Levy's Plan

[MartyFunkhouser]

I don’t think the manager thinks he has started the season a striker down. He has Marmoush and Solanke and no European football. I suspect he is absolutely fine with having 2 players for that position until January, wouldn’t he have put Richarlison in the squad otherwise?

If thats the case then then we are in massive trouble with this bloke, banking on Solanke who has missed 45 games in 2 seasons

Back to Van Hecke. Let’s picture the scene…. Spurs are staring relegation in the face and trying to get De Zerbi in to save them…

De Zerbi: “I’m not sure, Spurs have a terrible history of not backing their managers and then sacking them as soon as things take a try en for the worse, even if they over achieved for a good while before that”

Spurs: “We’re different now. We’re serious about wanting to improve and win and prepared to invest to do so”

De Zerbi: “I will need a lot of changes in the summer window, I need you to sell the players not bought in to my vision and do so quickly, I need some specific players in for my style of football”

Spurs: “Of course, please just save us” and you’ll get the players you want, we’re different now”

De Zerbi (having kept Spurs up comes back after a short summer break): “OK Romero wants out, I’m fine for him to go he was a bad influence with his disciplinary issues and constant being late for training, I want Van Hecke from Brighton, he is what I need for my vertical passing system”

Spurs; “No, you can’t have him, you’ll have to use Vuskovic”

Basically Spurs under Levy for 25 years.

I think the pulitzer is safe for another year

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

Sorry, perhaps I wasn’t clear enough, but we didn’t do both under Levy in the same campaign. I wouldn’t argue that we didn’t turn up in the finals, but I also think the squad wasn’t as deep as it needed to be. We had an excellent starting XI, but there were still clear holes in the squad.

“Ridsdale proportions of self-destruction” and “intentional sabotaging” . Would those posters genuinely have preferred us not to sign anyone for two consecutive transfer windows? I’m not sure what alternative they think would have been preferable.

We still should have walked through the door and won more, players often never turned up as they did week to week. A team that finishes 3rd, 2nd, 3rd should have enough about it to win games on any given day, including big Semi Finals and Finals.

I haven't see the Risdale comment, but the sabotaging comment as far as I can see (I had to search for it) was in the context of the decisions that have been made, not the fact that people are scared of spending money.

 

[Muttley]

We still should have walked through the door and won more, players often never turned up as they did week to week. A team that finishes 3rd, 2nd, 3rd should have enough about it to win games on any given day, including big Semi Finals and Finals.

I haven't see the Risdale comment, but the sabotaging comment as far as I can see (I had to search for it) was in the context of the decisions that have been made, not the fact that people are scared of spending money.

What you talk about is certainly an accusation that has been made about players like Kane to be fair. I'm sure other players fit into that category when wearing our shirts.

Then there is luck. When Dier hits the upright against Utd in the semi-final, those can easily go in. The keeper wasn't saving it. Saying that, we walk that game if Anthony Taylor just does his job correctly with Antonio Valencia. Even Taylor couldn't have cheated in that way with VAR.

I would think statistically there is more chance of us winning something rather than not during those key years. It just didn't happen.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

What you talk about is certainly an accusation that has been made about players like Kane to be fair. I'm sure other players fit into that category when wearing our shirts.

Then there is luck. When Dier hits the upright against Utd in the semi-final, those can easily go in. The keeper wasn't saving it. Saying that, we walk that game if Anthony Taylor just does his job correctly with Antonio Valencia. Even Taylor couldn't have cheated in that way with VAR.

I would think statistically there is more chance of us winning something rather than not during those key years. It just didn't happen.

Unless its Man United v Millwall then most finals, especially when you are doing as well as we were are coin flips. People make out like we were Southend United, we had the meanest defence in the country and one of the most generational double acts in Son and Kane. The idea we were unable to win anything because of the owners is ridiculous. Even more so now we know that some of our conquerors were cheating

 

[Muttley]

Unless its Man United v Millwall then most finals, especially when you are doing as well as we were are coin flips. People make out like we were Southend United, we had the meanest defence in the country and one of the most generational double acts in Son and Kane. The idea we were unable to win anything because of the owners is ridiculous. Even more so now we know that some of our conquerors were cheating

We didn't win anything because of the owners is clearly a wrong statement. Our owners didn't deserve to win anything is probably a better one.

Let's face it, if you asked a neutral who they would have preferred to win a cup, they would say Dave Whelan over Daniel Levy every day of the week.

 

[MartyFunkhouser]

We didn't win anything because of the owners is clearly a wrong statement. Our owners didn't deserve to win anything is probably a better one.

Let's face it, if you asked a neutral who they would have preferred to win a cup, they would say Dave Whelan over Daniel Levy every day of the week.

Yeh nothing to do with the players or managers or two clubs who historically cheated over 15 years and won 40 odd domestic trophies at the expense of others.

I couldn't give a rats what neutrals say about us TBH, I would expect them to have the same reaction to other clubs because if they had a choice over their rivals

Come on now

 

[Muttley]

Yeh nothing to do with the players or managers or two clubs who historically cheated over 15 years and won 40 odd domestic trophies at the expense of others.

I couldn't give a rats what neutrals say about us TBH, I would expect them to have the same reaction to other clubs because if they had a choice over their rivals

Come on now

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jumplist/pokalhistorie/verein/148

The sad thing is that even if all of those cups were wiped from the 2 clubs we would only end up with a couple as losing finalist. We may have a case to say that because we lost to them in the semi-final then our name would have been on the cup I guess.

