Indeed, the treatment of Tim on this board will always baffle me....
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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked
- Thread starter DubaiSpur
- Start date
Indeed, the treatment of Tim on this board will always baffle me....
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
One of the 'excuses' I listed in that post was precisely that: the high wage bill. And of course, it's easy to say with the benefit of knowing our current situation (with one CL campaign to our name) that we couldn't have afforded a squad full of high earners while also spending big on transfers. However, that's a conclusion reached via our current perspective. However, what if we had another couple of CL campaigns under our belt, as seemed eminently possible in both 2011 and 2012 (and perhaps even in 2013)? Wouldn't the revenue streams from those campaigns have covered the transfer spending required to back the manager in charge at the time (Harry) while also allowing for a greater wage bill?
At the time, we held off on spending big in critical windows (the January windows in both 2011 and 2012, for example), when doing so could have secured us the CL campaigns we needed to move up a level in the football world. And, again, there are plenty of excuses available for that behaviour ('not risking our financial stability to chase dreams', not 'doing a Ridsdale', etcetera). But that isn't 'backing' the manager to the point where it destabilized us in later seasons, and it cannot be used as an explanation for our current status, trying forlornly to reach the CL again four-odd years after we started thrilling Europe for what remains our first and only experience of the modern 'big time'.
Harry's high earners could have been supplemented with buys for the future, had we made the CL again. We were agonisingly close to doing so, but in the end were let down by our shortcomings and (Despite the inevitable and righteous blame attached to Redknapp himself in 2012) our thin squad depth. Whether we could have pushed ourselves a little further to secure CL football is the ensuing question that continues to be debated here today, but it shouldn't mask the reality that the statement 'we backed the manager so hard that it's still hurting us' is not just patently false, but also somewhat disingenuous, ascribing a level of investment in the club and backing of our managers to ENIC that has historically never existed and will never exist for the entirety of the remaining time they will spend running this club.
Not getting into all that again, but that implies that we had 'transfer warchests' to begin with that were independent of the motive of ending the windows with a negative net spend. Perhaps that was once the case, but certainly by 2012 that was no longer the reality of the situation.
Yermiyahu
Scott Parker
Ditto.
Gutter Boy
Tim Sherwood
Momentum and strong foundations.
Laudrup road a year on the momentum and foundations of Martinez and Rodgers before the wheels fell off.
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
To people talking about Soton's progress post-Poch; remember that Poch had them in the top 4 early last season as well....
#justsaying
#justsaying
Robspur12
Nick Barmby
Harr1984 and Shelfie, I totally agree with your sentiments about Tim. That said I am a big fan of Poch and he was my first choice to replace Tim. I believe he is a very good coach, but I have been a Spurs fan long enough to know that is not enough, in itself, to succeed at our club. But we need to give him time to implement his system, it really is far too early to start judging him on win ratios.
Oh completely and I'm very happy with Poch at the helm. I am seeing a lot of good signs in our play, just needs to be pieced together but have no doubt that will come with time. I'm enjoying the fact everyone seems to be behind Poch and what he is trying to implement and seems he is going to be given a good amount of time to prove himself by the fans, and as long as we continue to support what he is trying to do I have a sneaky feeling the chairman for once will seek to keep Poch in charge for a good few seasons at least...
Sitting on my porcelain throne using Fapatalk
That's what happened to Leeds, assuming one CL season meant they could increase their wage bill with the CL revenues picking up the extra tab.
NEVER base your guaranteed outgoings anywhere in excess of your guaranteed incomings. If you sign a player on a five year deal you can't put him on wages that assumes anything other than your worst case scenario (no CL, no Europa, knocked out 1st round in all cups) in all 5 years. Anything else is gambling with the club's future. Arsenal qualified for the CL every season but it's the Emirates that's changed the game for them not CL.
The new stadium is what will allow us to spend big not CL
Bedfordspurs
Mark Falco
And both times they have played teams that finished above them last season they have lost IIRC....
People are saying that Pelle has been a great signing and on paper he has but I have to say against us he was invisible... I even questioned whether he was on the pitch. Tadic looks a good player, actually he looks like then player I thought. Chadli was.
They have signed a good keeper in Forster although he looked awful against us
What I haven't seen anyone mention is the lack of their youth players getting games this season... They had one on the Bench against us and yesterday had one on the bench too (harrison Reed)
Even Jack Cork came in from Chelsea...
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
I'm liking how Poch has coached some players t improve so far:
Rose, Kaboul (mostly), Naughton have really upped their games under him. I like the fact that Mason has broken through and that Kane is knocking on the door.
I think some extra pace in the team and his methods would already be even more effective thus far. I do worry about late-season drain due to the high-press, but he has surprised me with the ability to have a change of approach and I hope he can continue to do that.
Rose, Kaboul (mostly), Naughton have really upped their games under him. I like the fact that Mason has broken through and that Kane is knocking on the door.
