Finney Is Back
Andy Thompson
Are you really getting the hump that Alistair Gold has a lot of followers?
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New New Manager Poll (The Lets Get It Right This Time Edition)
- Thread starter Gutter Boy
- Start date
parklane1
Tony Galvin
No. i could not give a brick about Gold ( and his like who peddle for hits), just amazed that they are so many who believe everything they read and believe it is all kosher.
Finney Is Back
Andy Thompson
How can you know that somebody (other than yourself) believes everything that they read?
parklane1
Tony Galvin
Do you feel/think/know that people do not believe what they read ( especially if it fits their feelings)?
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
If the club appoint him because it will help with quickly easing the toxic atmosphere, then that would be a very short-sighted decision. Because if it goes tits up (and there's no guarantee it won't), the toxic atmosphere will be back. The decision the club makes should not be one that appeases the fans short-term. We tried that with Jose and Conte in the hope it will bring a trophy and the fans will be appeased and that got us to the where we are now. Rather the decision needs to be taken for the right reasons. If Poch satisfies the criteria, great. If not, then we should hire the manager that does. I'd rather a few more months of a toxic atmosphere, but know the club is heading in the right direction, than calming the waters now only to end up in the same place a year from now.
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
The club is not in meltdown. The fans are in meltdown. Those are two different things.
That's the thing, I'm not saying Levy/Paratici/Club will get it right but ..
The fact that they strait up didn't give it to Poch means they are trying to make the right decision (may mean Poch) vs. pacifying the fans/media
And I don't buy the Poch wouldn't have taken it, getting him would probably be a lot less concessions than we gave Conte
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
Poch had 0 experience in the PL when he took over Soton. de Zerbi had 0 experience when Brighton hired him. Jol had 0 experience when we hired him. And there are numerous others. I don't think this is the limiting factor people are making it out to be. It's the intangibles that will make the difference and if he has them, then PL experience be damned.
parklane1
Tony Galvin
This.
And definitely this. If you listen to some of the social media we are doomed, it needs work but the lemmings on social media are hysterical.
Outside of Barcelona fudge all and is why we should steer well clear
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
Different circumstances. Poch came to Spurs on the back of an impressive 2 years at Southampton taking over from Adkins and really pushing Southampton on. Jol had been coach of the year in Holland 2 Seasons in a row which brought him to Arnesen's attention. He also had a lot more managerial experience than Kompany when he was appointed at Spurs. De zerbi has been managing since 2013. Both Jol and De Zerbi came to mid table teams with aspirations to be higher. Whereas Spurs today are different.
Not sure what the intangibles are tbh but for every one you state has been a success, a rather selective list I may add, there are plenty more who have failed at the highest level of PL management where we expect Spurs to be, Juande Ramos, Farke, Lampard, Gerrard to name a few. Relevant experience is not everything but it should still be a consideration. To go from one season in the Championship to a team competing at the top of the PL is a major risk.
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Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
He's the outstanding candidate by miles on all criteria. The one issue is just that Levy would need to admit a mistake, and accept that the last 3.5 years has just been one huge bin fire
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
When I referenced Poch it wasn't when he came to us, but when Soton appointed him. He had 0 PL experience before Soton. And yes, I did highlight the ones that were successful, because the point I was trying to make was that you can be successful as a PL manager, even if you do not have PL experience. And you can be a failure, even if you do have PL experience.
What makes managers good are the tactics they employ, how they adapt the squad to the tactics and the tactics to the squad and the opponent, how well they read the game, as well as some of the things you do not see in the Youtube videos, such as how well they get across to the players, how well they motivate them, what kind of team chemistry they create. Imo, if on top of all these things they also have PL experience, it's a bonus. But it's not a prerequisite.
alekaras
The ITK of IDK
Is he though? Do we know for sure there aren't better managers out there? Do we know that a Slot, or a Kompany, or a Gallardo are inferior, or at a minimum the same level as Poch? As great as Poch was for us at the time, maybe there is someone who currently is better than him. I don't know, but I wouldn't jump at appointing Poch without doing some very thorough due diligence. And if said due diligence points to Poch, then I'd feel more comfortable about appointing him.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
It's important to stress Poch didn't go immediately to a club competing at the top of the PL, he went for a mid-lower table club. It's a completely different job. 1 season in the championship no matter how spectacular, does not prepare you for managing at the top of the PL. I think you should show ability at least at a lower level in the PL before being appointed to a higher job. It's a pretty effective due diligence screen even if it's not 100% accurate.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
Thorough due diligence for the guy who took us to second place and to the Champions League final but just appoint 1 season in the Championship Kompany or achieved nothing of note in Holland yet Arnie Slot? I am not saying Poch is the right man, but that is a somewhat strange argument you are making.
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alekaras
The ITK of IDK
If due diligence stopped at who was the last manager that had a team performing at a high level, you would see a lot of managers being re-appointed by their former teams. I'm not against Poch coming back. I just want the club to reach that conclusion because they thoroughly evaluated all candidates and determined Poch was the best option. The fact he did well with us in the past is but one criterion; it's not the whole evaluation.
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
It is a far more reliable and objective measure than "intangibles" or the latest trendy dutch manager. So @Gutter Boy is right on any objective measure he is ahead of Kompany and Slot. For me only Nagelsmann with his success in Germany may come ahead currently. But then there are question marks over the latter's personality.
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alekaras
The ITK of IDK
Ah see, his "personality." If intangibles don't matter, then why have question marks about Nagelsmann?
And by the way, a club can evaluate the intangibles much more thoroughly than we can. They will conduct numerous interviews with former players, staff, teammates (if manager is an ex-player). Just because we fans don't read about this stuff other than the rare occasion that some journo actually takes the time to write about them, doesn't mean the club doesn't have a way of finding out about them and putting together a detailed profile of the tactical and personality traits of a potential hire.