Moussa Sissoko

[NoLimits01]

Again, judging a player isn't really all that subjective. In terms of rating a player's match performance on a scale, there's obviously a little wiggle room so I could see disagreements about a player deserving a '7' vs. an '8' for example.
What I don't understand here is two-fold:

1) He's one of our players, why would you use him as a punching bag? Is he scoring own-goals on purpose or somehow sabotaging the team performance? (if anyone answers yes, they're a troll)
2) To not appreciate what he brings to the team in terms of his performances this season (and to a lesser extent previous seasons) makes me question whether some of you actually watch the matches.

With all that said, I want to clarify that I don't have any personal problem with anyone here over any disagreement. The whole point of a forum is to discuss and debate. However, I read your comment about accepting other people's views the way anti-vaxers or even flat-earthers might try to appeal to other skeptics. Obviously, that's not a 1:1 analogy since there is more granularity and interpretation involved here... just not on the scale of such divisive, categorical statements.
But hey, that's just my view too.

Err, just a couple of points...

1. Where do I use him as a punching bag?
2. Where do I say I don’t appreciate what he brings to the team?

I’m assuming you have read my post as you have quoted it but your 2 points in your reply baffle me as I don’t understand how you could extrapolate that from what I posted.

I believe in debate and encourage it, but to debate it helps if both parties can respect each other views and not twist or intentionally misconstrued what is said.

And for the record I don’t believe that the earth is flat or that we should not do everything we can to protect our children.

 

[Rorschach]

The new Viera would be a better title. I can see similarities.

 

[Seedy Ron]

The new Viera would be a better title. I can see similarities.

Racist.

 

[Rorschach]

Racist.

I was talking about Jonathan Viera.

 

[glasgowspur]

I was talking about Jonathan Viera.

I thought you meant the tele

 

[Robspur12]

Err, just a couple of points...

1. Where do I use him as a punching bag?
2. Where do I say I don’t appreciate what he brings to the team?

I’m assuming you have read my post as you have quoted it but your 2 points in your reply baffle me as I don’t understand how you could extrapolate that from what I posted.

I believe in debate and encourage it, but to debate it helps if both parties can respect each other views and not twist or intentionally misconstrued what is said.

And for the record I don’t believe that the earth is flat or that we should not do everything we can to protect our children.

Most posters do respect opposing views. I for one enjoy reading them. However when it comes to Sissoko the opposing view has been so extreme, so nasty and based on questionable evidence that it begs a response. Your language and style of posting is unnecessarily confrontational and sarcastic. It’s going to irritate people and not surprisingly posters will argue vehemently against you. You’re probably looking for a rise out of posters which why you adopt this style. Perhaps if you toned down your language and constructively criticised a player rather than just assert he is not “particularly skilful” or if he is praised it’s because we are part of a cult, you may earn a little more respect for your view.

 

[StephenH]

I don't think anyone has claimed he hasn't improved - at least I haven't seen that in this thread. For me, the level of improvement is astonishing.

Problem is, he's come from such a low level that even such a huge improvement leaves him significantly behind the rest of the team in terms of talent. He's still at the very top of the list of players that need replacing and are easiest to replace in the summer, he's still at the bottom of our list of midfielders if everyone's fit (barring Skipp maybe on experience terms).

Good, you agree he’s improved!
Now stop continually slagging him off evertime someone praises him or mentions him on the sight.
You don’t rate him, your privilege and we’ve got it

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

It happens to most fans over the years, i remember sitting in the stands saying Waddle ( when he first came here) was a flash in the pan. He went on to be our best ever flank player ( imo) since then i have tried to keep stum about our new players since then.

I specifically remember calling Kane "a donkey", obviously called that one right...

I remember thinking Routledge was going to be a star and being super excited when we signed him.

I remember thinking O'Hara was the real deal (and I do still love the gonading he was handing out minutes into his debut).

I thought Soldado was going to take us to the next level.

I thought Bentaleb was going to be top class.

I thought Wanyama was going to be rubbish.


