***OMT - Tottenham Hotspur v Borussia Dortmund - first leg***

[Jurgen the German]

Plus being second in the league - even the league that we have this season - is an over-achievement so there was no urgent rush to get a second striker just to have a warm body there. And don't give me the City and Chelsea and Manure will be so much stronger next season, because they might not be.

What happens if Kane gets injured?

 

[Modric THFC]

we're having our greatest league campaign of the modern era

that suggests it's been prioritised since August

we felt we could do well so sent a strong team out against Qarabeg

tonight we still felt we could do well so sent a strong team out against Dortmund too

I'm feeling a lot of disrespect for some of our players, it's a squad game these days, 11 good players won't get you anywhere, 12 months ago Bentaleb was "first choice" and Dembele wasn't, Chadli was, Lamela wasnt, things change, everyone has their part to play, I trust Poch to manage that and don't think for a second that tonight's result would have been different with the starting 11 from the Arsenal game, if anything it would have been worse

It hasn't been prioritised since August.
9 points from the 6 league games that followed the Europa group ones.

Our league position is to spite the Europa League

Everyone on here wanted to play a weaker team against Qarabag.
If you look at the omt the only one arguing anything against was GutterBoy who presciently thought we would be fighting it out with Liverpool for 5/6.

 

[Jurgen the German]

That's key. They perfected the double pivot as a pairing. Carroll just didn't seem to grasp the responsibilities or the positioning required of the role. He's also not and alrounder like our other CMs - his defensive contribution is poor.

Perfected it? Didn't we concede about 55 goals last season? The whole reason for Dier's switch to DM was his ability to think defensively first and keep it simple.

 

[Baleforce]

It hasn't been prioritised since August.
9 points from the 6 league games that followed the Europa group ones.

Our league position is to spite the Europa League

Everyone on here wanted to play a weaker team against Qarabag.
If you look at the omt the only one arguing anything against was GutterBoy who presciently thought we would be fighting it out with Liverpool for 5/6.

accrued points don't prove or disprove intent

I thought we'd be looking at 5/6 myself, look how wrong we both were

 

[Jurgen the German]

We should just forfeit all the CL games next season. Need to concentrate on the league.

Players want to play in the CL. We have a greater chance of signing Dortmund level players if we are in the CL next season. The league represents our best chance of doing that.

 

[metalgear]

OK we are going out of the Europa. I always thought that this was the Europa final I wanted. Any I don't think we'd have beaten a full strength and fully focussed Dortmund in the final, so might as well get it over and done with. Onwards to winning the league !

 

[glorygloryeze]

we're having our greatest league campaign of the modern era

that suggests it's been prioritised since August

we felt we could do well so sent a strong team out against Qarabeg

tonight we still felt we could do well so sent a strong team out against Dortmund too

I'm feeling a lot of disrespect for some of our players, it's a squad game these days, 11 good players won't get you anywhere, 12 months ago Bentaleb was "first choice" and Dembele wasn't, Chadli was, Lamela wasnt, things change, everyone has their part to play, I trust Poch to manage that and don't think for a second that tonight's result would have been different with the starting 11 from the Arsenal game, if anything it would have been worse

Some fair points - apart from the bolded bit!

 

[jabbathehut]

romantics vs pragmatists basically sums it up.I think Poch did the right thing in a game that we had very little chance of winning anyway.We have different fish to fry this season.Its a cliche but we have 9 cup finals to the end of the season we will need every ounce of energy from a team that generally has given 100% every game.Something had to give and it was Dortmund tonight that gave.If we are 5th or 6th its a different story.

 

[dawaxman]

So as I said above, once we're in the CL next season (hopefully), do we do this then as well?

Sorry Dier and Kane, you're not starting at the Camp Nou, we're saving you for the league match this weekend? Especially galling when as Modric THFC has pointed out, we have tired them out potentially by playing them in so many games, some of which you could perhaps argue they were not needed in?

What a lovely conundrum

 

[Jurgen the German]

Can understand the frustration with the team selection. I personally believe Poch did the right thing though, I would have played Dier (assuming he was fit, but I agree with the decision to rest Dembele and Kane. I would have started Lamela.

The Europa League had more importance when we were trying and mostly failing to finish in the top 4 so the EL represented a great chance of CL football, but the goals have changed this season, this is our realistic first shot at the title in 20 years. And even if we don't win the league, we HAVE to finish in the top 4 given the position we are in now. West Ham and United are chasing us.

I get people saying the Europa League is a trophy that we must try to win, but the game has changed now. Like it or lump it, players want to play in the CL and owners want their teams to play in it for the revenue it generates their clubs. The aim is to get regular CL football, which hopefully will bring better players which will ulimately help us and increase our chances of winning said cups and league titles. I don't believe the Premier League is condusive to doing well in the Europa League. Yeah sure Chelsea won it, but they were a CL team playing in a competition they shouldn't have been playing in. Who was the last English team to win the EL besides Chelsea?

I'm sorry but a realistic shot at the title should always trump a last 16 tie in the Europa League. I have always said we should rest players for this competition and perhaps revisit taking it more seriously should we progress to the last 8 and beyond. I'm more annoyed we didn't play our best team in the FA Cup to be truthful, we had Crystal fecking Palace at home and would have played Reading in the quarter finals had we won!

The first priority in the summer should be signing backup for Kane. I don't quite understand how a team for which the aim at the start of the season was a top 4 finish can seriously believe that having one recognised striker in the squad is sufficient, no more of this "oh Chadli CAN play up there" or "Son can do a job up there", please just sign someone.