What is more the case is how many 3rd-6th round knockouts we've had this millennium especially in the FA Cup.

We don't really have a case for too many of those 40 odd domestic cups looking at it this way. There is probably some logic that missing out on CL to the cheats would have have meant better cashflow. Who knows how that would rewritten history.

 

[Raziel]

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/jumplist/pokalhistorie/verein/148

The sad thing is that even if all of those cups were wiped from the 2 clubs we would only end up with a couple as losing finalist. We may have a case to say that because we lost to them in the semi-final then our name would have been on the cup I guess.

What is more the case is how many 3rd-6th round knockouts we've had this millennium especially in the FA Cup.

We don't really have a case for too many of those 40 odd domestic cups looking at it this way. There is probably some logic that missing out on CL to the cheats would have have meant better cashflow. Who knows how that would rewritten history.

It's way more complicated (as you hint at in last line)

It's 3 trophies (2 cup finals and a 2nd place) instantly
Quick AI check says between 2012 and 2024 if you removed City/Chelsea, we would have 5 more CL participations by league place alone.

That's massive, real, immediate implications.

Then add

- QF/SF knockouts that could have gone on to wins
- Players like Walker not leaving
- Players we could have attracted without that competition
- The sheer momentum the club would have had with those wins, extra cash, better feeling around the club.

Huge argument to say Spurs is one of the most negatively impacted clubs of this ..

 

[SissokoWasGood (BoL)]

It's way more complicated (as you hint at in last line)

It's 3 trophies (2 cup finals and a 2nd place) instantly
Quick AI check says between 2012 and 2024 if you removed City/Chelsea, we would have 5 more CL participations by league place alone.

That's massive, real, immediate implications.

Then add

- QF/SF knockouts that could have gone on to wins
- Players like Walker not leaving
- Players we could have attracted without that competition
- The sheer momentum the club would have had with those wins, extra cash, better feeling around the club.

Huge argument to say Spurs is one of the most negatively impacted clubs of this ..

One of the great things about Levy was his morality, his heart, his belief in doing the right thing and the right long term thing.

I also think he and Spurs should be held up as a shining example anytime City fans complain of FFP being ‘the red cartel’ (and with how Villa and Villa fans complain about it for that matter).

We could have tried to skirt the rules. We could have said it was unfair because WE had objectives to meet and didn’t have time to waste. But instead we build the infrastructure to allow us to be sustainable in a world where sustainability matters. It is like the one thing City fans cling on to, almost that they had no other choice to cheat if they were going to compete, but Spurs stands up as an example of that simply isn’t true. It may have taken them longer, it may have taken some hard seasons and being the target of hilarious banter about not winning trophies, but we showed we could compete in the market for top players without cheating.

That is to Levy’s massive credit, and in that sense it’s a damn shame that he didn’t have a handful more trophies to show for it. I agree with a comment I saw saying that the press and the pundit class are complicit in this to some degree too, because so often City and Chelsea have been lionised while Spurs were ridiculed. They should reflect on that now.

 

[Muttley]

It's way more complicated (as you hint at in last line)

It's 3 trophies (2 cup finals and a 2nd place) instantly
Quick AI check says between 2012 and 2024 if you removed City/Chelsea, we would have 5 more CL participations by league place alone.

That's massive, real, immediate implications.

Then add

- QF/SF knockouts that could have gone on to wins
- Players like Walker not leaving
- Players we could have attracted without that competition
- The sheer momentum the club would have had with those wins, extra cash, better feeling around the club.

Huge argument to say Spurs is one of the most negatively impacted clubs of this ..

Thanks, I was obviously too lazy to do some proper research

I'm gonna settle on an extra 5 trophies evenly spaced between 2008 and 2026. Obviously, when the year ends in 1 we would have definitely won those 2 FA Cups. That's the rules.

 

[harr1984]

It's way more complicated (as you hint at in last line)

It's 3 trophies (2 cup finals and a 2nd place) instantly
Quick AI check says between 2012 and 2024 if you removed City/Chelsea, we would have 5 more CL participations by league place alone.

That's massive, real, immediate implications.

Then add

- QF/SF knockouts that could have gone on to wins
- Players like Walker not leaving
- Players we could have attracted without that competition
- The sheer momentum the club would have had with those wins, extra cash, better feeling around the club.

Huge argument to say Spurs is one of the most negatively impacted clubs of this ..

I agree with a lot of sentiment but there is nothing to say we would have had any more trophies. Spurs always suffered mentally in getting over the line to win, and it wasn't specifically against City who we have a good record against in recent years compared to other big teams.

If Emirates Marketing Project for example didn't get to the final of the League cup against us in 2021, they beat Arsenal and Manchester United in the quarter and semi finals and we would have faced one of those in the final. I don't see it as anymore likely we would have beaten either of them - maybe we would have who knows, but saying we would have had this trophy or that trophy were it not for Emirates Marketing Project is just not true....

 

[billyiddo]

Without City and Chelsea being sportwashing enterprises the landscape changes - we qualify for the CL sooner/more often which in turn gives us a better shot at establishing ourselves and competing for not only the trophies directly won by those two but everything else that was up for grabs in those years.

You can't guarantee anything but i know that being in competition with only 3 clubs richer than you puts you in a better position than if there are 5.