Ive made plenty of poor judgements on players. And Ive adjusted every one of them as has been appropriate.

 

[Robspur12]

I specifically remember calling Kane "a donkey", obviously called that one right...

I remember thinking Routledge was going to be a star and being super excited when we signed him.

I remember thinking O'Hara was the real deal (and I do still love the gonad*ing he was handing out minutes into his debut).

I thought Soldado was going to take us to the next level.

I thought Bentaleb was going to be top class.

I thought Wanyama was going to be rubbish.


Ive made plenty of poor judgements on players. And Ive adjusted every one of them as has been appropriate.

Haha good on you mate for admitting to that lot. So it's fair to say you may not be the best judge of a player. Probably like the rest of us.. that why Poch and his team get paid the big bucks and we are confined to rambling on a forum.

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Haha good on you mate for admitting to that lot. So it's fair to say you may not be the best judge of a player. Probably like the rest of us.. that why Poch and his team get paid the big bucks and we are confined to rambling on a forum.

I tend to think people are a good judge of a certain type of player.

I was on board with Carrick and Modric very early on, for example, in the face of a lot of opposition at the time.

I still think Jenas was a very decent player, but whisper it, it'll set people off...

 

[harr1984]

I tend to think people are a good judge of a certain type of player.

I was on board with Carrick and Modric very early on, for example, in the face of a lot of opposition at the time.

I still think Jenas was a very decent player, but whisper it, it'll set people off...

Jenas was a very good player, he had all the attributes - athleticism, technical ability, scorer of goals against Arsenal. I reckon if Poch had taken him under his wing he would have been a star....

 

[thfcsteff]

Responses in bold below

I specifically remember calling Kane "a donkey", obviously called that one right...

My mate still laughs because he got that one wrong. I got it right after one pass he played in Seattle during Poch's first ever game. GHod standard. But never thought he'd be anything more than a good player.

I remember thinking Routledge was going to be a star and being super excited when we signed him.

Me too :-(

I remember thinking O'Hara was the real deal (and I do still love the gonad*ing he was handing out minutes into his debut).

Wanted to believe it, couldn't

I thought Soldado was going to take us to the next level.

Was amazed we bought him TBH, did not see it

I thought Bentaleb was going to be top class.

Oh mate, I thought he'd be our future skipper!!!!!

I thought Wanyama was going to be rubbish.

Was never convinced, one fine season, that's been it really...my biggest recent gaffe has been questioning Eriksen. Talent was never in doubt mental strength was where he was losing me. I remember a couple of seasons ago heading down to Soton for the 4-1 win and on the wayback loudly explaining that unless he could get some mental strength we should look to trade up. I think we can all safely say he has made a upset out of me there!

My biggest initial over-reach was Dele, who I purred on about being world class within 5 mins of his debut or something like that. He sort of is, but I concede that I was OTT at the start!



Ive made plenty of poor judgements on players. And Ive adjusted every one of them as has been appropriate.

 

[stinkfoot]

I specifically remember calling Kane "a donkey", obviously called that one right...

I remember thinking Routledge was going to be a star and being super excited when we signed him.

I remember thinking O'Hara was the real deal (and I do still love the gonad*ing he was handing out minutes into his debut).

I thought Soldado was going to take us to the next level.

I thought Bentaleb was going to be top class.

I thought Wanyama was going to be rubbish.


Ive made plenty of poor judgements on players. And Ive adjusted every one of them as has been appropriate.

When we signed Bentley I was so happy

 

[StephenH]

I specifically remember calling Kane "a donkey", obviously called that one right...

I remember thinking Routledge was going to be a star and being super excited when we signed him.

I remember thinking O'Hara was the real deal (and I do still love the gonad*ing he was handing out minutes into his debut).

I thought Soldado was going to take us to the next level.

I thought Bentaleb was going to be top class.

I thought Wanyama was going to be rubbish.


