Harry Kane MBE

[Grays_1890]

Some excellent points there. Nevertheless we are still lagging behind City in the spending league table. Over the past decade they have spent roughly twice as much as us and have basically two first team squads.

But like you say, one way or another we are likely going to struggle to match the Big Five Spenders. By the end of the decade their stadiums will all either match or exceed our capacity. On top of that they are able to legitimately monetise their substantially larger fanbases through shirt sales and the like. Hence, even if Enic sells to an Arab state, the playing field may remain uneven for some time to come

Social Media Football League Table

Combined total followers on Facebook, TikTok and Twitter (as at 25/02/2023)

Man U 150m
Chelsea 100m
Liverpool 92.4m
Man C 80.4m
Arsenal 76m
Tottenham 41.7m​

https://www.olbg.com/blogs/social-football-league

Equally none of those clubs host NFL, concerts (as many as us), rugby finals nor have the f1 Partnership which will all mean more money towards the squad, if the new rules mean anything, by the time they take shape in the league, say 5 years, we will probably be the 2nd highest revenue makers behind United in terms of legitimate means of income.

 

[DubSpur]

Some excellent points there. Nevertheless we are still lagging behind City in the spending league table. Over the past decade they have spent roughly twice as much as us and have basically two first team squads.

But like you say, one way or another we are likely going to struggle to match the Big Five Spenders. By the end of the decade their stadiums will all either match or exceed our capacity. On top of that they are able to legitimately monetise their substantially larger fanbases through shirt sales and the like. Hence, even if Enic sells to an Arab state, the playing field may remain uneven for some time to come

Wrong, we are matching the big five spenders since the stadium opened:



Chelsea's spending in the last two windows distorts things a good bit.

You really need to stop bringing in spending from prior to the stadium opening as we are now in a totally different phase.

 

[Grays_1890]

It's not just Conte's tactics. We have been fielding weaker squads in the cups for decades!

Not in the 10+ finals and semi finals we have played in and lost we haven't, so how can anyone rationalise the failure with prioroties? We beat Palace in the league with a weak team 4-0, we lost to Wolves with a full strength team....maybe its just football?

 

[DubSpur]

It's not just Conte's tactics. We have been fielding weaker squads in the cups for decades!

Yes, because we never had the squad depth that Conte has.

 

[Lilbaz]

Some excellent points there. Nevertheless we are still lagging behind City in the spending league table. Over the past decade they have spent roughly twice as much as us and have basically two first team squads.

But like you say, one way or another we are likely going to struggle to match the Big Five Spenders. By the end of the decade their stadiums will all either match or exceed our capacity. On top of that they are able to legitimately monetise their substantially larger fanbases through shirt sales and the like. Hence, even if Enic sells to an Arab state, the playing field may remain uneven for some time to come

Social Media Football League Table

Combined total followers on Facebook, TikTok and Twitter (as at 25/02/2023)

Man U 150m
Chelsea 100m
Liverpool 92.4m
Man C 80.4m
Arsenal 76m
Tottenham 41.7m​

https://www.olbg.com/blogs/social-football-league

And how many of them are bots? I can buy a hundred thousand followers on the net. There are websites that sell them.

 

[Grays_1890]

Yes, because we never had the squad depth that Conte has.

Ironically those that screamed about adding depth then scream when we use that depth, I mean I get we have not won much in 20 years, but the constant moving of goalposts down the field to prove that point are somewhat laughable. As I have said we have played full strength sides in many cup ties when we have been dinged out, once you say that then the posts move and its about the so called "cup losers mentality" we breed.

People also like to overlook the times we have had to change because of injuries, but such is the nature of the modern supporter, people want it all ways I suppose

 

[Grays_1890]

And how many of them are bots? I can buy a hundred thousand followers on the net. There are websites that sell them.