I think some extra pace in the team and his methods would already be even more effective thus far. I do worry about late-season drain due to the high-press, but he has surprised me with the ability to have a change of approach and I hope he can continue to do that.
Jurgen the German
Erik Thorstvedt
It doesn't baffle, it's fairly obvious why some don't like him. Even when he defends us, case in point yesterday where he slated the ref, barely got a mention in the match thread. I honestly believe him and Redknapp both played for Arsenal and won lots of trophies at some point and I must have been asleep for a few years and missed it, nothing else really explains the constant belittling of them. AVB wasn't liked by many, me included, but it's nowhere near as personal.
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
I think it's to do with being a big gobsh!te; and you know it.
Oh and TS mentioning ref DID get a mention, though how many mentions do you want?
Again if he and Redknapp weren't such gobsh!tes, do you honestly believe they would get such vitriol?
Even those who don't/didn't like AVB would at least say he wasn't an attention-seeking gobsh!te, and that in itself means people like him garner more respect generally than the other two
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
With everybody else rushing to push up their own stadiums while we struggled to go anywhere with our own for all these years, I expect the boost from the new stadium won't be as revolutionary as a lot of people here expect it to be. We will likely end up in about the same position relative to everyone else and all their own shiny new stadiums/stadium expansions (Etihad expansion, new Stamford Bridge, Anfield expansion + already existing Emirates and OT). Not saying it won't lead to increased spending, but a lot of the superiority we would formerly have enjoyed is now dissipating into mild competitive advantages at best and an even playing field with all the others at worst.
As for the initial bit of your post, like I said, the excuses for not spending during that period immediately after CL qualification were many and varied, including the 'Doing a Ridsdale' bit. But just don't try to paint that reality as 'backing a manager so hard that we're suffering for it now': that is patently not the case, and that is giving ENIC undue credit.
glorygloryeze
Tom Huddlestone
I must say I was baffled a little by some of the transfer activity both after we qualified after beating Young Boys FC and in the following January (when we missed out supposedly on Charlie f-ing Adam...afer we apparently tried to throw 30m for various strikers in Spain including Aguero).
Actually what WAS going on with those stories of us trying to buy strikers like Aguero, Rossie etc and offering 30m plus????
THFC6061
Paul Robinson
All the other Spurs managers have records even worse than Mauricio Pochettino's:
Christian Gross Swz 43.59%
George Graham Sco 42.96%
Glenn Hoddle Eng 42.70%
David Pleat Eng 42.42%
Caretaker Managers Eng 41.67%
Jacques Santini Fra 39.39%
Juande Ramos Esp 39.05%
Ossie Ardiles Arg 38.27%
DubaiSpur
Ian Walker
http://www.theguardian.com/football/2011/feb/01/tottenham-hotspur-transfer-deadline-day
The media all carried these stories of us throwing 30 million pound deadline-day bids around for Rossi and Llorente. What's funny is that they seemed to believe that we genuinely were in for those targets, despite (as in the Guardian story above) at the same time being informed in plain English by David Moyes about our insultingly low bids for Phil Neville, and our extreme reluctance to spend more than 500k on the guy.
The media never put two and two together at the time, and neither did we as fans, with most of us genuinely believing that we'd actually made and failed with bids for those strikers. Looking back, it is becoming increasingly clear that we never had any intention of signing any of those big-name strikers for the money that their clubs were asking for: after all, we were extremely reluctant to even sign Phil Neville for more than 500k, and failed with bids for Charlie f-ing Adam. That deadline-day striker chase reeks of a publicity stunt, from start to finish.
"When the 11pm deadline arrived, the manager Harry Redknapp mixed denials with defiance. It felt as though Tottenham had lost ground on their big-spending rivals for a top-four finish and he did acknowledge that
Chelsea had made a "real statement" with their captures of Fernando Torres and David Luiz. But Redknapp tried not to wallow, despite his squad being shorter than the one with which he had entered January."
And statements like that hold a clearer indication of what ended our CL hopes in the years that followed, as opposed to giving the manager 'extreme backing' and then regretting it later.
Mulletperm
Mauricio Taricco
It's cos he had an Arsenal tattoo and didn't talk proper innit.
It wasn't just on this board, the witch hunt against Sherwood was rampant all over the Spurs forums. I think a lot of people didn't like Tim even before he became manager, and they just loved the chance to rip him to shreds.
Fair comments RobSpur, also JTG and thanks for the clarification 6061.
Naturally I hope Poch is a massive success, I want us to be winning things again. But whatever happens on the pitch, you won't catch me abusing Poch, or indeed any of our players, the way many Spurs fans have chosen to do with previous players/managers.
For me, we'll know a lot more re Poch after the next three games.
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metalgear
Luka Modric
also baffling how the club insists on getting rid of them when their stats are pretty decent. maybe its got to do with something beyond the stats....