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No Saggy-face thread?!?

glorygloryeze said:
You are partly right that in Neville's time we were utter crap; however, if you look back at our FA Cup semi-final record wee have bottled quite a few imo:

1992/93 - 0-1 loss to Arsenal; coin toss on who would win; we did play well but Arsenal seemed to have more stamina in the latter part of that game
1994/95 - 1-4 loss to Everton; no question we did bottle this one; Everton were way below us in the table at the time and we were clear favourites
1998/99 - 0-2 loss AET; not bottled in or of itself, 50-50 opponent at the time, but a pattern is showing now...
2000/01 - 1-2 loss to Arsenal; we didn't bottle this, we were just lucky that Arsenal didn't have their finishing boots on as it could/should have been a landslide given how much better they were and how much we were dominated
2009/10 - 0-2 loss to Portsmouth AET; absolutely we bottled this. No excuse for losing to that shower who were being relegated
2011/12 - 1-5 loss to Chelsea; we played well, but in the end their superior "game management" and "experience" killed us; despite the shocking decision to give Mata that goal that made it 2-0 the game epitomised Redknapp's in-game management at the sharp end vs the top teams and Chelski were below their usual standards that season...but we know what happened later that season:mad:
2016/17 - 2-4 loss to Chelsea; hmmm, small details...they had re-enforcements on the bench that made a difference; However little details again: Alderwiereld tackle to concede the early free-kick that Willian scored from and did Lloris cover himself in glory in trying to save it? Then Son at LB?? It's the whole game-management at key times that often kills us (why not stay in the game keep it tight and not concede after five bleeping minutes!!)
2017/18 - 1-2 loss to Man Unted; no question we bottled this one after a great start...i'm looking especially at you Mousa Dembele and you Michel Vorm....

So all in all, difficult to totally argue against the 'FA Cup semi-final bottlers tag'...
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Out of those you attribute 3 to bottle so the rest we were beaten by better teams. In the 2-1 against Man United I would say that was a coin toss, game of two halves.

Anyway I still maintain that for the time Nev was playing and all this bottle or soft underbelly is over stated, you could not compare the Spurs teams of the 90s and early 00s to our teams of the 60s so its not like we had great players/teams and rolled over, we were and I maintain this, middle of the road clap trap at times.

Its easy to have a pop at a team like Spurs and talk about the history and compare it like we have comparative sides but in alot of those you mention we were underdogs.
 
scaramanga said:
Precisely this. The team was so short on discipline I don't think many managers could have repaired us the way AVB did. Poch, as perfect for us as he is right now, almost certainly couldn't have.

The fact that it didn't work out over the longer term is partly down to the rigidity upon which he insisted, but also heavily down to us not properly removing all the diseased roots of Redknapp's tenure when we should have. Aspects of that old boys' club still remained and started the rot from the inside again.
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Or despite having Bale dragging us to 5th in AvB’s first season, the longer he exerted his influence the more flawed his tactical approach for this league became. I can accept they had different styles but blaming Redknapp for AVB’s second season yet discredit him for the first doesn’t make sense to me.

If I’m being polite it was always going to be difficult for the manager following Redknapp because he’d recorded two top four finishes and a CL QF in between, it’s much easier to take on a team under achieving and get the time to improve them. Usually that’s what happens but Redknapp wasn’t sacked because of his results.
 
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MKSpur said:
Or despite having Bale dragging us to 5th in AvB’s first season, the longer he exerted his influence the more flawed his tactical approach for this league became. I can accept they had different styles but blaming Redknapp for AVB’s second season yet discredit him for the first doesn’t make sense to me.

If I’m being polite it was always going to be difficult for the manager following Redknapp because he’d recorded two top four finishes and a CL QF in between, it’s much easier to take on a team under achieving and get the time to improve them. Usually that’s what happens but Redknapp wasn’t sacked because of his results.
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I can't believe there is anyone left who actually rates AVB based on his time at Spurs or thinks he's a top manager. I just put it down to some people are impressed by words rather than actions or results. If you were judging him by results then he achieved a par score in his only full season. 5th place and 72 points? Decent but hardly earth shattering. Can anyone honestly say there were 5 better teams than us in the league that season? Not to mention that the famed tactician had no tricks up his sleeve other than 'give the ball to Bale'.

As for Redknapp, he's a short term manager who gets teams out of trouble when they are down the bottom. The fact that Levy hired him just shows how dire a position we were in and there's no question Levy would have recognsied we were in relegation battle otherwise he wouldn't have appointed him. He was probably only brought in the view to get us safe and then bring someone else in for the start of 09/10. He did better than most expected so Levy had no choice but to persist. We all know what happened after that but it's safe to say he would have said or done something sack worthy eventually, even without all the England nonsense that was incredibly unproffesional.

More than anything I'm glad Poch is our manager now as both of the above struggled to break down the smaller clubs, especially at home whereas our record against promoted sides for example under Poch is very impressive. We don't often lose silly home games anymore like we did under Redknapp and to a lesser extent AVB.
 
From the bits I saw of it he did come across well and was quite entertaining. Top, top celeb.
And was like a soppy loved-up teenager when he had the surprise visit from Sandra.

Sure, no doubt he'll make more money from it. But Harry is what Harry does.
 

Redknapp talking total sense, who'd a thought?

Clearly has a soft spot for us which is nice to see, I think his achievements for us are not always given the right level of respect.

I can be as guilty as any one, but fair play to ol 'Arry here.

Edit: That fudge head host who kept bricking on about signings and spending really got on my tits, apologies if anyone ends up with a broken phone, tablet or tv.
 
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nayenezgani said:

Redknapp talking total sense, who'd a thought?

Clearly has a soft spot for us which is nice to see, I think his achievements for us are not always given the right level of respect.

I can be as guilty as any one, but fair play to ol 'Arry here.

Edit: That fudge head host who kept bricking on about signings and spending really got on my tits, apologies if anyone ends up with a broken phone, tablet or tv.
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Noticeable how about half way through, after the ‘wizard of sound bites’ had unloaded another juicy selection and changed the narrative, Hargreaves then started to repeat Harry’s messages! Despite the fact they contradicted what Hargreaves has been trotting out for months.

Poor simple Gabbidon was so Jedi-mind-tricked, that when surprised into speaking and put on the spot, he just dutifully repeated the last words spoken! :D

What is does demonstrate though is how an agenda is so easily driven via the media. Simply say a few easily repeatable messages, get someone to print or replay them, and hey ho - we now have the ‘go to’ comments when anyone is asked about that topic.

Finally, drip feed the party line out through the tabloid media to the mouth breathers, who then feed it back, enraged, into the radio phone ins and via social media...

The circle is complete - the narrative is now simply ‘what the fans are saying’.... and the cycle goes again with added gusto.
 
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