There is some macaron called HazSpurs who purchased 20k of them, claimed they were natural and when you went and looked they were all eastern European sex bots

 

[Spur of the moment]

Not in the 10+ finals and semi finals we have played in and lost we haven't, so how can anyone rationalise the failure with prioroties? We beat Palace in the league with a weak team 4-0, we lost to Wolves with a full strength team....maybe its just football?

No, you're dead right, we field our strongest squads in the SFs and finals. Whilst you are always going to get the odd outlier like Portsmouth (and that disgraceful Wembley pitch), generally it's at this stage we come up against the big boys and fall short.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Wrong, we are matching the big five spenders since the stadium opened:

View attachment 15240

Sigh. As I have been trying to illustrate, those other clubs were mere;ly adding to stronger squads. We on the other hand had a lot of catching up to do following our two blank windows prior to Poch's departure. As much as we try to catch up they are able to stay ahead by matching our expendituren because of greater investment over the longer term.

 

[Grays_1890]

No, you're dead right, we field our strongest squads in the SFs and finals. Whilst you are always going to get the odd outlier like Portsmouth (and that disgraceful Wembley pitch), generally it's at this stage we come up against the big boys and fall short.

Unfortunately we have also played full strength sides in previous rounds in many a year and lost to what we would perceive lesser sides. Knocked out to Norwich and Everton in recent years with full strength sides, last year unfortunately we were beaten by a better Chelsea and Boro playing this side:



I mean we all want someone to blame, but not sure getting to so many SF and Finals and losing them and also getting dinged out with strong sides really reflects a lack of priorities towards cups.

Anyway its been done to death on other threads

 

[Spur of the moment]

Equally none of those clubs host NFL, concerts (as many as us), rugby finals nor have the f1 Partnership which will all mean more money towards the squad, if the new rules mean anything, by the time they take shape in the league, say 5 years, we will probably be the 2nd highest revenue makers behind United in terms of legitimate means of income.

Whilst it's certainly looking more promising on that front, I'm still not sure it will be enough to close the gap. The really big money is in broadcasting, commercial and sponsorship on top of regularly qualifying for the CL.

But even more important is to somehow find a way of winning one or more of the biggest trophies, ie CL and/or PL. That would help open the door not only to significantly increased income but also to attracting the world's top players.

Problem is it's a case of chicken and egg.

 

[Spur of the moment]

Unfortunately we have also played full strength sides in previous rounds in many a year and lost to what we would perceive lesser sides. Knocked out to Norwich and Everton in recent years with full strength sides, last year unfortunately we were beaten by a better Chelsea and Boro playing this side:

View attachment 15242

I mean we all want someone to blame, but not sure getting to so many SF and Finals and losing them and also getting dinged out with strong sides really reflects a lack of priorities towards cups.

Anyway its been done to death on other threads

Of course you will always be able to find exceptions, but how else do you explain why we have failed to win a single trophy since 2008?

 

[DubSpur]

Sigh. As I have been trying to illustrate, those other clubs were mere;ly adding to stronger squads. We on the other hand had a lot of catching up to do following our two blank windows prior to Poch's departure. As much as we try to catch up they are able to stay ahead by matching our expendituren because of greater investment over the longer term.

So when does their starting with a better squad no longer matter? 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? Utd started with a better squad than City 15 years ago
and have matched their spending, what's the excuse there?
We just need to improve our transfers and have no more Ndombeles and we'll close the gap if we continue to spend at the rate we are since the stadium opened.

 

[Grays_1890]

Of course you will always be able to find exceptions, but how else do you explain why we have failed to win a single trophy since 2008?

Well I have explained that on the other thread, we have been knocked out of umpteen SFs and Finals in that time, we have been knocked out by less clubs fielding better sides. Infact our record of going out to small sides fielding weak sides is actually lower than the sceptics would have you believe.

I tell you how I explain it, as I did the other day, its absolutely no different to why we lose 1 in 3 league games, how we lose to Wolves away and get thumped by Leicester in the league despite it it being a so called priority or fielding a strong side? Its called football, other sides are not just there to have their bellies tickled and roll over.

