistakes.

For sure, but there has been no quarter given for those mistakes or any kind of acknowledgement of what he has done well. I think the main reason has been he's been a bit bland and hasn't communicated well. He also chose the wrong advisors. The whole Mandelson thing was a particular brick show from his Spads.

And I think the worse thing? The disloyalty shown by the Labour Party to someone who won them a massive majority. No one seems to have stood up for him and challenged the criticism and bile.

 

[Gutter Boy]

Also, if you have worked hard to build those assets and save, then to me, it doesn't seem fair to just tax those assets to death. It doesn't necessarily make you rich because you own assets. We seem to only think of asset wealth as being for the super wealthy or dodgy criminal types who collect assets or use them to launder their money.

What if it's because your ancestors fought with William at Hastings? Then stole everyone's land through enclosure. And later on they were slave traders. That's where most people who have large assets in the present got them from

 

[Robspur12]

What if it's because your ancestors fought with William at Hastings? Then stole everyone's land through enclosure. And later on they were slave traders. That's where most people who have large assets in the present got them from

For those examples there are millions of of ordinary people who own assets just through hard work. And we shouldn't flog them to death for it ..

 

[Gutter Boy]

The Labour Party have been awful through this. As I say he hasn't been a great PM but fudge me he's had some challenges and he's kept us out of the brick show war in Iran. In that respect, he has shown better judgement than Tony Blair

I think he'd be a decent Foreign Sec for Burnham. He was good on Iran and Ukraine, ok with Trump, although poor on Palestine (should have been closer to Spain on that)

 

[Gutter Boy]

For those examples there are millions of of ordinary people who own assets just through hard work. And we should flog them to death for it ..

That's why Land Value Tax is the best way to go. That and equalising Capital Gains with Income Tax largely fixes fairness for the future

 

[Rorschach]

For sure, but there has been no quarter given for those mistakes or any kind of acknowledgement of what he has done well. I think the main reason has been he's been a bit bland and hasn't communicated well. He also chose the wrong advisors. The whole Mandelson thing was a particular brick show from his Spads.

I agree with that. You gotta sell your own accomplishments, since UK media will give you little credit.

I wasn't a fan of Starmer for lots of reasons. His position on Gaza and the draconian crackdown on protesters was unforgivable in my eyes, but he was far better than what went before.

 

[Rorschach]

For those examples there are millions of of ordinary people who own assets just through hard work. And we should flog them to death for it ..

The proposals for the wealth tax I have seen floated around hit only abut 20,000 people in the UK. The ones at the very top.

 

[Glenda's Legs]

So Streeting has confirmed he is not going to stand.
Looks like it’s a coronation then unless someone else throws their hat into the ring jut so that there is an election.