I think we’ve faced constraints the whole calendar year - the unexpected second season at Wembley, the lack of a single incoming transfer, the loss of Dembele, the likes of Toby and Rose not being fully committed. And maybe Poch was able and willing to bear all of that with a new start in mind just around the corner, but now that new start hasn’t quite been possible (yet) and it’s tinkled him off?
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Mauricio Pochettino - Sacked
- Thread starter DubaiSpur
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I think we’ve faced constraints the whole calendar year - the unexpected second season at Wembley, the lack of a single incoming transfer, the loss of Dembele, the likes of Toby and Rose not being fully committed. And maybe Poch was able and willing to bear all of that with a new start in mind just around the corner, but now that new start hasn’t quite been possible (yet) and it’s tinkled him off?
thfcsteff
George Hunt
It has been a turbulent year to say the least. Wembley was a drag, injuries, more injuries, I still feel what we managed last season was incredible given everything.
I am going to choose the glass half-full approach and say we will be fine. Better to get these signs now than later. Correct and move on. COYS!
Modric THFC
Jimmy McCormick
Spur of the moment
Frederic Kanoute
If ever Mourinho comes in I'd somehow have to find a way to go into hybernation for the duration. If that is even possible.
I just hope and pray that Levy would not even think of going there, if only because he is too tightfisted to allow the Specious One the war chest he would demand.
I just hope and pray that Levy would not even think of going there, if only because he is too tightfisted to allow the Specious One the war chest he would demand.
BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
Makes a lot of sense!
And I wonder if the ‘win and I might leave’ before the CL final didn’t really help matters? Maybe it’s given certain players the excuse to leave?
It’s just so bizarre. I feel like there is something missing. How do we go from that team picture in the Ajax dressing room, Levy involved, everyone looking so happy, to now? What happened? Trippier talking of things behind the scenes. Eriksen creating a weird situation but Poch allowing it to be weird. Rose wanting to leave every chance he gets. Jan on the bench even though Sanchez is making awful errors.
There seems to have been a breakdown somewhere, and I’m not convinced that September 2nd coming round makes everything better. Are players suddenly going to be super committed because they are forced to stay? If Poch is frustrated with them, is he going to forgive them?
It’s a really tough one and it’s going to require a big call if Eriksen remains. If he stays, we have fantastic depth in attacking positions. But if he is causing any issue, it stops us achieving the one thing that made us truly unique compared to other clubs under Poch; unity, a focus on the collective, an unrivalled team spirit. There’s an argument to say that for the sake of team spirit and getting back there, we banish him, and Jan, and Rose, and anyone else that has decided that they don’t want to fully commit here anymore. Promote Parrott, promote Tanganga, use Skipp more. We already aren’t getting any money for Eriksen if he stays, and any benefit we get for having him as depth may be offset by having him around the squad bringing this ‘uncertainty’.
It may come back to Poch needing younger players to work with his methods, or it could be seen as one of the biggest leadership calls of all time. It also makes me think of Poch saying something along the lines of ‘we need to move on players who we love’ and this may make some of them feel like there’s no loyalty from the club so they have to do what they can themselves. Maybe he is too honest!
He is also prone to a strop if you remember back to Brave New World. When we lost the game at West Ham if admitted to being aloof with the squad over the next week and they thought he may leave to go to Inter Milan. At that point, they clearly hoped that he wouldn’t go.
Maybe there’s an argument to say some of these motivational tactics are wearing thin? Maybe we need more of a refresh and have been hamstrung by not being able to move players on. (Which is as much their fault in having high opinions of themselves - they no longer want Spurs but can’t find anything better!)
I dunno, this may all be a big over reaction to a very turgid performance, but I those days were behind us. Have we been figured out? Does the success of the system really require literally all players to be so ‘locked in’?
mudshark
Chris Armstrong
I guess we'll never really know the ins and outs unless he decides to plagiarise another Aldous Huxley title. Something's not right though, and it's almost certainly a combination of things. Lack of enthusiasm from senior players sick of Brexit Britain and seeking pastures new; an after-the-Lord-Mayor's-show feeling hanging round the place like a bad smell after the CL final loss; the gloss wearing off the new stadium a bit (the atmosphere and acoustics aren't that great, despite the hype); a "Christ, not this shít again" mood in training sessions; players just bored with seeing one another's faces every day... Who knows? Que sera sera.
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BrainOfLevy
Michael Carrick
Henry Winter has just made a good point in a Times article, which basically reflects a lot of what we are saying in this thread. That he is allowing the ‘cool breeze blowing through the transfer window to turn into a hurricane’.
I guess for Poch, a lack of commitment really is difficult to handle. And maybe when he gets things back his way, he’ll know what to do. But the idea of the transfer window shutting and everything being ok doesn’t make sense to me. He is saying that the team unity is nowhere near what we expect. This is Poch-Spurs, where unity was everything!! How has that gone so wrong?
It’s clearly why Poch never really suited Real, he knew it and lots of us knew it. At top clubs you have to deal with players forcing moves. You have to deal with players being there for the money, or because the potential for the commercial tie ups are just so great. You can’t expect them all to be relentlessly focussed on improvement and the greater good. But the flip side is, the players at top clubs desperately want to win, and they don’t care how they do it a lot of the time.
It will be interesting, and a measure of how great he truly is, if he can get us through this season again with progress, by adapting himself again. For what he has done to keep us in the CL with Wembley, the injuries last season, everything, he is already great. And he has already adapted a lot. And in that adaptation we’ve lost a bit of what we had. A bit of the spirit. A bit of the pressing. A bit of the tempo. But this time he is going to have to adapt to signing big name players who may not speak English yet and struggle to contribute to the team culture. He may have to deal with a top player running his contract out and not view him as an enemy.