Now say 10 Hail Marys. @nayimfromthehalfwayline

 

[scaramanga]

Good, you agree he’s improved!
Now stop continually slagging him off evertime someone praises him or mentions him on the sight.
You don’t rate him, your privilege and we’ve got it

I think the criticism is important. This thread and the MOTM votes/nominations both show that fans on this forum, as a whole, rate effort and improvement over base talent and ability.

 

[StephenH]

I think the criticism is important.

No brick Sherlock!

 

[nayimfromthehalfwayline]

Jenas was a very good player, he had all the attributes - athleticism, technical ability, scorer of goals against Arsenal. I reckon if Poch had taken him under his wing he would have been a star....

Jenas under Poch would be something else, IMO. Although I think he is in the main a rather under appreciated player.

My mate still laughs because he got that one wrong. I got it right after one pass he played in Seattle during Poch's first ever game. GHod standard. But never thought he'd be anything more than a good player.

Would be easy for me to say how I always knew etc (not saying you are!), but I just didnt, and I do tend to be honest.

He just looked cumbersome to me, I didnt see any particular quality to him. Didnt even think he looked like a premier league player.



Wanted to believe it, couldn't
Ive always had a thing for Lefties (and Dutch and Argie players!), he was combative, assertive, and had some real ability. I honestly thought we were onto something with him. Then his star faded about as quickly as it rose...


Was amazed we bought him TBH, did not see it
He was a top class striker, one Id always enjoyed, and was convinced he would be a next level player for us. Take the Premiership by storm... I was so happy when we got him.


Was never convinced, one fine season, that's been it really...my biggest recent gaffe has been questioning Eriksen. Talent was never in doubt mental strength was where he was losing me. I remember a couple of seasons ago heading down to Soton for the 4-1 win and on the wayback loudly explaining that unless he could get some mental strength we should look to trade up. I think we can all safely say he has made a upset out of me there!
Have to say I thought Wanyama was a bruiser and no more, but he has a lot more ability than I ever gave him credit
Eriksen? Im not sure you are entirely wrong. His class is never in doubt, nor is his workrate etc - but I do feel he could do more to assert himself and impress himself on games. He does have a knack for rather "quiet" games where we know he could actually be dictating things.


My biggest initial over-reach was Dele, who I purred on about being world class within 5 mins of his debut or something like that. He sort of is, but I concede that I was OTT at the start!
Always loved Alli and I think he just keeps getting better.

When we signed Bentley I was so happy

So was I!

 

[StephenH]

My player recommendations/excitement/flop list.
is too long.

 

[NoLimits01]

Most posters do respect opposing views. I for one enjoy reading them. However when it comes to Sissoko the opposing view has been so extreme, so nasty and based on questionable evidence that it begs a response. Your language and style of posting is unnecessarily confrontational and sarcastic. It’s going to irritate people and not surprisingly posters will argue vehemently against you. You’re probably looking for a rise out of posters which why you adopt this style. Perhaps if you toned down your language and constructively criticised a player rather than just assert he is not “particularly skilful” or if he is praised it’s because we are part of a cult, you may earn a little more respect for your view.

Ok, point made, I'll try and tone down my confrontational and sarcastic way of posting so that the posters on here don't get upset. I do though take umbrage at the accusation that I have been nasty about anyone

Regardless of what you call it there are a core set of posters that vehemently defend him regardless of what is said and in some cases go completely over the top.

For clarity and without prejudice, I think Sissoko has below average footballing skills and match awareness compared to his midfield peers in our current squad but I do think he has above average physical attributes that enable him to perform his current role. I also believe that his particular range of attributes and skills would be better showcased in a team that played to those strengths, maybe in a more counter attacking side rather than a team that like to patiently build up from the back.

Anyway here's a peace offering

enjoy

 

[StephenH]

I also believe that his particular range of attributes and skills would be better showcased in a team that played to those strengths, maybe in a more counter attacking side rather than a team that like to patiently build up from the back.

With our sickbay full and our desperate need for midfield reinforcements, Sissoko is a large dollop of pragmatism.
He's not pretty but he's bloody effective.