Edit - I have gone through our FA Cup record in the last 20 years and the last game against Sheff United is the most changes we made in any round. In fact we went out every time to either a team better than us or worse fielding an at the time full strength side.

The EFL again this season against Forest looks weakest we have fielded and we have been to 5 finals, won one and three semi finals in 20 years

So the idea we have gone out of cups and trophies because of priority lead changes is the exception not the rule

 

[Finney Is Back]

And how many of them are bots? I can buy a hundred thousand followers on the net. There are websites that sell them.

Very few I'd imagine.... that's about what I would expect in terms of relative supporter numbers.

 

[Finney Is Back]

Unfortunately we have also played full strength sides in previous rounds in many a year and lost to what we would perceive lesser sides. Knocked out to Norwich and Everton in recent years with full strength sides, last year unfortunately we were beaten by a better Chelsea and Boro playing this side:

View attachment 15242

I mean we all want someone to blame, but not sure getting to so many SF and Finals and losing them and also getting dinged out with strong sides really reflects a lack of priorities towards cups.

Anyway its been done to death on other threads

It's good that last season we played our strongest possible team to give ourselves the best chance of winning the game. I wished that we had done the same this season.

 

[Finney Is Back]

So when does their starting with a better squad no longer matter? 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? Utd started with a better squad than City 15 years ago
and have matched their spending, what's the excuse there?
We just need to improve our transfers and have no more Ndombeles and we'll close the gap if we continue to spend at the rate we are since the stadium opened.

The thing is that we will absolutely have more NDombele's if we keep lurching from one style of manager to another. The style of football that Pochettino signed players to try to implement was probably as different as can be in football from the style that Mourinho wanted.

 

[DubSpur]

The thing is that we will absolutely have more NDombele's if we keep lurching from one style of manager to another. The style of football that Pochettino signed players to try to implement was probably as different as can be in football from the style that Mourinho wanted.

NDombele isn't good enough (talent wise he is, work rate he isn't) for the premier league no matter what the style of football.
But agree we need a more consistent style between managers, but saying that, it doesn't hamper Chelsea and if the players are good enough they should be flexible enough to play in different styles bar one or two positions.

 

[Finney Is Back]

NDombele isn't good enough (talent wise he is, work rate he isn't) for the premier league no matter what the style of football.
But agree we need a more consistent style between managers, but saying that, it doesn't hamper Chelsea and if the players are good enough they should be flexible enough to play in different styles bar one or two positions.

I disagree somewhat. I think if we'd asked Ndombele to do what he is good at then he could easily have been a really good premier league player. I thought he actually started well under Pochettino but he was always going to be a fish out of water in Mourinho's low block system. Part of the problem was that he was often forced to pick the ball up deep, which meant the opposition could just continually foul him until he didn't fancy it anymore, whereas in a front foot team, playing predominantly in the opposition's half teams wouldn't have been able to get away with fouling him so often.

It doesn't hamper Chelsea as much because they will typically just go out and buy a bunch of new players for their new manager every time, whereas our managers are made to work with a lot more of the previous manager's players. Chelsea have also had a hell of a lot more come through their youth academy for a good while now.

 

[Grays_1890]

I disagree somewhat. I think if we'd asked Ndombele to do what he is good at then he could easily have been a really good premier league player. I thought he actually started well under Pochettino but he was always going to be a fish out of water in Mourinho's low block system. Part of the problem was that he was often forced to pick the ball up deep, which meant the opposition could just continually foul him until he didn't fancy it anymore, whereas in a front foot team, playing predominantly in the opposition's half teams wouldn't have been able to get away with fouling him so often.

It doesn't hamper Chelsea as much because they will typically just go out and buy a bunch of new players for their new manager every time, whereas our managers are made to work with a lot more of the previous manager's players. Chelsea have also had a hell of a lot more come through their youth academy for a good while now.

The issue with Ndombele is the same he has now, he hardly suits any modern style as he is just not fit enough, ever.

High press, low block, counter attack all require high energy, he arguably failed at all three