If he can pull that off, and keep evolving as we have evolved, he would be one of the best the game has seen. As it is, he has already done more for us than most men ever will.
I guess for Poch, a lack of commitment really is difficult to handle. And maybe when he gets things back his way, he’ll know what to do. But the idea of the transfer window shutting and everything being ok doesn’t make sense to me. He is saying that the team unity is nowhere near what we expect. This is Poch-Spurs, where unity was everything!! How has that gone so wrong?
It’s clearly why Poch never really suited Real, he knew it and lots of us knew it. At top clubs you have to deal with players forcing moves. You have to deal with players being there for the money, or because the potential for the commercial tie ups are just so great. You can’t expect them all to be relentlessly focussed on improvement and the greater good. But the flip side is, the players at top clubs desperately want to win, and they don’t care how they do it a lot of the time.
It will be interesting, and a measure of how great he truly is, if he can get us through this season again with progress, by adapting himself again. For what he has done to keep us in the CL with Wembley, the injuries last season, everything, he is already great. And he has already adapted a lot. And in that adaptation we’ve lost a bit of what we had. A bit of the spirit. A bit of the pressing. A bit of the tempo. But this time he is going to have to adapt to signing big name players who may not speak English yet and struggle to contribute to the team culture. He may have to deal with a top player running his contract out and not view him as an enemy.
If he can pull that off, and keep evolving as we have evolved, he would be one of the best the game has seen. As it is, he has already done more for us than most men ever will.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
Interesting story breaking in The Guardian which might go some way to explaining a few things...Levy and Eriksen’s agent have “fallen out” reportedly. If this is true (and who knows who has broken that story) then no wonder Poch is angry...
...at the same time, we cannot allow ourselves to be consumed by that, and have to move on, with or without him!!!
But at least we see a specific reference. I am intrigued to know who leaked that detail...
...at the same time, we cannot allow ourselves to be consumed by that, and have to move on, with or without him!!!
But at least we see a specific reference. I am intrigued to know who leaked that detail...
Modric THFC
Jimmy McCormick
But he's the guy that said multiple times he might leave if Spurs won the Champions League.
Tbh from reading Poch's book it's pointless to ascribe any logic to what he is thinking.
The guy I thought was pretty sensible has a lot of weird ideas and ways of thinking about things.
Things might feel unsettled to him simply due the bad crop of lemons he currently has.
IF true then I’m sorry but this comes back to Nayims point that it is very much on Poch. How on earth could he let a fall out between an agent and chairman filter to performances onto the pitch?! Chairman and agents have these sort of issues all the time, we’ve had Bale and Modric leaving the club and being just fine and even in a better position than before. So why on earth he’s managed to turn Eriksens transfer saga into some sort of soap opera I don’t know.
Regardless there has to be more issues than just the Eriksen situation. I can’t believe that horrible performance, and our performance levels for some time are down to that...
The thing I really can't get my head around is how he's using Eriksen.
If he's dropped for contract stuff or because his head's not in it, then he's dropped. Leave him out of the squad, fine by me. It's clearly needed to ensure others are fully committed. Results may suffer, but greater good and all that.
If he's not, then play him FFS.
If he's dropped for contract stuff or because his head's not in it, then he's dropped. Leave him out of the squad, fine by me. It's clearly needed to ensure others are fully committed. Results may suffer, but greater good and all that.
If he's not, then play him FFS.
thfcsteff
George Hunt
thfcsteff
George Hunt
My own personal feeling is that he is currently upset. About what we cannot be sure. But he has set the club up to run off his reverberative energy. This has been hugely positive and moral building for some time, thus the unity. We might now be suffering the other side of that coin, with his glumness hanging over the club noxiously. He has set the club up like this, thus he must accept the pressure when his vibes are "down" and the playing staff follows.
Let's hope it does not last.
Mikey10
Jimmy Neighbour
Excellent post.
Spur of the moment
Frederic Kanoute
Way to much groping around in the dark going on here. All kinds of catastrophe theories gaining traction when none of us REALLY know what is going on.
Maybe there is a very simple explanation that we are not privy to. Maybe it's just a case of riding through this dodgy spell and getting back on an even keel.
Remember how after losing three on the trot to Liverpool, Watford and Inter last season we went on a run of 16 wins, 3 draws and just 3 defeats from our next 22 games in all competitions up to Boxing Day?
So much can turn on one game, so let's not chuck our toys out the pram just yet.
As the great Jimmy Greaves once said, football is a funny old game.
Keep the faith.
Maybe there is a very simple explanation that we are not privy to. Maybe it's just a case of riding through this dodgy spell and getting back on an even keel.
Remember how after losing three on the trot to Liverpool, Watford and Inter last season we went on a run of 16 wins, 3 draws and just 3 defeats from our next 22 games in all competitions up to Boxing Day?
So much can turn on one game, so let's not chuck our toys out the pram just yet.
As the great Jimmy Greaves once said, football is a funny old game.
Keep the faith.
nayimfromthehalfwayline
Andy Thompson
Indeed. Its like things went sour after the season started.
I dont mind the Villa game, I think how poor it was is overstated. It was a banana skin all day long, a sucker punch, but ultimately a deserved result.
City I thought we played ok. Not great, there was a sense of being in awe of them, but we didnt play badly and got a good result.
Saudi Sportswashing Machine is the real fly in the ointment. And its a performance that stems from Poch IMHO.
Genuinely I could never support another team, but Id certainly forget about Spurs for a while and follow someone like Brentford for a few seasons.
I pretty much gave up on football through the Gooner Graham years.