One more thing, tonight just shows how wrong people are when they say our league is the best in the world. I'd say it's the most physically demanding, but not in terms of quality or technical ability. Granted we played a weakened team, but English teams tend to get found out in Europe when they come up against top class opposition.

 

[imcallingbullsh*t]

Poch has the medical data regarding fitness, if we needed to rest players then thats what we need to do.
Arsenal continually play players in the Red Zone and suffer injuries as a result, it doesnt show anything about the quality of us or english football. I would have liked to see a full strength Dortmund play Barcelona without Suarez, Messi, Neymar, Busquets and Mascherano

It was a really difficult game, and Poch has decided to go for the league rather than the EL... Everyone should read that before even thinking of posting anything negative.

 

[spasm]

Dortmund at a different level.
If Poch sticks around, that's where I'd hope we'd be at in the next 3 or so years..

 

[90291Spur]

What happens if Kane gets injured?

I am not an expert in this but I think he would not play until he was fit again and someone else would play in his place.

 

[thfcsteff]

I agree Steff so why was the rotation less in he earlier stages of the season? Why were we playing such strong teams in the group stages if, once it came down to it, we wouldn't bother anyway?

I agree he needs to see but as I was saying, I don't consider myself a footballing genius in any way, nor even particularly knowledgeable about football.

What I can tell you thought is that we should not be going to top European teams away with Mason and Carroll as our central midfield pair. We should not have Chadli as a backup striker if we don't feel confident enough using him in domestic league games and only in European games (and he is not good enough again to play upfront away against these kinds of sides).

I don't particuarly feel any of us, whether us lay people in the stands/ internet or Poch need to see us picked apart by Dortmund to know that.

In the spirit of discussion my friend...I would wager that playing strong teams in the group stages was more like playing only a couple of 'fringe' player each time so as they could get up to speed with real time matches and experience. Fold them in gradually around established quality. Without EL this season, I doubt Tripper and Davies would've been able ready for so much rotation in the Prem from early winter on, Onuha wouldn't have been an option, Wimmer wouldn't have even had a couple of games before stepping in and up.

I believe he will by who he wants as a backup forward player in the summer, and I don't think he can be blamed for giving Carroll and Mason a shot. Personally? Mason and Bentaleb all day, but sometimes mate, sometimes that meritocracy is more important in the long run to preserve squad unity and fairness.

Finally, after two very hard games against West Ham and the goons, we have absolutely NO idea who was carrying knocks/in need of treatment/a rest, etc. I will tell you that us lay people could see Dier was absolutely knackered on Saturday, that Rose was carrying a knock, that Kane needed a breather, that Dembele is coming off an injury and might have risked rein jury trying to go 90 today and Alli too (suspended of course but would surely have been rested anyway).

He has earned my trust. I was annoyed by subbing Lamela at the weekend, but that is me. Poch still has my trust, and he should have (IMO) both everyone's trust and respect. Not for tonight perhaps, but for the tremendous work he has done and for where we sit right now in the Prem.(for the record I wholly trust him with regards to last night too!)

 

[thfcsteff]

The filth were trying to get Lamela sent off hence the substitution.

Mate.
You must have missed the many posts I made observing that.
In fact, I was livid at Sanchez.
What I said at the time (and what I still believe) is that Lamela has played many games on a yellow for 45 minutes, and I think he was capable of avoiding a second yellow in the pressure cooker. I personally wanted Poch to leave him on another 10-15 minutes as I think he'd have maintained our steam.
I was disappointed in the decision, but again, I trust the manager.

 

[thfcsteff]

Completely agree. Naive decision to not sign another striker. Even someone like Shane Long who isn't overly prolific but works hard would have been better than no one . How many other teams in the league have 1 recognised striker? Serious question.

I have to say, I actually agree with Poch's decision to rest players tonight (although I wouldn't have rested so many). Having said that, playing Chadli out of position up front away to to Borussia Dortmund just won't cut it. If he tries that in the CL next season (assuming we get there) we'll get found out again.

Mate, I agree with that as I've wanted him for about 5 windows now! Perfect squad striker who works his nuts off and has talent.

 

[Pirate55]

This was our watershed moment. We conspicuously failed to grasp the opportunity . Why?

The answer to me at least is simple.

We didn't strengthen in two key positions in January. The two positions where we don't have like for like cover.

CF and DM.

We have no effective cover for Kane or Dier.

As many foretold and warned, we have to effectively rejig our team without them. So it proved against BD. We had no cover for our defense and no spearhead for our attack. We looked impotent in attack and frail in defense which a great BD team ruthlessly exploited to show how thin our squad really is.

Forget talk of the title. If we can get top three that would be a great achievement this season IMO.

 

[NaijaSpurs]

What happens if Kane gets injured?

That is the question you should have asked management when they decided to play a whole season with just a single striker

 

[Spurmac1974]

How many on here do you think would agree with you?

Don't really care, its hard to compare this year when we have seen so little of Bentalab. But going on last year, World Cup etc then Bentalab is far superior. Carroll hasnt done anything this season other than a few decent cameos and been involved in two of our most disappointing defeats of the season(Saudi Sportswashing Machine & Last Night)

 

[NaijaSpurs]

So next Thursday we have to play a full strength team, we need to be relentless. Whatever happens we strive to beat them at the Lane, and if we get knocked out we go out like warriors and are carried out on our shields.

At least let Dortmund know what it is like to play against the Great Tottenham Hotspur